Author Topic: Getting the best from styles  (Read 2635 times)

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Offline YammyFan

Getting the best from styles
« on: June 18, 2018, 08:55:17 AM »
Sometimes I download a style from the internet, and am very disappointed. Maybe , it is because  maybe I am not taking advantage of all that it has to offer.There are thousands of styles offered on this Forum , but I have been unable to find directions on how to use them.
I am wondering if it is because I nearly always use the Style Control Main Variations Labelled A B C D  and Break.   Should I not do this, but use the four OTS buttons on the right hand side of my PSR 750.
Some times I use the intros and the Endings, and sometimes they are wonderful. All too often the multipads offer only a dull thud.

Offline Graham UK

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2018, 09:24:20 AM »
All 3rd party styles I download I adjust to my liking.
ie:Some Style parts  have volumes far to high and a number of OTS set also far to high at 127.
If a Style is worth keeping then a little time is worthwhile adjusting the settings.
After a long time of doing this it's quick to do depending on number of adjustments required.
T2 + NP30
 

Offline Denn

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2018, 10:12:39 PM »
Hello, With the huge number of genuine Yamaha styles available for free and some converted  Korg styles it is hardly worth the bother of messing around trying to 'modify' someone else mess. I have a multitude of styles right back from early days of my PSR's and they generally work on my T4. The bottom line to amateur produced styles is that you won't make a silk purse out of a sows ear. Regards, Denn
Love knitting dolls
 

Offline panos

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2018, 03:47:45 AM »
It takes time to modify a style that was made to another model to sound also nice to your keyboard.
Usually for every part the voices must change and then equalized with the mixer to sound like it was made on your keyboard.
For saving time to do all this,
you could use a style that sounds nice on your model and change only few parts of the style with the essembly function (e.g bass and chord1) and then equlalize just these few parts.
So you can have this way some characteristic patterns of the song from the other style that didn't sounded that nice on your keyboard.

Offline Paula

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2018, 12:55:40 PM »
if I find a style I really like I Modify as stated above I also take each track and if the voice of the track is not in my keyboard I change it to the voice my T4 uses .I also do the same with a midi 
  I also agree I seldom find a style free on the net that is usable  :) :)
             Paula :)
You Tube
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1xEYzY5g_0Nd5G9TkMY6mA/videos
Tyros 4 and Bose L1 Mod 2 w/tonematch
PSR S970
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2018, 04:29:19 PM »
Nearly every style that I have downloaded lately has been a very rough conversion of a midi file. They have not been tweaked, tuned properly or synched, thus resulting in something totally unusable. Fortunately, I have thousands upon thousands of great styles stored on my USB drive that I can call upon for nearly any song ever made. I also find that most individuals never seem to take the time required to explore their keyboard for a style suitable for a particular song they wish to play. Instead, they come to the forum and ask others to find a style for them. There are so many styles in our keyboards that never get used that it boggles the mind. Do a little searching and you will find a style that fits any song you wish to play, and it's right at your fingertips inside your keyboard/

Good luck,

Gary  8)
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Offline whataguy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2018, 05:14:55 PM »
Amen Gary, I have found almost everything I need to fit my songs from what is already on the Genos. Perhaps as 'The grass is always greener' translates to the 'The styles are always more stylish'. Thanks for 'saying what needs to be said'. This must be 'Cliche Tuesday'.  Don in MI

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2018, 07:47:32 AM »
Fortunately, I have thousands upon thousands of great styles stored on my USB drive that I can call upon for nearly any song ever made.

Gary

With so many styles to choose from, how do you find the best one for the job? Does it simply come down to experience and memory, or do you employ some sort of classification scheme? I find that the more styles I collect, the harder it is to find one to suit.

Alan
 

Offline Graham UK

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2018, 08:49:02 AM »
Adding to travlin-easy comment. First choice for me is select a style with suitable Drum track for the song then mute the style parts not suitable, then add a mulitpad to fit.
TRY...mute all parts accept Drums & Bass, now find & add a MulitiPad. Other style parts can be un-muted if you think they fit the song.
T2 + NP30
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2018, 09:15:39 PM »
Alan, for me it all boils down to knowledge of the songs and styles that I have available. For example, in the movie Road House, there was a song that I really enjoyed, Hoochie Coochie Man. I downloaded the lyrics and chords from Ultimate Guitar Tabs, then downloaded the song from You Tube and converted it to an MP3. The next step was to go through the PSR-S950's onboard styles and find something that would be suitable for the song. The very first step to this is to select any style, makes no difference which style as long as it has the same beat, then, while listening to the song, use the tap tempo and synch the keyboard with the song's tempo.

Next, I just start going through the styles in the genre of the song, in this case R&B, and when I find something close, I then go through the variations to determine which ones would be suitable, then determine how to fit in the breaks,  fills, multipads, and right hand comps.

Once this is completed, then I work on the vocals, and using the transpose button, figure out what key would be in my comfort zone, then do a couple practice runs to get the inflections and phrasing correct. If it all seems to come together, I usually load the information into my Music Finder Directory so it can be instantly recalled at a later date.

