Topic: CVP 900 series, detail differences from the 800 series

[Kenneve]

Hi guys
Have been looking at p/x my CVP805 for a CVP905 and need to know the detail technical differences between the two models.

Now I know that there is a significant difference with the piano voices and the use of the pedals, but cannot find out whether there is any difference/improvement in the hundreds of other voices listed, or indeed if there are any new features included.

Obviously the brochure lists all these details, but not whether they are improvements/different/additions to the previous model.

Basically, is it worthwhile changing to the new model?

[rodrigo.b]

I am a 809 user and I don’t see any difference between this two models. If you need a better piano sound, maybe you can buy a VST instrument.

[sorenweiss]

In May I was considering purchasing either the CVP-809GP or the CVP-909GP. Normally I buy the latest model in all electronics (computers, phones, tablets etc) whenever possible.

I was terrified of missing out on something important if choosing the CVP809GP. But at the same time there was a significant discount by choosing the CVP-809-GP.

I went to the local music store to test both instruments and I made the decision to go for the CVP-809GP.

I made this video a few day ago comparing the two instrument: https://youtu.be/ZOhUuvdQMYs

Good luck in choosing the right decision for you ;-)

[Whitecolin11]

you mention the 809 is discounted by how much against the 900

[mikf]

Not surprising. My experience is that piano voices in particular are pretty good on most models even the 2nd and 3rd level arrangers or electronic piano models and have been for years. Differences are either negligible or a matter of opinion. I have seen people say some  VSTs are in a different league, but I disagree with this as well. The difference is becoming so small most people would never notice.
I keep saying it but keyboard quality is much more important, almost every piano player can instantly pick out better keyboard feel. Then playing quality trumps everything a million percent, everyone can hear that. BTW - I did the same thing when I bought the CVP705, spent ages in the showroom doing exactly what Soren did with the 805 and couldn’t pick out a difference.
By my recollection the price difference was about $1500, maybe more. But it wasn’t all discount, because the 805 had a price increase over the 705. But then they discounted the 705 as well. So difference was big.
Mike

[rodrigo.b]

I am not an expert but I can hear for example the mechanical noises of the piano on some VST instruments but I don’t hear that on my CVP when I play a track that I made with it. Also the VST pianos are more versatile, because they usually record the piano with more microphones and you have a lot of presets to choose from.

[mikf]

Rodrigo
Do you really want to hear the mechanical noises of the piano?? Piano manufacturers go to some trouble  to keep that as quiet as possible. I don’t think it adds anything to the music.
I don’t disagree that it’s possible to hear differences on side by side comparisons of piano samples, VST and others. But there are also differences between real pianos side by side. Even sometimes those ostensibly the same model from the same manufacturer. But that’s not important, the only thing that really matters is whether the piano voice quality distracts an average listener from enjoying the music, and that is seldom the case with these better electronic pianos.
Mike

[BogdanH]

...
Do you really want to hear the mechanical noises of the piano??...

-speaking for me: absolutely not. In ideal case, only strings (+body acoustic) should exist in sound. Microphone(s) are relatively close to piano at recording the samples and so it's impossible to eliminate mechanical noise if piano makes it.

...Piano manufacturers go to some trouble  to keep that as quiet as possible...

True -I think that's one of parameters that define the quality of the instrument.

...Also the VST pianos are more versatile, because they usually record the piano with more microphones and you have a lot of presets to choose from.

Yes, that's usually the case. But let's face it, there's only one "right" sound which comes from samples and the rest is more or less artificially manipulated derivative coming from the same source -similar as is the case for keyboard voices. That is, "bright, dark, mellow, concert hall, etc." versions of the same piano don't exist.
In my opinion, the only thing that matters is the quality of samples.. and if resulting sound match our subjective taste.

Bogdan

[mikf]

I’m certainly not saying that there aren’t better piano voice samples around. There definitely are. What I believe though is that in  the context of listening to a total performance the difference nowadays at CVP or Genos level is not very significant, maybe not even detectable without instruments or repeated listening to direct comparison.
But then I guess there are some people who might choose a car based on whether the sound system gets down to 28Hz rather than 35Hz.
Mike

[Amwilburn]

Since it's already announced I can break my silence; there is no real difference between the 809 and 909, *except* updated songs (they're much more contemporary), the half damper feels *much* better, and the LED's are now blue and white instead of red and green to aid the colourblind. Oh and although I've tried both 809 and 909, I didn't have them side by side so I didn't notice if there were *any* differences in the speakers.

Both already used the CLP785 samples. They even have identical style and voice libraries. But you can't order more 809's... for example we're out of polished white, and down to 1 PE 809 left, we can't order more (we've asked). So from here on it's 909 or bust.

Mike, I can tell you a lot of differences between the CVP805 and 705, but since the 705 served your purpose, does it matter? But in a nutshell, the 805 has one more dynamic velocity layer over the 705 (both pianos sound great though), the 705 has great ensemble strings (same as the 805) but the 805 has sampled solo strings (viola, cello) where the 705 does not. The 805 has revo compatible drums, the 705 does not. And the 805 has a lot of extra jazz scat vocal samples (and gospel 'shout outs') that the 705 does not. The 805 has the ultra wide twin guitar the 705 does not.

That's 90% of the differences, the rest being extra brass/horns and woodwinds/saxes.

FWIW, for me? The only differences that I would utilize are the solo cellos, and revo compatible drums, the twin guitar sounds, and of course the slightly better piano.


*update* after trying them side by side (briefly before all 809's uprights sold out here, we still have 2 809GP's though); turns out the 909 cfx piano isn't quite as good as the 809 one (the difference is very slight) but the 909 Bosendorfer is slightly better than the 809 Bosendorfer. All other sounds come from the Genos. So other than a slight difference in VRM between the 2, all the GEnos voices are the same (indeed, the registrations are identical, and can be used back and forth) the only other differences are blue and orange lights (instead of red & green) and the new half damper on the 909 (which is nice); oh but they also added full Smart Pianist support to the 909, which is also nice (they 809 could use smart pianist, but they didn't bother with the light up keys via the app since the piano already had that feature on board).

Mark

[sorenweiss]

you mention the 809 is discounted by how much against the 900

The price tag for the CVP-909GP was 19.033 USD in the store. I bought the CVP-809GP for 13.082 USD giving me a discount of 5.951 USD, which I found pretty significant. As mentioned in the video I couldn't hear any differences between the two pianos, so I went with the ≈ 6K USD discount :-)

[snow]

The price tag for the CVP-909GP was 19.033 USD in the store. I bought the CVP-809GP for 13.082 USD giving me a discount of 5.951 USD, which I found pretty significant. As mentioned in the video I couldn't hear any differences between the two pianos, so I went with the ≈ 6K USD discount :-)

What a great deal you got! The CVP-809GP is almost as expensive as the CVP-909GP now.