Author Topic: Using Drawbars on Genos  (Read 482 times)

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Offline Duffy

Using Drawbars on Genos
« on: August 30, 2022, 03:43:35 PM »
I have, for the first time tried to use the Genos sliders as proper drawbars whilst playing with Genos organ voices
The screen then displays a set of drawbars where various alterations can be made but I find, when I move the real sliders, it is hit and miss whether the screen depiction moves the same.
For instance,
If I have the first drawbar (16) fully open and all the others are at zero, then if I move every slider together so that they all should be fully open, some, on the screen, will move and some will not.
I usually find that 2 or 3 of the bars on the screen are only 2/3 rds open whilst my real drawbars are all fully open.
The sound you hear is not relevant to the position of the real drawbars but it is relevant to the picture on the screen.
What on earth is the good of controllers which may work but may not?
And how do you get the drawbars on the  screen to do the exact same as what the real drawbars are doing.
Is there something I am missing?
I have had the Genos a long time but never tried to do this before and never actually used the sliders for anything at all.
Hoping someone is used to using the sliders as real drawbars and can put me right because I can't believe that this is what Yamaha intended.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2022, 03:44:52 PM by Duffy »

Offline DerekA

Re: Using Drawbars on Genos
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2022, 04:06:30 PM »
Here's the explanation. It's all to do with the fact the sliders can be used  to control several 'sets' of values. They will never initially match the 'current' values when you jump between the set of settings that the sliders currently control, for example changing from the overall part volume balance to the organ drawbars.

When you move the sliders, nothing happens until you move the slider *past* the position that matches its current value. Then it 'picks it up' and changes the value along with the slider movement. This applies whether you have to move the slide up to pick up the value, or down. So as you say, the screen always shows the current values, but the physical slider positions probably won't match.

The reason for this is that otherwise, when you touched a slider, the current value of the parameter would suddenly jump to match the slider position. And that's not likely to be a good result.

The same principle applies to the knobs.

This is quite a common way of working in all makes and models of synths / keyboards. *Very* occasionally, manufacturers have used motorised sliders to move them to match the current value when loading a registration. The modern alternative is what's known as 'endless' rotary knobs which use LEDs to indicate the current value.

Incidentally, the sliders normally control 3 'sets' of values and you can customize the values that each one controls through the live control menu. When you have an organ drawbar in any of the L or R voice slots, an additional 'set' of values is added to the slider display for each voice to control the drawbars on that voice. So you can see that if you were layering drawbars on say R1 and R2, when you changed the slider assignment between the two voices they would never line up to start with.

If you are just sticking with one voice, the solution to keep them and the screen in sync is to move all the sliders all the way out, then move them all all the way in, then dial in your particular drawbar settings as required.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2022, 04:12:20 PM by DerekA »

Offline Duffy

Re: Using Drawbars on Genos
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2022, 10:46:48 PM »
Thanks for the info Derek, that all seems a lot more complicated than I thought it was and it's clear that I will never be able to successfully use them as real drawbars.
That's such a shame as you can get so much more tonal colour by using the drawbars rather than jumping from one pre-set to another.
I never owned a Hammond but I enjoyed playing them in pubs many years ago and would dearly love to re-create that fun.
Always been a bit disappointed in the Yamaha Hammond sound and that's what I was working on but it doesn't make much difference if you can't use drawbars properly anyway.
Thanks again mate

Online overover

Re: Using Drawbars on Genos
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2022, 11:21:43 PM »
Hi Duffy,

As far as I know, the Genos Assignable Sliders always work the same way (including when used as drawbars). When a slider is moved minimally, the associated parameter jumps to the value specified by the slider. The slider does NOT first have to be moved until it matches the current value of the relevant parameter, but the value is changed immediately as soon as the respective slider is moved 1 - 2 mm. What is described should normally work properly even when using multiple sliders at the same time.

Best regards,
They always said: "This is not possible!"  Then someone came and - just did it!

Never put the manual too far away.  There's more in it than you think!

Offline DerekA

Re: Using Drawbars on Genos
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2022, 11:47:01 PM »
You are right of course Chris. I stand corrected.