Author Topic: I want a nice sounding clarinet  (Read 1133 times)

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Offline Rolf Lindell

I want a nice sounding clarinet
« on: January 30, 2020, 08:10:15 AM »
I have a PSR S779. I found this keyboard to be just the keyboard for me.
Now I have trouble get a nice clarinet sound. The one preinstalled don't sound the way
I like. I want o soft sound (Mr Acker Bilk sound). I don't rely understand the DSP function I suspect
the answer is in here
PSR S770
 

Offline Janus

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2020, 10:37:57 AM »
Use a voice editor
Give the voice a slow attack and some release it gives a smooth sound

Offline Toril S

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2020, 02:56:25 PM »
You can do that in voice set. A little more reverb too, maybe. And look in the legacy folder, some old voices are actually better than the new ones😀
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Rolf Lindell

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2020, 12:23:54 PM »
Sorry but what is "legacy folder".

Voice editor do that mean that I cant fix it with my keyboard only?

Thanks for your answers but I am no technical star. I just have my keyboard and
nothing more.
PSR S770
 

Offline geoff5798

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2020, 04:39:59 PM »
 Legacy isa treasure trove of instruments from previous keyboard models.
You can find the legacy folder on psr 775 and similar by.
go into voice presets
on the right hand side press up
select page 2
there you will find the legacy folder and other extra folders.
Geoff
 

Offline PierreSW

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2020, 04:44:56 PM »
Sorry but what is "legacy folder".

Voice editor do that mean that I cant fix it with my keyboard only?

Thanks for your answers but I am no technical star. I just have my keyboard and
nothing more.

Hej!
Kolla i den svenska manualen sid 36, där står det hur du kommer åt XG och GM-ljud där finns det klarinetter och en hel del andra ljud. 
O.B.S Genom att trycka på [8 ]-knappen
(UP) på Voice-valsdisplayen kan du ta
fram de Voice-kategorier (mappar),
inklusive ”GM&XG” och ”GM2”, som
inte har några VOICE-kategoriknappar.


// Pierre
YAMAHA Genos, YAMAHA MFC10, Bose L1 II-pa,Mixer T1 ToneMatch, ZUM STEEL.
 

Offline Toril S

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2020, 07:09:15 PM »
Hallo Rolf :)
If you want to change the sound of a voice, select the voice, press voice set, button 5 under the display. You will now come into a screen where you can change the values of many things, like attack, reverb, offset and so on. By using the TAB buttons you can call upp different screens within voice set, where you can change values. Do not be afraid to push the buttons and hear how it changes the sound of the instrument. The preset voice will not be changed. When happy, press SAVE (the i button at the right side of the display).
That brings you to user, and you now have to press the save button (button 6 this time) and give your new voice the name you want. Now you have a clarinet voice with your own settings. You can now store this new voice file wherever you want. But keep in mind that this is not really a new voice, it is just a small MIDI file that tells your keyboard to play the voice with your own settings. Therefore it may not work on another keyboard model. Hope this helps :)
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline andyg

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2020, 07:44:02 PM »
On my Downloads page of my website there's a download of three Acker Bilk clarinet voices - one for each of the three different tones he uses in 'Stranger on the Shore'.

They all need you to either operate the Mod Wheel to add the distinctive vibrato sound (though that vibrato is actually more tremolo - amplitude modulation - than pure vibrato - pitch modulation), though you can set one of your footswitches to control this. The vibrato is on or off, no need to be fussy when you use the mode wheel.

If you want a Clarinet to edit yourself, then go into Legacy and choose one of the older ones - don't waste time trying to edit a Super Art or Super Art 2 voice, as they have too many characteristics built into them. IIRC, German Clarinet is a good starting point.
It's not what you play, it's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

www.andrew-gilbert.com
 
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Offline JohnStarbuck

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2020, 11:13:54 PM »
Also you may TRY to play the clarinet voices as they are on your keyboard, but LOWER the Upper Octave button DOWN one octave.  See what you think? Best, John
 
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Offline Rolf Lindell

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2020, 08:01:32 AM »
Thanks for all tips. I have tried the most simple, to lower it one octave. That's OK but I still want something more.
Its more of a feeling in the sound. I try out all the other tips
PSR S770
 

Offline jwyvern

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2020, 02:28:52 PM »
Rolf,
If the main clarinet on your keyboard is jazz clarinet that one is also present on Genos (in the legacy folder) which I have.
It has quite a rich lower range hence for say Stranger on the Shore it is a good idea to use a lower octave setting as already pointed out. But by default it has too much attack to be be smooth. So find the voice editor on your keyboard, look for Attack (in the Sound category?) and increase it say to 8 or so. (which works on Genos).
Play the voice while in the editor to listen while changing things. While there you might like to raise reverb in the Effect category say to 30. See how it sounds.
It tends to lose some steam in the higher registers, so if you want to adjust this go to EQ category, change High to 2.8 kHz with gain 8, and low to 1.6 kHz gain 4. (Just my quick suggestion, you might find better).
Finally if you want to go that far you could add a DSP to boost the high ranges a bit more.
Go to Effect category, insertion effect, turn ON, and in Type go to Distortion and select MultiFXvintage Echo.
See if that sounds better (or worse!). If you want to keep it go to the editor Common category and change Mono/ poly to Mono (Prevents you getting nasty distortion sounds if you accidentally scuff more than 1 note while playing.)
To keep the voice touch the Save icon at top of the editor screen assuming it is similar to Genos and save it to a folder which you use for such voices.