The final step is to record the song as a one shot deal using the keyboard's onboard recorder. This gives me an idea of how the song will sound when performed live, which for me, was the most important aspect.

Granted, this may seem like a lot of work just for one song, but when you are a full-time entertainer you want every song to sound professional, and as close to the original as possible.

At one time, I had nearly 4,000 songs in my aging brain and the settings for them were stored on USB drives and floppy disks - it was an insane number to work with. I finally whittled that down to just over 750, selecting the best songs to dance to, and songs that would be instantly recognized by most of my audiences.

For those folks that have downloaded the contents of my USB drive, they will find all of the styles I worked with in addition to those in my PSR-S950. Many link directly to the MFD, therefore, if they were to load my MFD from the USB drive into their keyboard, they would benefit from all the work I put into creating my custom MFD for the S-950. And, I believe it will transfer to most other PSR arranger keyboards, at least the newer models.

Hope this helps,

Gary 8)
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2018, 09:51:08 PM »
Wow Gary! What a fulsome reply. Iíve read it once, itís nearly 10 oíclock in the evening, and Iím struggling to get my breath back. I shall read it again in the morning and see if a tyro like me can salvage anything from a pro like yourself.

Thank you in anticipation.

Alan
 

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2018, 11:02:24 PM »
Gary

Just one question before I go to bed, where do I find these style collections of yours please?

Alan
 

Offline panos

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2018, 11:34:13 PM »
 
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Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2018, 11:56:31 PM »
Panos, the Gig Disks were early on. You can download the entire contents of my USB drive HERE .

Enjoy,

Gary 8)
« Last Edit: June 20, 2018, 11:58:12 PM by travlin-easy »
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Offline J. Larry

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2018, 01:48:11 AM »
After everythingís said and done, I find that I use Yamahaís onboard styles most of the time.  Itís all there for the most part.  Iíd rather move forward quickly, rather than spending hours tweaking downloads and style conversions and, then, still not be satisfied with the result.

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2018, 02:49:26 AM »
J. Larry, the good thing about the styles in my USB drive is that they have all been tweaked and tuned. :)

Good luck,

Gary 8)
Love Those Yammies...
 

Offline DrakeM

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2018, 02:50:19 AM »
I agree with how Graham UK begins the process of hunting for the correct drum and bass pattern but please note the two will generally not be in the same Yamaha style. Also in a song the drum pattern and the bass pattern usually changes and I also find these as well.

After finding these two main parts the process Gary (Travelin-Easy) described is the what I also follow.

I donít use multi pads when performing but instead I will play the riffs or I record them into the style parts. Also all the patterns found in the multi pads can also be found in the Yamaha styles. I copy the patterns and add them to my custom style creations. It makes it much easier to keep it all perfect when playing and singing live.

The midi song files that have been converted into a Yamaha style can be very useful when creating a custom song style. However, you will generally need to add/or replace patterns in the style with ones you find in the Yamaha styles found on your keyboard.

A recent case in point is the style I began with to create the one my own custom style I use to perform ďIn the MoodĒ, which is still posted here:

http://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,44836.0.html

It all comes down to how perfect you want to make the style. I have only found a handful of the Yamaha styles that work perfectly for performing any song. Generally only about halve of what you need is provided. But it is pretty simple and easy to tweak into the style the missing other half if you are just willing to take the time to do it correctly.

Regards
Drake

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2018, 11:05:07 AM »
This thread has opened up a whole new world to me. A big bunch of ready-made styles and the basic techniques of the art of making and fitting the best style to a song. I shall really enjoy this. Thank you everyone.

Alan
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2018, 02:34:20 PM »
Yes, but you can change anything in any style using Style Creator, the onboard program in your keyboard.

Gary 8)
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Offline panos

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2018, 04:32:22 PM »
After everythingís said and done, I find that I use Yamahaís onboard styles most of the time.  Itís all there for the most part.  Iíd rather move forward quickly, rather than spending hours tweaking downloads and style conversions and, then, still not be satisfied with the result.
yes you are right on one hand Lary.saving lot of time this way but on the other hand ma!king a new style may have a result that is unique.
Some like to hear a song to sound as much close to the original,some may like to use its melody with a  different arrangement.
Not everybody likes to hear different versions of songs but like everything in life, we don't get bored of  things at the same rate.

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2018, 05:57:02 PM »
I've been playing Moonlight Serenade all afternoon using style after style from Gary's collection (and jolly good they are as well). It sounds rather fine to a rumba beat, although I expect the purists would frown at the idea.

Offline panos

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2018, 08:13:22 PM »
One good thing about been amateur Alan, is that we don't have to play in front of an audience so we have to learn/play something they would like the way they may like to hear it,
which probably should be something familiar to them.
As long as we play just for our own musical satisfaction I don't find anything wrong when it comes to just a personal taste.
I would remix even a national anthem if I would like to play one. ;D
Fortunately there are so many kinds of "orchetstras" and "bands" in our keyboards to choose from...
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2018, 08:15:01 PM »
Glad you guys and gals are enjoying the styles from my collection.

