Author Topic: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave  (Read 3001 times)

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Offline dh110953

Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« on: January 16, 2023, 01:38:01 PM »
Hi. I have a style that I want to use and one of the parts in the style is a very good arpeggio that works great, apart from the fact I need it to be one octave higher. I have been into mixer and style and can make several changes but I canít find a way to change the octave, e.g move it one octave higher. I have duplicated the Harp, saved into user area and edited it so itís an octave higher, then select it in mixer but still, it plays in the lower octave. I am now out of ideas and wonder if itís possible and if so how can I achieve the required results.

This is on a Genos.....

Thanks

David
« Last Edit: January 16, 2023, 04:07:27 PM by dh110953 »
Genos, it sounds fantastic - One day I may even be able to play it.
 

Offline BogdanH

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2023, 02:38:08 PM »
You can do that in Style Creator. Once you're there, select desired voice (so label becomes red) and select Step Edit. Now make sure that cursor (selection) is in the middle (notes) columns and then choose Multi Select. Go with cursor up/down so all notes are selected and then rotate main knob until note at cursor position increases/decreases by exactly one octave (i.e. from C1 to C2). Now touch Multi Select again (to deselect that mode) and then move cursor up or down -you will see, that all notes changed to new octave.

Bogdan
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2023, 03:20:46 PM »
This of course will depend on what keyboard you have. Can't be done this way in Genos or SX900. You can only edit the drum tracks.

Offline DerekA

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2023, 04:01:29 PM »
I think you need to change the CASM settings for e.g. low note / high note on the style creator SFF Edit page.
Genos
 

Offline BogdanH

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2023, 05:09:20 PM »
If I understood correctly, OP wish to change the octave of particular instrument (voice) in particular style part.

...Can't be done this way in Genos or SX900. You can only edit the drum tracks.
-it can be done on SX700 and so I assume it can also be done on Genos.

Bogdan
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Online overover

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2023, 07:24:38 PM »
Hi. I have a style that I want to use and one of the parts in the style is a very good arpeggio that works great, apart from the fact I need it to be one octave higher. I have been into mixer and style and can make several changes but I canít find a way to change the octave, e.g move it one octave higher. I have duplicated the Harp, saved into user area and edited it so itís an octave higher, then select it in mixer but still, it plays in the lower octave. I am now out of ideas and wonder if itís possible and if so how can I achieve the required results.

This is on a Genos.....

Thanks

David

Hi David,

Whether it works that the Voice of a Style Section is played an octave higher when you shift the relevant MIDI notes up an octave (either in the Style Creator or in a suitable PC program such as "MixMaster") depends on how the CASM parameters "Lo Note" and "Hi Note" already mentioned here are set for the relevant Style. If "Hi Note" is set to the default value "C6", it will work. However, if "Hi Note" is set to a lower value (close to the currently audible octave position), an octave of the MIDI notes will not help, since these notes are always limited to the set "Hi Note" (i.e. automatically be transposed downwards again).

So the "correct" method would be to adjust the CASM "Lo Note" and "Hi Note" parameters so that (in all keys) the playback pitch is within the desired range. In this way you can not only "octave" the notes, but also precisely define the range into which the notes are automatically transposed. The disadvantage of this method is that these settings have to be made separately for each Style Section.

The "simple" method is to shift the MIDI notes in the Style up one octave, as described above. In order for this to work, however, the "Hi Note" parameter (as mentioned separately for each style section) may have to be set to a higher value beforehand.

By the way, if a (Preset) Style cannot be edited as desired, it may be necessary to use the "Style Unlocker" program first:
>>> http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha/software/stun/index.htm


P.S.
Another option is to create an Expansion Voice in the YEM that has the desired octave and use it in the relevant Style. With the Genos and Tyros5 (in contrast to PSR-S/SX models) you can also create Expansion Voices (Custom Voices) from (specific) Preset Voices in the YEM. Alternatively, you could of course also use a suitable voice from an existing (unprotected) Expansion Pack. If you change the octave here, however, the Pack in question must be reinstalled on the keyboard (depending on the installation method used, all other Packs too!). In addition, the edited Pack should also be re-saved in .ppf format (with "Export Pack" in YEM).

Creating a USER VOICE with a different octave (directly on the keyboard), on the other hand, is useless in this case because User Voices only work fully in keyboard parts. Unfortunately, when using User Voices in Styles, MIDI files or Multi Pads, only the original Preset Voice is loaded, i.e. the changed Voice Set is ignored.


Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris
« Last Edit: January 17, 2023, 04:57:36 PM by overover »
ē They always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
ē Never put the manual too far away: There's more in it than you think! ;-)
 

Offline dh110953

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2023, 01:20:27 PM »
Thank you for all the replies. Still not got there and I am not even sure what the CASM is...... I did try to see if I could change it in Style Creator but to edit the voice as suggested by BogdanH the Genos only gives me the option to delete what's already there (the voice is in Chord2). I have been into other setting and increased the Low Note/High Note but again, this has made no difference.  So, I am drawing blanks. As I don't own a PC (I'm on a macbook) I am unable to try the Style Unlocker.

Anyway, when I go back down to Devon I can see if its possible to make the changes via a SX700. If not, I guess I will just stick with a voice thats to low...

All suggesteion have been appreciated. I haven't given up just yet.
Genos, it sounds fantastic - One day I may even be able to play it.
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2023, 03:53:52 PM »
Yes that is correct you can only edit drum tracks on these keyboards. The only way to do what you want is to delete the part and then record it in with the octave you want.

Offline BogdanH

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2023, 03:57:38 PM »
You can't edit preset (built-in) styles because they are "locked". You can download Style Unlocker to unlock the style:
1. Copy desired style to USB stick and then to PC
2. Run Style Unlocker for selected style
3. Load (unlocked) style back to keyboard
-now you can edit style as you wish.

Bogdan
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Online overover

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2023, 04:56:52 PM »
Thank you for all the replies. Still not got there and I am not even sure what the CASM is...... I did try to see if I could change it in Style Creator but to edit the voice as suggested by BogdanH the Genos only gives me the option to delete what's already there (the voice is in Chord2). I have been into other setting and increased the Low Note/High Note but again, this has made no difference.  So, I am drawing blanks. As I don't own a PC (I'm on a macbook) I am unable to try the Style Unlocker.

Anyway, when I go back down to Devon I can see if its possible to make the changes via a SX700. If not, I guess I will just stick with a voice thats to low...

All suggesteion have been appreciated. I haven't given up just yet.

Hi David,

Many important programs/tools related to Yamaha keyboards are only available for Windows PCs. One could also use Windows on the Mac (e.g. with BootCamp or a virtualization software like Parallels or Virtual Box). However, certain specialist knowledge is required for setup/installation.

The simple solution I recommend is: Just get a cheap laptop/notebook with Windows 10. It can also be a used one that is a few years old. This is completely sufficient for Style and MIDI editing.

Regarding CASM: The so-called CASM part of a Style file contains, simply explained, instructions on how the MIDI notes programmed in the Style file should actually be played back (among other things depending on the chord currently being played). In addition, MIDI channels 1 - 8 of the Style file (on which additional patterns for certain chord types can be found) are assigned via the CASM settings to the channels 9 - 16 (that are actually output when playing the Style). However, a special CASM editor program is required for editing these settings.

Please also refer to the detailed information in the Genos Reference Manual starting on page 27 ("SFF EditóMaking Style File Format Settings").


@Bogdan
I already mentioned the "StyleUnlocker" program >>> above, but David only has a Mac computer and currently doesn't have Windows installed on that Mac either. Therefore, he cannot use this Windows program at the moment ...


Best regards,
Chris
« Last Edit: January 17, 2023, 05:04:39 PM by overover »
ē They always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
ē Never put the manual too far away: There's more in it than you think! ;-)
 
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Offline BogdanH

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2023, 07:04:54 PM »
.. but David only has a Mac computer and currently doesn't have Windows installed...
uh.. sorry, I missed that..too much (or not enough) coffee, I guess  ::)
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Online overover

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2023, 07:10:50 PM »
uh.. sorry, I missed that..too much (or not enough) coffee, I guess  ::)

No problem, Bogdan! :)


Best regards,
Chris
ē They always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
ē Never put the manual too far away: There's more in it than you think! ;-)
 

Offline DrakeM

Re: Change Style HOW can I change voice Octave
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2023, 04:31:16 AM »
To do what you ask you must be able to UNLOCK the style.

So it is best to add to you style collect all the old SFF1 styles as well, if you want to be able to UNLOCK styles.

You will need Jorgen's program. Style UNLOCKER.
http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha/software/stun/index.htm

Then you will have to find that same riff in one of the older SFF1 styles and then raise the octave, and save the style.

I have had to do this a few times when looking for a particular guitar strum.

Regards
Drake