Topic: Genos Built in LAN???

[rattley]

Hello!

In another post I mentioned MIDI cables to connect Genos to my computer.  I agree that problems can occur using long cables

My searches led me to discover a built in LAN adaptor on Genos but only in certain areas?   Lo and behold I have it and I think its working. I see green light showing its connected. My computer can see Genos too.  My cell phone hot spot is active and can be seen too.   

Does this mean I can transmit MIDI over this??  Has anyone else used Genos's LAN?  Computer networking is not my forte.  I just need to connect what i am thinking and seeing.  thanks.  -charley

[Divemaster]

 Yes, you can transmit MIDI over LAN.
Lots and lots of info on Google. Widely used by stage musicians apparently.


https://www.iconnectivity.com/blog/2018/3/7/ethernet-midi-for-live-musicians-an-iconnectivity-guide#:~:text=As%20MIDI%20is%20fundamentally%20just,on%20one%20single%20Ethernet%20cable!

LAN on a Genos? ... That's interesting.

Can you send a photo of your rear sockets.

Ethernet connections are extremely versatile, and as a computer builder and repairer,  I regularly wonder and despair how people claiming to have 'bad Internet problems' are so reluctant to immediately solve their 'problem' with a simple very cheaply obtained ethernet cable!

[overover]

Hi Charley,

Yes, Genos has a built-in Wireless LAN adapter. It is identical to the Yamaha "UD-WL01" USB Wireless LAN (=WiFi) adapter, which can be connected externally to PSR-SX models and Tyros5.

Genos can either be connected to a local router (in "Infrastructure mode") or configured as an Access Point (to connect other WiFi devices directly to the Genos, i.e. without a router).


You can do the following on the Genos via Wireless LAN (WiFi):

1. Install Expansion Packs from a computer (instead of using a USB flash drive)

2. Playing Audio songs from a smartphone, tablet or Mac computer (instead of a wired connection to the AUX IN jacks). As far as I know it also works with Windows, but only if a special driver is installed.

3. MIDI transmit and receive. Note that this is only available for MIDI Port 1, i.e. the internal MIDI Port 2 cannot be used via MIDI-over-WiFi.

MIDI-over-WiFi can be used with smartphones/iPhone, tablets/iPad and Mac computers directly. As far as I know, a MIDI network driver must be installed on Windows computers, e.g. "rtpMIDI":
>>> https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/rtpmidi.html


P.S.
Depending on the configuration and the load on the wireless network, there may be an audible delay with MIDI-over-WiFi. It is also not optimal for public performances. I therefore recommend working with Bluetooth LE (Low Energy) MIDI adapters for wireless MIDI connections. I recommend the "WIDI" devices from CME:
>>> https://www.cme-pro.com/widi-premium-bluetooth-midi/

By the way, I can NOT recommend the Yamaha Bluetooth LE MIDI adapters (MD-BT01, UD-BT01), mainly because there is no good firmware update support for them, in contrast to CME WIDI devices.


P.P.S.
Yamaha recommends a maximum length of the USB cable to the computer of 3 meters. With a good cable, it should still work well with 5 meters. I advise against using longer USB cables. DIN MIDI cables (with 5-pin connectors) can even be up to 15 meters long if required.


Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris

[DerekA]

You can do the following on the Genos via Wireless LAN (WiFi):

2. Playing Audio songs from a smartphone, tablet or Mac computer (instead of a wired connection to the AUX IN jacks). As far as I know it also works with Windows, but only if a special driver is installed.

Hi Chris, I didn't know this and I would really like to get it to work - can you give any advice on how to play audio via the LAN from an Android device? Or does it only work from Apple? Thanks - Derek

[rattley]

Hello

Thanks for the info. This may be better news than I expected. I only need to use the Genos as a sound module playing back the styles I'm auditioning and editing on my computer.  I'm hoping latency isn't to much of an issue seeing it is only playback.   I don't think I can stand another day using my GS wavetable synth.  It is so dinky!!

Even the info that Yamaha puts out about the onboard LAN is odd.  They say the LAN is only available in certain areas. I'm not exactly sure what that means. Why isn't it available everywhere?

best wishes  -charley

[pjd]

They say the LAN is only available in certain areas. I'm not exactly sure what that means. Why isn't it available everywhere?

best wishes  -charley

Hi Charley --

The key word here is "wireless" in "wireless LAN". That means radio. Radio means some regional governmental authority must certify the radio transmitter within. Thus, Yamaha needs to file an application, test data, etc., etc. Since Yamaha are global...

For real nerds -- One way to cut certification cost is to certify a specific module, e.g., "WIRELESS LAN MODULE
(UD-WL01) Destination U,E,B" and then plug this module into one or more products, instead of certifying each and every individual product.

Hope this helps -- pj

[BogdanH]

hello everyone,
Just observing this thread and I'm confused. I mean, there's LAN and there's WLAN (two totally different things).. not to mention LAN adapter, which again is something different. As far I know, no Genos has LAN connection -correct me if I'm wrong.. I'm just trying to follow the discussion.