John

PS your keyboard (s770?) may not have the format of the Genos editor, but the parameters mentioned will be there available for changing, in something called voice editor or "voice set" even if the format is different.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 02:39:54 PM by jwyvern »
 
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Offline mikf

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2020, 03:20:17 PM »
Rolf, quit a bit of how a voice sounds is in the playing technique, more than most people realise. When you play the voice demo how does it sound?
Mike
 

Offline Rolf Lindell

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2020, 08:19:59 AM »
When I play the demo-sound the "Jass-clarinet" sounds the best. The "German clarinet" sounds very "German". Kind of hard non sensitive sound.
I cant find the hidden map with XG-sound. What am I doing wrong. Is it to complicated for me?
The song I am trying to play is of course "Stranger on the shore".
Does anyone have a style to share, (with a nice clarinet) that works on PSR S770 I would be very grateful
« Last Edit: February 04, 2020, 08:23:28 AM by Rolf Lindell »
PSR S770
 

Offline Rolf Lindell

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2020, 09:39:53 AM »
I have tryed all the tips I have got here. I am no good at this. I have attached a file
so that you can hear how far I have come so far. I am still not happy. I would like a Little more
softer more emotional sound.

The song is still in progress so be gentle when you hear it.

https://app.box.com/s/ic0quwmolgsyo26n5n3sh5zf19rr67oe
« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 11:47:47 AM by Rolf Lindell »
PSR S770
 

Offline jwyvern

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2020, 11:50:19 AM »
Hi Rolf,
I'm assuming you have listened to Acker on Youtube. There are many nuances he puts in such as changing tremolo and sliding up to pitch rather than keying all notes in separately which would involve a keyboard player being  continually on the mod wheel! However those features can be worked on later if felt to be needed and if possible on the s700.
Two things come to mind listening to the basic clarinet sound in your post.
1. Your  post is in the key of F and the octave used is on the high side for the main part of the song. IMO the octave should be one lower, and in this range the Jazzclarinet is capable of producing richer, more chocolatey tones, which you should find closer to Acker, provided it is suitably adjusted and played.
Acker's video plays primarily in Bflat. If you want to emulate this while continuing to physically play in F raise the keyboard transpose by 5 (after reducing the clarinet octave). When you get to the Bridge in the song, then go up an octave as in the original.
2. The attack on each note played is very noticeable to my ears which detracts from the overall effect. Did you set the attack to 8 as suggested in my previous post? This needs to be combined with a playing technique that is more legato (laid back!) to encourage one note to pass to the next smoothly without the sudden off/ on of more staccato playing (more typical I believe of a classically played instrument). On the s700 attack values of higher than 8 may be needed so be prepared to experiment with the values and technique. (Higher values slow the attack which you will readily find if you go too far).
You might find a reduction in tempo (say to Acker's) helps to achieve this while experimenting.
Also you may wish to experiment with other edits I mentioned before which help to improve the tone, as you progress   ;).

John


« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 01:31:34 PM by jwyvern »
 

Offline mikf

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2020, 03:04:36 PM »
Rolf
John is so right. as I pointed out in my post, playing technique - pacing, phrasing, where he breathes, etc - is usually much more important in emulating a performer than the perfect sound. Your recording is quite competent, but if you are trying to emulate Acker these are the things that count and you are a long way off, yet you are worrying about the voice. Its the wrong priority. I am a bit of a broken record on this, but for some reason people on these electronic keyboards always think everything will be so much better if they can somehow get the sound perfect. My take is quite different - within reason the 'sound' contributes about 20% to authenticity, the playing 80%. By within reason I mean that if you pick a harpsichord its never gonna sound like Acker Bilk, but any decent clarinet sound will usually get you close when everything else is right.
Mike
 

Offline Rolf Lindell

Re: I want a nice sounding clarinet
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2020, 02:12:30 PM »
You are very right about the players skill. I have tried as suggested to transpose to B (5 step down). That sound was much more
 "smooth". I am well aware of that I have much to learn about my keyboard. The instrument is so awarding, even with limited skills
you can make it sound nice.

Thank you all for all the help I got.
PSR S770