Author Topic: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style  (Read 3434 times)

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Offline torben

Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« on: September 18, 2022, 03:32:11 PM »
Hi

If I remember correctly there is no way to raise or lower the different instrument sounds in a style on the T5 (contrary to the Genos)?

Regards

Torben
Tyros 5 was my choice - now it is only Genos1 !
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2022, 05:03:36 PM »
Torben,

This same question was asked on another thread.

https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,51111.msg486936.html#msg486936

When you save the style in Style Creator, the edits you made to the individual Section or Part will be saved without affecting the other parts of the style. This capability has been possible for all PSR and Tyros keyboards for many models back.

Joe H
« Last Edit: September 18, 2022, 05:05:41 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads in registrations. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline torben

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2022, 06:30:07 PM »
Hi Joe

thanks. But my question was more specific if this could be done without using the Style creator. Like on Genos where it is very simple.


Torben
Tyros 5 was my choice - now it is only Genos1 !
 

Offline pieterpan

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2022, 07:15:27 PM »
Torben,

There are 2 good programmes to solve your problem:
1 - Mixmaster
2 - Style Magic Yamaha

but you need Desktop or Laptop.

Regards <> Piet
Yamaha Tyros 4 - Yamaha KX 25 - Gem WSII module
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2022, 07:50:11 PM »
Hi Joe

thanks. But my question was more specific if this could be done without using the Style creator. Like on Genos where it is very simple.


Torben

Maybe I don't understand your question. Style Creator IS on the Genos (the built-in style editor) just as with all arrangers

Joe H
« Last Edit: September 18, 2022, 07:51:29 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads in registrations. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Toril S

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2022, 08:27:55 PM »
Is it possible to adjust volume on the style instruments using the mixer, then save the style as a user style? I do this to adjust rh voices, so why not the left?
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 
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Offline BogdanH

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2022, 09:17:53 PM »
I've read this thread few times, so I hope I understood the "problem"...
Let's say we open some user style and we go to mixer and there select Style tab. Now, if we change any parameter here (voice, volume/loudness, etc.) and then save the style, then the change we made will apply to whole style (MainA, MainB, etc.).
If, for example, we wish to change only some voice in MainB (or voice loudness, etc.), then we must first open Style editor. Now, while we're inside Style editor, we open mixer and adjust the particular voice in particular section. After that we exit mixer (means, we will return to Style editor) and save our style.

I hope that makes sense,
Bogdan
« Last Edit: September 18, 2022, 09:19:07 PM by BogdanH »
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Offline Toril S

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2022, 10:44:39 PM »
Thanks BogdanH!!
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline torben

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2022, 09:21:01 AM »
Thanks Bogdan

You explained it very well. But it IS far easier to adjust the loudness of the instruments used in the style (I am not referring to  lh or rh voices) on a Genos!

kind regards

Torben

Tyros 5 was my choice - now it is only Genos1 !
 

Offline BogdanH

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2022, 10:17:22 AM »
I don't have Genos, but to my knowledge PSR-SX and Genos have the same operating system and the same user interface -so I don't know how it would be easier on Genos. But then, as it is on SX, it's easy "enough".. I mean, by changing parameters inside style (that is, editing the style), it's to be expected that we need to use Style editor. And once we're happy with our style (considered as finished), we won't change style parameters in the middle of session. That is, if we need another version of the same style, then we make changes in Style editor and save it as new style. And no, I'm not talking about LH or RH voices either, as these are saved into style separately (as OTS voices).
I just wish to be clear about this and maybe learn something -because (as said), I don't have Genos.

Bogdan
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube
 

Offline jwyvern

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2022, 11:28:11 AM »
Bogdan you are correct for Genos ie. if you want changes to occur across all variations use Mixer directly. If you want to restrict changes to one variation only then make sure you go to style creator first and select that variation BEFORE going to Mixer. However it may not be obvious (on Genos) how you get to Mixer from Creator. If unsure, when in Creator push Direct Access followed by Ending 1 (or2) and Mixer appears. To return to Creator push Exit.

