Topic: Genos Bass sounds quiet from Mixer

[Pincho Paxton]

The Bass sounds quiet from my mixer, Bass voices can hardly be heard at all. I have the Behringer X2222USB Xenyx 22 Input 2/2 Bus Mixer. Headphones plugged into Genos sound great!

Tried changing everything on mixer, and I can't fix it.

I have ordered some balanced cables to see if they work better.

My Roland Octapad VDrum Pad also sounds bad through mixer. It seems that Bass must be cut off, but the equalizer settings are all in the middle.

[overover]

The Bass sounds quiet from my mixer, Bass voices can hardly be heard at all. I have the Behringer X2222USB Xenyx 22 Input 2/2 Bus Mixer. Headphones plugged into Genos sound great!

Tried changing everything on mixer, and I can't fix it.

I have ordered some balanced cables to see if they work better.

My Roland Octapad VDrum Pad also sounds bad through mixer. It seems that Bass must be cut off, but the equalizer settings are all in the middle.

Hi Pincho,

which INPUTs do you use for the Genos on the external Mixer?

IF you use two of the Mic/Line Inputs (1 - 8 ), make sure that the 75 Hz Low Cut switch is OFF (= NOT pressed). Make also sure that one channel is panned FULLY to the LEFT, and the second channel is panned FULLY to the RIGHT (using the PAN knobs).

IF the COMP (Compressor) is activated in these Input channels, switch it OFF.

Make also sure that the LOW EQ, the LOW MID EQ (if using one of the STEREO Input (9/10 ... 14/15) are not set extremly low. Note: In the Mic/Line Inputs (1 - 8 ), also the MID EQ can cut out Bass frequencies (if the FREQ is set relatively low, like 100 Hz, and the the MID knob is turned to the left).


P.S.
You cannot use "balanced cables" to directly connect the Genos to the Mixer, because all Genos Outputs are UNBALANCED. The only way to use balanced cables is to use an additional Stereo DI Box (connect the Genos Main Outputs to the DI Box using very short standard (unsymmetrical) Jack cables, and connect the XLR Outputs of the DI Box to two Mic/Line channels of the Mixer (panned fully left/right, as mentioned above).


Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris

[Pincho Paxton]

Hi Pincho,

which INPUTs do you use for the Genos on the external Mixer?

IF you use two of the Mic/Line Inputs (1 - 8 ), make sure that the 75 Hz Low Cut switch is OFF (= NOT pressed). Make also sure that one channel is panned FULLY to the LEFT, and the second channel is panned FULLY to the RIGHT (using the PAN knobs).

IF the COMP (Compressor) is activated in these Input channels, switch it OFF.

Make also sure that the LOW EQ, the LOW MID EQ (if using one of the STEREO Input (9/10 ... 14/15) are not set extremly low. Note: In the Mic/Line Inputs (1 - 8 ), also the MID EQ can cut out Bass frequencies (if the FREQ is set relatively low, like 100 Hz, and the the MID knob is turned to the left).


Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris

Are those line Inputs mono? That would explain it, because I am plugging a single stereo cable into them. You said use two set left and right so that would be my problem.

[overover]

Are those line Inputs mono? That would explain it, because I am plugging a single stereo cable into them. You said use two set left and right so that would be my problem.

A "single stereo cable"? What do you mean here? A cable with TRS Jack plugs on both sides?



This is NOT a "Stereo cable" but a balanced Mono cable. (As mentioned above, those TRS cables can NOT be used directly connected to the Genos Main, Sub and AUX Outputs.)

You cannot use such a single cable to input a Stereo signal (e.g. when you would connect this cable to the Headphones socket) into the Mixer. ALL Inputs on the Mixer are MONO. Therefore, you have to use either two "Mono/Line" channels (1 - 8 ), OR, if you use one of the "Stereo" channels (9/10 ... 14/15), you have to use BOTH of the Inputs (L and R).

So, just use TWO unbalanced Jack cables (TS) connected to the Genos Main Outputs L and R:




Best regards,
Chris

[Pincho Paxton]

A "single stereo cable"? What do you mean here? A cable with TRS Jack plugs on both sides?



This is NOT a "Stereo cable" but a balanced Mono cable.

You cannot use such a single cable to input a Stereo signal (e.g. when you would connect this cable to the Headphones socket) into the Mixer. ALL Inputs on the Mixer are MONO. Therefore, you have to use either two "Mono/Line" channels (1 - 8 ), OR, if you use one of the "Stereo" channels (9/10 ... 14/15), you have to use BOTH of the Inputs (L and R).


Best regards,
Chris

No I mean I am going from genos main Left/right to a single Stereo Input cable then into a single Line Input... which is wrong. I should go Left to Line 1, and Right to Line 2.

