Author Topic: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature  (Read 4362 times)

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Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« on: May 28, 2021, 10:31:27 AM »
Dear friends,

searched in the Forum and Manuals, but haven't found an answer. The question refers to STYLE PLAY mode (not SONG MODE).

As we all know, there are 4/4 songs that in some part have a 2/4 beat. When playing that kind of song, once you get to the 2/4 beat part, continuing on gets wrong, of course.

If I try to change the all style (in STYLE CREATOR mode) from 4/4 to 2/4, a message shows that if I continue, Genos will clear all parts and I should reprogram the style.....from scratch!

The way I do compromise an existing 4/4 style with the need of having some 2/4 beats, is to activate (before starting to play the style) BOTH Sync Start and SYNC STOP buttons.
This way, when the 2/4 beat arrives i keep playing, and when the 2/4 beat ends I LIFT my hands form the keyboard (for a minimum time, almost null) and then I press again the keys: this way the next (4/4) beat starts at the right time. And so on.
Obviously I don't like to much my method, as it leaves an even minimum lack of accompaniment, and also does not allow me, during that action, to keep the accompaniment to flow automatically to may do other actions (for, as an example, to change an OTS, to change the Variation, ecc.).

I know that from OS 2.0 on  there is the STYLE SECTION RESET function, that could fits for this need. But to activate it from the keyboard I should press the TAP TEMPO button, and unfortunately I have 2 hands only....
The solution would be to add a pedal for switching on this function.

My question is, in alternative to the Style Section Reset, is there any chance to change a style from 4/4 to 2/4, without having to reprogram the style from scratch?

Thank you,

Angelo

Angelo
Yamaha Genos, Clavinova Cvp309PE, Hs-8, Hammond Xm2.
Past: Farfisa Minicompact, CompactDeLuxe; Elkarapsody; Hammond L122R&Leslie142; CasioCz1000; Roland D50, E20, ProE, Juno106, JX8P, Ra90; Technics Kn800, 1000, 2000; Korg M1, i3, i30, Pa1x, Pa3x; others.
 

Online Fred Smith

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2021, 10:54:51 AM »
I change one of the fills to 2/4, using Jorgen's Half Bar Style Creator, available here: https://www.psrtutorial.com/util/sorenson.html

That’s solve ever needed for any of the songs I play that have 2/4 sections.

Cheers,
Fred
Fred Smith,
Saskatoon, SK
Sun Lakes, AZ
Genos, Bose L1 compacts, Finale 2015
Check out my Registration Lessons
 
The following users thanked this post: MadrasGiaguari

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2021, 11:31:28 AM »
Thank you, Fred, for your advise.

Is there any way to do the same on the Genos (without external software). My problem is that I have a Mac, and Josoft programs do not work on Mac....

Any way, I guess that the most flexible way to do it is to use a pedal programmed to switch the STYLe SECTION RESET function. I tried and works fine. I just need to practice to get a smooth result. By the use of a pedal I have the function available at fly.

Nevertheless, any alternative option would be interesting.

Ciao

Angelo
Yamaha Genos, Clavinova Cvp309PE, Hs-8, Hammond Xm2.
Past: Farfisa Minicompact, CompactDeLuxe; Elkarapsody; Hammond L122R&Leslie142; CasioCz1000; Roland D50, E20, ProE, Juno106, JX8P, Ra90; Technics Kn800, 1000, 2000; Korg M1, i3, i30, Pa1x, Pa3x; others.
 

Online Fred Smith

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2021, 11:55:59 AM »
If you’re using a pedal, the easiest way is to set it to Half Bar Fillin.