John
« Last Edit: September 19, 2022, 11:30:17 AM by jwyvern »
 

Offline pedro_pedroc

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2022, 12:25:35 PM »
Hello.

Yes, it is possible to adjust the individual instruments of any style part inside style creator.
In fact, Genos has a more "easy" user interface to do it... But older arrangers, like Tyros 5, has the same feature for sure - the hardest part is to find where to do it inside style creator and not forget to save it before closing.

Regards from Brazil,
Pedro

Offline torben

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2022, 12:32:29 PM »
Exactly Pedro - that is what I am getting at!

Torben
Tyros 5 was my choice - now it is only Genos1 !
 

Offline sugarplumsss

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2022, 11:42:07 PM »
the overview of my issue is
drum fills sometimes the bass drum and perhaps lower pitched toms are much louder than the style itself. i shudder at pressing the break button etc for a fill so i seldom do

i don’t have control of the PA.  i’ve tried dropping the lower end of master eq. but it’s not the right solution

is the a way to lower the drum fills in particular the bass drum ?
I use T4 as a drum machine. Playing my own acmp and bass. MIDI songs are my latest interest. If anyone wishes to share knowledge on MIDI songs let me know.
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2022, 11:49:03 PM »
Yes you can do this in the style creator. Select the section you want and then press . track 10 and hear you can lower the drum parts. If set at 80 then try altering to 50. You have to alter each bass drum part but as it is only one bar long you can do this quite quickly. When finished all your altering you must re-save the style.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 11:51:21 PM by EileenL »
Eileen
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Offline DrakeM

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2022, 02:45:11 AM »
There is nothing hard about adjusting the volume of a style part and then saving the style with a user name on any arranger. Genos might have cut out a screen or two (maybe).  BogdanH explained it straight forward and simple.

I am not sure what Eileen is pointing to by going to Track 10 to adjust just the bass drum notes.

You would have to go to "FUNCTION"
then to (F) digital Rec Menu
then to (B) Style Creator
Make sure the the "RHY2" is RED "REC"
The use the TAB (upper right hand location) to get the EDIT  tab
Use the (B) to move down the Channel note by note
When you hear the Bass Drum note, use the Wheel to lower its volume
Then you will need to go down through all the Notes (Might be 4 measures)
adjust each of the Bass Drum notes you hear volumes one at a time.
SAVE the style as a USER Style and give it a Name (Save it on your USB stick).

I use each of these techniques each week while putting together song specific styles. Doing it often it is just second nature to me now.

I would think there might be a video how to do these 2 items.

Regards
Drake


 
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Offline EileenL

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2022, 03:33:40 PM »
Hello Drake sorry for the confusion but having had Genos for five years now the brain is a little rusty. With Genos you just select your style part in style creator  track 10 which is always drums and then press set edit and adjust the volumes.
Eileen
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Offline sugarplumsss

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2022, 04:55:44 PM »
Eileen and any one else who feel their brain getting a little rusty

since my brain is a little rusty, i will attempt to convey an analogy i once heard about older brains!

the computer hard drive is the brain in the analogy
as the computer is being used, it collects data on the hard drive . we all know that as time passes, computers gradually slow down. it’s from too much data.
same with us… we have had “too many” experiences. we’re far from dumb… our brains have to deal with an over abundance of info. so errors eventually creep in.
I use T4 as a drum machine. Playing my own acmp and bass. MIDI songs are my latest interest. If anyone wishes to share knowledge on MIDI songs let me know.
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2022, 05:03:19 PM »
I have to agree. If I am trying to remember something and can't about fifteen minutes latter it pops up just like it has been doing a search on a computer.
Eileen
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Offline Toril S

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2022, 05:08:07 PM »
Same here. 😀
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline sugarplumsss

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2022, 05:46:34 PM »
There is nothing hard about adjusting the volume of a style part and then saving the style with a user name on any arranger. Genos might have cut out a screen or two (maybe).  BogdanH explained it straight forward and simple.

