Author Topic: Style numbers for the SX900  (Read 734 times)

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Offline daleSP

Style numbers for the SX900
« on: February 23, 2020, 07:05:34 AM »
Hi ... Over the years, I have tried to figure out how to select a style by sending a midi command to the keyboard from a DAW. The keyboard's DataList manual indicated there was a Sysex command available to select a style which takes a "style number" as input. However, there is no mention of any style number associated with styles in the manual.

Looking at some of the PSR utilities written by some members of this forum, there are data files with styles and their corresponding style numbers (in decimal). How did they get this information ? I couldn't find any documentation (or forum posts) on how to get this info. I must have missed it.

With the recent arrival of the SX900 and a few posts on this forum from members looking for SX900 data to utilize in various PSR utilities, I decided to see if I can create a data file of the SX900 styles and their style numbers.
The only way I know of extracting the style number of a style is to create a midi file on the keyboard with that style selected and then examine that midi file on a PC using the Mixmaster utility. I can see the style select Sysex command with the corresponding style number in it. However, the SX900 have over 500 styles on it and to create and examine 500+ midi files is a big, big chore !!

Fortunately, it seems that the style numbers are sort of unique in that if the style has the same name (across keyboard models), it's very likely that they all have the same style number. With this assumption in mind, I mapped the Genos and S975 style names (from Mixmaster utility data lists) to the SX900 style names and assigned the resulting style numbers to SX900 style names. This resulted in about 70 unmapped SX900 styles to be investigated. I created the appropriate midi files on the keyboard for these unmapped styles and examined them for their style numbers. This was much better/faster than creating and examining 500+ midi files !

Anyway, after much cutting and pasting, I have created a file of the SX900 style names with their style numbers. I have verified that these style numbers are correct on my SX900 by sending the appropriate Sysex message to select each of the 500+ styles.
Thanks very much to the forum member who provided a spreadsheet (a while ago) containing the formula for converting the decimal style numbers into the hex value need for the Sysex command.  I don't recall his name but whoever you are, that spreadsheet was a very critical piece of this puzzle for me. Thank you !

I have provided the SX900 style data list at this link (which will be be deactivated at the end of March 2020) ... https://1drv.ms/u/s!AsbwHbSQggqBlSzqW8NidglWJKZ8?e=uMASC2
Hopefully, the developers of the various PSR utilities which depend on this information will be able to use this data to update their programs to support the SX900. I can certainly benefit from that !!

I assume that the SX700 style names are a subset of the SX900 and that the SX900 data file can be used as a basis for creating the corresponding file for the SX700. Someone else can have the "fun" in creating this SX700 file !

OK. Someone, please tell me that the way I created this data file was WRONG and that there is a MUCH BETTER way to do it. I can't believe that this is the only way to do this task. It was soooo time consuming and I wouldn't want to do this again !!
Why doesn't Yamaha provide this information in the keyboard's Datalist manual ??? They provide pretty much everything else in that manual. What so "special" about these style numbers that it cannot be provided, just like the MSB/LSB/PC info for Voices ?

Offline rcpilot

Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2020, 09:40:07 PM »
So why is it you want to select a style from a DAW?
I can understand sounds used from the DAW, but not styles??
Thanks,
Lee
Yamaha SX-900, used to play Thomas and Yamaha Organ's
 

Tyros5Mad

  • Guest
Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2020, 12:53:00 AM »
Great job Dale,

I don't know any other way to do it either and I also needed the style numbers for both the SX900 and SX700 for my software Midi Maker. I had an email discussion with the guy who maintains the Producer software, which creates step record files for Yamaha arrangers. He does not know any other way to do it either.

However....

The is a way around it. There is more than one way to select a style.
1) Yes you can send a sysex message as you want to do in your DAW and as I do in Midi Maker.
2) You can also send a simple command to your keyboard to select a registration number or other keyboard features as long as you set up a midi template in your keyboard to do this.

Check this post on my music board to see how to set up your keyboard: https://yamaha-music-board.freeforums.net/thread/42/midi-maker-tutorial-installation-setup

Once you have done this, you can send a single note to your keyboard  from your DAW to select a registration that you have set up, or to start the keyboard playing and all the other commands available in the the midi setup.

I am abandoning the complicated style number method in my software. This means that users can select any style, even custom styles, by setting up a registration.

Hope this helps you and anyone else who wants to use software to control the keyboard..

Regards, RL
 

Offline daleSP

Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2020, 02:24:24 AM »
@RichardL ... Thanks for the info.

Unfortunately for me (and users of the PSR-S.. series of keyboards), there is no "External Controller" option in our Midi templates. This means I have to provide this "midi translation" function in software on a computer.
My use case is FCB1010 (foot controller) sending midi commands to the keyboard to select styles, start/stop acmp etc. However, the FCB1010 cannot send Sysex midi commands which are required to select a style or a registration.

So I have to do this: FCB1010 -> midi translation software -> keyboard.

I wish Yamaha would bring this "External Controller" feature to the PSR-SX900 (through a firmware update).
In 2020, it does not seems like much of a differentiator between the SX and Genos keyboards. There are other much larger features which differentiate these two lines of keyboards.


@rcpilot ... As an I/T guy, I am very much interested in the technical aspects of these keyboards so I use software/DAW to better understand and control the keyboard.

Perhaps I should be personally playing the keyboard more rather than having the computer play the keyboard for me  :)
Dale
 

Tyros5Mad

  • Guest
Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2020, 11:07:01 AM »
Wow I did not know that. Thanks for the info. Genos and Tyros keyboards do have it. On Tyros it is called MFC-10.

Richard
« Last Edit: February 24, 2020, 11:38:57 AM by RichardL »
 

Online EileenL

Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2020, 02:22:41 PM »
I don't think this is made any more.

Tyros5Mad

  • Guest
Re: Style numbers for the SX900
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2020, 04:52:41 AM »
That is correct Eileen. However any other external controller can be substituted for the MFC-10. This is also why it is not called MFC-10 in the Genos but simply "External Controller". It is a pity that the PSR range does not support an external controller because that makes it really simple to control keyboard functions.

We can still send data from a DAW for example to the PSR keyboards as sysex info (which is what Dale is talking about) but it just means we have to learn a lot more about how the data must be structured to have the keyboard understand the sysex message. Of course the frustrating thing is that Yamaha does not supply all the data in their manuals.

They should publish the keyboard ID and the style numbers as a standard piece of info, as Dale said.

Regards, RL