Author Topic: S775 Style mystery  (Read 2734 times)

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Offline BogdanH

S775 Style mystery
« on: February 03, 2019, 07:51:34 AM »
Hello

There's a thing I just can't understand about my S775, Here it goes:

If we install a voices&style pack which isn't made exactly for keyboad we use (say, installing 670 or 770 pack on 775) then keyboard will use USER voice (inside expansion pack) in case needed voice isn't found in PRESET voices. Right?

Ok, now if needed voice is missing in expansion pack, then we get silence in channel where that particular voice is needed. In this case we see few dashes instead voice name, indicating that the voice is missing. Right?

Ok, I would prefer if needed voice name could still be seen -with some "missing" indicator. That way, it would be much easier to correct mistakes when creating custom packs (i.e. forgot to select particular voice) or to find similar voice to revoice. But that's not the reason for my writing.

I've installed Vietnamese S770 (also tried S670) pack on my S775. And here, something strange happens...
If I choose some style from installed pack (i.e. 12 Moi nuoc moi trau), S775 simply doesn't load voices needed for that style -those voices are inside pack, of course.
But what's even more weird, S7755 shows those voice names (not with "pack" icon) and plays them as it should. However, when I wish to change that voice (just to see where that voice is), S775 doesn't find it. Of course, I can look after that particular voice (voice Dan Kim, for example) inside USER area, select it and confirm it's the same voice that's S775 using for that style. But mystery doesn't end here...

I've created a pack, which contains only one single style and nothing else -without voices, that is. And guess what: again, S775 plays that style with correct voices! -even they're not installed.
I checked all built-in (PRESET) voices and haven't found a voice, that would be similar to "Dan Kim" voice. So I wonder, where from does S775 get that voice?

Btw. I've checked ppf & ppi files with Hex editor.. strange enough, they do not contain "Dan Kim" string. So, where from does S775 takes this voice name?

Thank you for taking time reading this.
(PSR-S670, PSR-S775) PSR-SX700

Digital Life
Modern Times
 

Offline DrakeM

Re: S775 Style mystery
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2019, 01:03:07 PM »
I never heard of a "Dan Kim" instrument before and was referred to a "Dan Nguyet ".

Are you sure the keyboard is not just replacing the Dan Kim voice with a Banjo/Zither sound with some effects added to it? I doubt that the Dan Kim voice is hidden in your keyboard all ready.

Jorgen has some software that will tell you what the missing instrument is supposed to be. I used it when converting Genos styles to use in my S950 keyboard. But if the voice is only in an addon pack it can not give you the name, but I think it was giving me a Reference Code.

When trying to figure out what the missing instrument is I always start with a NON- Mega voice. If they sound wack-o (like hearing high pitched sounds) you know then you need a MEGA voice. You will have to pick something from your onboard Mega voices or delete the track from the style.

Next I try different types of instruments, i.e. Piano, Strings, guitars and horns to hear if I can rule out any of them that way.

I used this method to re-voice the Mexican Banda pack a few years ago.

Regards
Drake
« Last Edit: February 03, 2019, 01:08:53 PM by DrakeM »
 

Offline BogdanH

Re: S775 Style mystery
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2019, 04:01:41 PM »
Hi Drake and thank you for additional thoughts.

Yes, it crossed my mind S775 is using one of PRESET voices instead of the one in the Vietnamese pack. But (I assume), if that would be the case, then S775 would point me to that voice (as currently selected) when I try to change it.
I'm not familiar with Asian instruments, but I could find Dan Kim instrument on web (which seems to be a variation among many "dan" instruments). Anyway, Dan Kim voice exist inside Vietnamese pack (free download at Yamaha).

Why bother, if the style works fine anyway? Well, the thing is, I wish to understand how things work.. to avoid mistakes when modifying/revoicing styles to my liking.

Best regards
(PSR-S670, PSR-S775) PSR-SX700

Digital Life
Modern Times
 

Offline DrakeM

Re: S775 Style mystery
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2019, 06:45:37 PM »
I converted 7 expansion packs that come out for the S950 keyboard and have all the styles working and sound great using all on board voices. So there is no need to install the packs in order to use the styles. They are all posted at my style page here at PSRTutorial.

To convert the 2 Mexican packs, I did research the type of instruments used to make this sort of music. Then I had to research each of the instruments to find out a similar sounding one on the S950 (not hard to do at all with the voice now available on these keyboards).

I am not at all familiar with Vietnamese music style and was the reason I didn't attempt to convert the S950 Vietnamese pack or any of the other Asian packs to work in my S950 in a similar manner.

As I recall I used Jorgen's program to find the OTS voices the style used. Then if I was stumped for a missing voice in the style I would see if one of the OTS voices sounded good in the missing style part and used it. Just another way of figuring out how to dress up the style.

But like I stated Asian music, I would be at a total lose musically to know what would sound correct and acceptable.

Regards
Drake
« Last Edit: February 03, 2019, 06:47:42 PM by DrakeM »