OK thanks!

[overover]

No I mean I am going from genos main Left/right to a single Stereo Input cable then into a single Line Input... which is wrong. I should go Left to Line 1, and Right to Line 2.

OK thanks!

Yes, you have to use two separate TS cables, and on the Mixer use either two separate Mic/Line channels, or use one Stereo Input channel, but BOTH Input sockets (L and R) of this Stereo channel.


Best regards,
Chris

[overover]

Just a little addition:

Did you originally use such a cable?



This is a so called "Insert cable". You can connect the TRS plug of this cable to a Headphones socket (e.g. of the Genos) and connect the two TS plugs to the Mixer as described above.

But you can NOT use this cable "reversed" to input a Stereo signal into the Mixer, because, as mentioned, all Input sockets on the Mixer are just MONO.


Best regards,
Chris

[Pincho Paxton]

Yes I used that cable reversed. Thanks you have fixed my problem. I just put all single cables into the Mixer using line 1 and 2. Sounds great now! You also fixed my Octapad drums...lol!

[MarkF_48]

Sort of the technical explanation of no bass being heard when connected as you had...........

The bass audio signal is evidently centered in the stereo image (both left and right bass levels are equal left and right). The single mono balanced input of the mixer goes to a 'balanced' differential amplifier which has a (+) input and a (-) input. The plus (non-invert phase) and minus (invert phase) inputs of the amplifier take those left and right inputs and sum them which results in a zero output from that amplifier and no or near no audio from the bass.

This is also how some audio programs can eliminate vocals from music by sending the vocal (usually centered in a stereo mix) through two channels of processing and inverting one to make it out of phase and then summing the result which removes or reduces the vocal. 

[overover]

Sort of the technical explanation of no bass being heard when connected as you had...........

The bass audio signal is evidently centered in the stereo image (both left and right bass levels are equal left and right). The single mono balanced input of the mixer goes to a 'balanced' differential amplifier which has a (+) input and a (-) input. The plus (non-invert phase) and minus (invert phase) inputs of the amplifier take those left and right inputs and sum them which results in a zero output from that amplifier and no or near no audio from the bass.

This is also how some audio programs can eliminate vocals from music by sending the vocal (usually centered in a stereo mix) through two channels of processing and inverting one to make it out of phase and then summing the result which removes or reduces the vocal.

Thanks, Mark, for this technical explanation!

Yes, most Mixers have balanced Line Inputs that can either used with balanced TRS cables or, of course, also with unbalanced TS cables. If used with a TS plug, automatically the Ring contact of the TRS socket is bridged to the Sleeve contact, and an unbalanced signal is then supported.


Best regards,
Chris

[Pincho Paxton]

Ok so I have cancelled my balanced cables, although I do have a slight hiss if I push the volume up.

[travlin-easy]

The keyboard's outputs are ALL unbalanced. When you plug into the L/R output jack on the keyboard, this automatically throws a leaf-switch on the keyboard's output jack that combines the left and right channels. This is clearly shown on the schematic diagram. However, the connection is still mono - not stereo, therefore, only an unbalanced plug can be used at the keyboard end, and this should be sent to a single channel on the mixer. Unfortunately, this is not clearly defined in the user manual, so you have to rely on the memories of some of us old geezers on the forum.

Good luck,

Gary

[overover]

Ok so I have cancelled my balanced cables, although I do have a slight hiss if I push the volume up.

Hi Pincho,

all Mixers produce some noise. In my experience, BEHRINGER mixers usually have more noise than Mixers from other brands (e.g. Yamaha).

The most important thing is that you turn up the master volume on the Genos relatively high (approx. 3 o'clock). Equally important (especially with Behringer devices) is the correct leveling of the input channels (using the GAIN knob).

For level adjustment you can use the "PFL" function (Pre Fader Listening): Press the "MODE" switch in the Master section of the Behringer X2222USB, and press the "SOLO" switch of ONE Input channel (!). Now the left side of the Peak Meter is in operation, and you can exactly set the GAIN. Adjust the GAIN knob so that the red CLIP LED is just NOT lit. If you are using two Mono Input channels, the Gain should of course be set IDENTICALLY on both.


P.S.
Unbalanced cables never produce more noise or "hiss" than balanced cables. The main advantage of balanced cables is to avoid HUM (which can occur when relatively long cables are used and/or the instrument and the Mixer are connected to different power grids / phases. In such cases it is recommended to use balanced cables. In the case of Yamaha arranger keyboards, however, as I said, a DI-BOX must always be connected in between.


Best regards.
Chris

[Pincho Paxton]

Ok thanks! I got rid of the noise!

[Lee Batchelor]

...us old geezers on the forum.

You're not old, Gary - just well preserved !