Bogdan

[rattley]

Hello,

My brain stem is melting!!  So much great info......hard for me to decypher.  I've been assuming that since Genos has the onboard wireless LAN and my computer has wireless LAN that no hardware (midi or usb cable) would be needed.  I've gotta be missing something!

I did order 2 of those adapters shown on the post. They weren't that expensive and I can use them on my non-wireless gear. I still have dreams of re-constructing a pipe organ project I have been tinkering with for years.   In 2004 Hurricane Charley caused my beautiful fully operational Conn Theatrette 580 organ to get damaged beyond repair. I took out the guts, added 3 cheap 49 note controllers and put homemade contact strips on  the pedalboard. All the cables make it look like an octopus!  I still have 2 internal leslie units too. I used MiditZer to control it all.  Hopefully since I am now retired I will have the time to do this. If only my health issues would lessen.  Thanks for reading my dream post.  -charley


https://www.ebay.com/itm/275469340465?hash=item4023408f31:g:NWgAAOSwijhjKoxe&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA8HSQ%2Fu%2F6xuz75MrbiesiSD8BZb%2FiUREyJQRqQ7rrTvqaPbK6NxSyAmzdMbQQisPpe7e%2BfcROADgBmAVN76fGj3OAQAR6pd2cZeRI5biAxYdcSdSsH4d6lDhoefx2%2Bjl%2Fq4xw57TTOt2whuCNRkkWc%2Fiv5rWAiT4KB%2FNa9%2B12oj4ifIrsLde0so6jh%2FAX5g821Ij0dNHon9JDYeoURPwRZdj7vp2d2TY8Nb%2BQ85m2mHcjMvJrv8obvoiz%2FgVJ1%2Bhgof1Y5a0z0qjgV%2FTjpBaBOYylJdaqjmT%2Bz7U9iiBmfJ6w2hGWwaoazV%2BWM%2FF2ruU64w%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABFBMhIq1q7hi

[pjd]

hello everyone,
Just observing this thread and I'm confused. I mean, there's LAN and there's WLAN (two totally different things).. not to mention LAN adapter, which again is something different. As far I know, no Genos has LAN connection -correct me if I'm wrong.. I'm just trying to follow the discussion.

Bogdan

Hi Bogdan --

Since this is a friendly, often non-techie forum, certain terms like "LAN" are often bandied about without precision. 

I'm sitting here with the Genos service manual. In the USA, where Charley is located, Genos is delivered with Wireless LAN capability built-in. As Chris and I mentioned, the WLAN hardware capability is implemented by an in-built UD-WL01.

The Genos hardware does not have wired LAN capability (ports), AKA Ethernet (CAT). Period.

Let's see if we can assist Charley. 

Have a good weekend, dude -- pj

[pjd]

Hi Charley --

I noticed from your profile that you are located in Florida. Your USA Genos should have Wireless LAN built-in.

Your Genos can join a wireless local area network (WLAN), if you have one, through your wireless router.

Network settings are discussed in Chapter 13, Network Settings, Genos Reference Manual, page 152.

Without going into the details, you configure Genos in roughly the same way as a tablet, PC or whatever.

Hope this short info can get your started -- pj

[rattley]

Hello


Today I installed the MIDI driver on my computer.   I can see my network and all looks connected.  Even Genos shows connected.  But I don't think it is.   My wifi on the computer shows its connected. I think?  It also shows no internet and secured.  I seek some wisdom here. I'm not sure how to troubleshoot this. I'd be afraid to lose all my connections and have no internet on this computer at all.      I'm still pleased with what i have learned and accomplished today.   Thanks.  -charley

[svpworld]

Inside the Genos there's a Yamaha WiFi adaptor without it's case and simply connected via a usb cable to the main board. So it should be easy enough to connect any compatible USB LAN or WiFi adaptor in place and tuck it out the way. You could test it beforehand using the external USB port. I assume those countries that don't get the built-in WiFi installed just miss this little board on a USB cable.  Even the power supply in the Genos is a standard switched-mode laptop type power supply (even inside its original case) and strapped inside the main Genos case with the cables extending to it!   

Simon

[rattley]

NO  NO  NO!!!!!!!!   (banging head against wall..............)

The key here is the word "wireless"  pjd said. The whole idea (i thought) was not to have physical cables on the floor so I won't trip over them taking out both my computer and Genos.

I'm not claiming sweet success just yet, but I did get a WIRELESS network set up and semi-working!!!!! I have Genos as the server setting up an Access Point Mode on it. I read that this is a totally private network just between Genos and my computer. I made sure my computer settings had wifi on and permissions allowed.  I viewed my network and was shocked to finally see Genos in it. This is after hours of trial and error trying.  I played a midi on MIDIworks and Genos speaks!  However there is a latency problem. The song stumbles and doesn't have the usual perfect timing. I opened the same midi in Audacity and played around with latency settings.  60ms is the best setting but it still stumbles, although less. Any attempt at a lower setting didn't make it better.  I'm hoping it's just a settings issue.  Currently this latency is unacceptable.

I'm still pleased with what I have accomplished so far. I just knew this could be done.   Look Ma.......No Wires!!!!!

I did start Genos in the file transfer mode but my computer doesn't see it.  This is secondary but would like to see it work eventually.  Thank you all for your thoughts and help.  -charley