Cheers,
Fred
Fred Smith,
Saskatoon, SK
Sun Lakes, AZ
Genos, Bose L1 compacts, Finale 2015
Check out my Registration Lessons
 

Online ckobu

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2021, 11:58:30 AM »
Hi Angelo

Unfortunately, there is no way to make such a rhythm directly in the keyboard.
Recently, the oriental model PSR A5000 was released, which has this feature.
This is the first Yamaha model that can do that.
Maybe some new Update for Genos will make it possible?
Watch my video channel
 

Offline overover

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2021, 12:29:09 PM »
... Unfortunately, there is no way to make such a rhythm directly in the keyboard.
Recently, the oriental model PSR A5000 was released, which has this feature.
This is the first Yamaha model that can do that.
Maybe some new Update for Genos will make it possible?

Yes, with the A5000 you can set a different time signature for each Style Section. But I'm afraid this only works when the section concerned is newly recorded, but not when changing an existing Style, because the A5000 Reference Manual says on page 21 (below the information on the "Section Time Signature" parameter): "All existing recorded data are deleted when changing the time signature. "


Best regards,
Chris
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 

Online ckobu

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2021, 01:03:13 PM »
Chris, It is possible that you are right. But this is already a good indication of progress. And maybe Time Signature only applies to Basic, not to Section.  :)
Watch my video channel
 

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2021, 01:13:00 PM »
Dear Fred, Casper and Chris,

thank you for your interesting answers.

I agree that the easiest way is to use the STYLE SECTION RESET function with a dedicated pedal, that I started to do this morning  :D

Actually my wish to may have some styles with 2/4 signature depended on my long experience with Korg keyboards, where besides a majority of 4/4 styles, there were a few 2/4 ones also.

But I must say that the function offered by Genos OS 2.0 is definitively better, as it is a real time command that one can activate whenever is required.
I'm confident that by practicing it will become natural, as it is for the many commands that we switch in real time while playing.

Thank you, and have a nice weekend.

Angelo

 
Yamaha Genos, Clavinova Cvp309PE, Hs-8, Hammond Xm2.
Past: Farfisa Minicompact, CompactDeLuxe; Elkarapsody; Hammond L122R&Leslie142; CasioCz1000; Roland D50, E20, ProE, Juno106, JX8P, Ra90; Technics Kn800, 1000, 2000; Korg M1, i3, i30, Pa1x, Pa3x; others.
 

Offline overover

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2021, 02:31:19 PM »
Thanks for your feedback, Angelo!

Have you already tried the "Half bar Fill-in" function (assigned to a foot pedal), as suggested by Fred?


Best regards,
Chris
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2021, 11:22:17 PM »
Not yet, Chris, but I'll definitely try it.

So far i tried the STYLE SECTION RESET operated by pedal, and works fine. The good think of it is that you don't need to add a fill-in.

But I'll try Fred suggestion and will let you know about it.

This Forum is so precious!

Angelo
Yamaha Genos, Clavinova Cvp309PE, Hs-8, Hammond Xm2.
Past: Farfisa Minicompact, CompactDeLuxe; Elkarapsody; Hammond L122R&Leslie142; CasioCz1000; Roland D50, E20, ProE, Juno106, JX8P, Ra90; Technics Kn800, 1000, 2000; Korg M1, i3, i30, Pa1x, Pa3x; others.
 

Offline overover

Re: Songs with 4/4 and also 2/4 time signature
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2021, 05:15:32 AM »
Not yet, Chris, but I'll definitely try it.

So far i tried the STYLE SECTION RESET operated by pedal, and works fine. The good think of it is that you don't need to add a fill-in.

But I'll try Fred suggestion and will let you know about it.

This Forum is so precious!

Angelo

Hi Angelo,

just to make sure that you got me right: By "Half bar Fill-in" I did NOT mean creating such Fill-ins directly in the Styles (with the program "Style Half Bar Fill Creator" by Jørgen Sørensen, already mentioned von Fred), but rather the assignment of the Genos function "Half Bar Fill In" to a foot pedal (foot switch).

Please also see the attached picture. It shows what the Genos Reference Manual (page 138) says about the "Half Bar Fill-in" function. :)


Best regards,
Chrs
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!