I am not sure what Eileen is pointing to by going to Track 10 to adjust just the bass drum notes.

You would have to go to "FUNCTION"
then to (F) digital Rec Menu
then to (B) Style Creator
Make sure the the "RHY2" is RED "REC"
The use the TAB (upper right hand location) to get the EDIT  tab
Use the (B) to move down the Channel note by note
When you hear the Bass Drum note, use the Wheel to lower its volume
Then you will need to go down through all the Notes (Might be 4 measures)
adjust each of the Bass Drum notes you hear volumes one at a time.
SAVE the style as a USER Style and give it a Name (Save it on your USB stick).

I use each of these techniques each week while putting together song specific styles. Doing it often it is just second nature to me now.

I would think there might be a video how to do these 2 items.

Regards
Drake

Drake. thank you. i’m hopeful about my challenge

you said “part”. i am talking about a part of the drum part. the fills bass drum

the style creator screen overwhelms because so many aspects to it

there are 4 variations and i have forgotten other aspects ( i’m not in front of t4 )
i got lost when trying to lower the bass drum , with saving and what and where to save

there are more details to this lowering of a drum in a fill that I need described
I use T4 as a drum machine. Playing my own acmp and bass. MIDI songs are my latest interest. If anyone wishes to share knowledge on MIDI songs let me know.
 

Offline BogdanH

Re: Changing the loudness of different parts of a style
« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2022, 08:30:55 PM »
I've only found a few videos for customizing drums on Tyros4 and all are very old, means bad quality (blurry, camera shaking, etc). On of them is made by member of this forum:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbcjZ5p7R30
-turn captions on and "auto-translate" to english

I can't say how useful that video is, because I don't own this keyboard and so for me, it looks quite confusing.

To understand how editing/customizing drums works, I recommend the following video. It explains very well (slow and step by step):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEsAjB-73nE
-you might also turn on captions, though.

The second video link (above) shows how to do it on PSR-SX900, which is in my opinion, much easier & logical than on Tyros (but as said, I don have Tyros). Regardless, once you figure out what buttons you need to press to get into right options window, the process is basically the same on both keyboards. I recommend that video, just so you will know what you need to look after (on Tyros). As you can see on that video, on PSR-SX (and on Genos) it all starts with "Drum setup" option (once you're inside Style editor) -on Tyros, "Drum setup" is obviously called different.

A short explanation for those who are interested, but never really tried:
In every real band, it's the drummer who is responsible for rhythm. In keyboard case, style is the band and Drum-Kit is drummer's equipment -a drummer obviously uses more than one instrument. Now, besides the rhythm, he also needs to make sure, that (for example) loudness of each instrument (drum, snare, etc.) fits into music that band is performing. But there is no drummer in our keyboard, so it's up to keyboard player to adjust drum-kit properly in forward, so the drums fit the music we're playing.
We can open drum-kit as a voice and if we do that, we can hear various drumming instruments depending on which key we press. And the more we hit certain drum instrument, the louder it will be. But when the style is running, we can't influence the loudness of each drum-instrument anymore -we can only change loudness whole drum-kit. In short: built-in drum-kits are generic (not adjusted for any particular music or song). Built-in drum-kit should only serve as a basis, from which we can start customizing drums sounding, so it will sound properly for that particular music -by assuming we wish a "perfect" result.
And that's what "Drum setup" is for. Here, we can adjust many parameters (loudness, reverb, etc.) for each and every key (=drum instrument) on keybed. For example, we need tambourine to be louder? Or only main drum quieter? We find the key that plays tambourine (keyboard DataList can be of big help here) and adjust the loudness of that particular key -it's like we would adjust key touch sensitivity for each key separately.
Now, that loudness (of that particular drum instrument) will be valid for whole style. To change loudness inside pattern (for example: 1st hit louder, 2nd one quieter, etc.), then we need to use "StepEdit" to accomplish that.

That's it.. I hope I wasn't too boring and that I raised the curiosity for some.

Bogdan
PSR-SX700 on K&M-18820 stand
Playing for myself on Youtube