All the best,

Gary 8)
Love Those Yammies...
 

Offline whataguy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2018, 08:24:48 PM »
THANK YOU Gary - This is the kindest, most giving and unselfish gestures I have ever experienced in my life and is so much of what we come to expect from this forum. You have raised the bar so high for the rest of us on this or any other forum. I just hope I live long enough to use your contributions. We can only wish that we will get the opportunity to repay your kindness. You deserve the MVP award for this forum. Thank you again. Don in MI

Online Toril S

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2018, 08:38:49 PM »
I also have them Gary, and am forever grateful! :)
Toril S

PSR S970, PSR 2100 and PSR-47.

Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2018, 09:24:15 PM »
Iím a comparative newcomer to this forum, but in my, albeit limited, experience this thread is the most beautiful example of selfless, fraternal, mutual friendship that I have experienced anywhere on the internet. I donít mind admitting that it brings tears to my old eyes and I count my self as very fortunate to be part of it. Thank you, all if you.

Alan

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2018, 11:21:13 PM »
Thanks everyone for the compliments, and I only wish I could contribute more. As you can see from my profile, I have been on this forum for many, many years, and consider it the best arranger keyboard forum on the internet. If there is ever anything you need, just PM me or post the request and I will do my very best to fulfill your requests.

All the best,

Gary 8)
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Offline mikf

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2018, 01:56:45 PM »
One additional thing that may help people to select a style that some may not be aware of - you can set the keyboard so that when changing from style to style it keeps the same tempo rather than return to original default style tempo as long as you do not stop the style. This means you can audition styles for a song very rapidly. Just select a possible style and tap in the tempo you want to play. Then hold down a chord or two while humming the tune in your head, cycle they other possible  styles and keep going. You will find you can try dozens of possible styles against this song in no time. Then narrow it down till you are happy.
Another big plus with this setting is that you can also change styles seamlessly in a single song, ie select a different style just as easily as selecting a different variation.  This can sometimes be very effective.
Mike

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2018, 02:47:15 PM »
Mike

....or, you could Function button/Button G (Style) and freeze the tempo by choosing the appropriate setting.

Iím 150 miles away from my arranger, so I canít give you the details, but itís fairly obvious.

Alan
 

Offline mikf

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2018, 07:55:46 PM »
Yes, you can do that, but freezing tempo means the tempo stays the same no matter what.  The tempo hold on the style setting only holds the tempo if you change style while playing. You go into style setting on the menu and then change behavior. Tempo hold is the option you select. As soon as you stop playing and select a new style it behaves normally ie plays at the default tempo, which is usually what you want. 
This is worth trying. I don't think too many people know about this, but its a very neat setting because it means you can move between styles while playing and I keep my keyboard set this way all the time. Its great for auditioning styles very quickly, but it also lets you smoothly change styles during a song, to a broadly similar style, but different enough to have an impact.
Cheers
Mike
 
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Offline whataguy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2018, 08:59:30 PM »
Thanks for your input Mike, BUT could you explain how to do that using little words so I can grasp just how to accomplish that. Much like Paul does with some of hie explanations ie: #1 do this, #2 then do this, #3 etc. Some of the styles that work good at 192 bpm sound even better at 126 bpm. Just sayin' . . . Don in MI

Offline panos

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2018, 09:24:22 PM »
The way I choose to modify a style.
Direct access-> tempo lock.
Keep playing with different styles while still practicing parts of the song so there is no waste of time.
Wright down the parts that may fit nicely to the song.
No matter what style as long as it is, lets say a 4/4 rhythm.
Some they fit, some they are way out, so you move quickly to the next style.
Choose the closest style as the basic and start the assembly function with the parts you have written down.
Keep practicing the song while modifying the style.
When you have done, at least you have practiced the song without been boring by the continous repetition of the same style and melody and perhaps instead of using the classic preset tango style you can have the house tango style thanks to Yamaha's engineers  ;D
https://soundcloud.com/user-74537650/la-cumparsita-tango-house-remix-yamaha-psr-s750-keyboard-cover

Offline alanclare

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2018, 10:21:47 PM »
Mike
I like that little trick. I bet you're right. Not many people know that.

Alan
 

Offline mikf

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2018, 10:32:36 PM »
Don
On my keyboard you touch menu, then touch style setting, then touch change behavior, and finally select tempo hold. But I have a CVP and it is driven by touch screen. Genos might be similar but if you have a PSR or Tyros I canít give you simple step by step because I donít have one of those keyboards. But it will be broadly similar using menu and select buttons.
It is true that some songs sound better with the style set at a different tempo than default but using the tempo hold style setting has no effect on that. Itís easier to understand how it works by trying it than explaining in words.
Mike

Offline whataguy

Re: Getting the best from styles
« Reply #34 on: June 23, 2018, 06:15:43 PM »
Thank you, I'll give it a try. D.