Author Topic: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?  (Read 5435 times)

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Offline Pianoman

Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« on: May 01, 2018, 05:59:26 AM »
Hello Everyone.

I have spent an entire morning with the Genos besides the other four times
that I also tested the keyboard.

I first chose a style I am familiar with from my T3, the Super Groove style,
named differently in the T3.

I then spent a considerable amount of time working the EQ, beginning with the presets
and then slowly adding tweaks.

I also used settings that I copied from StephenM which I found actually
made the Genis sound much better than the presets.

After that I moved on to the Compressor settings, doing basically the same thing.
First the presets,then my tweaks, then StephenM's tweaks again.

All these tweaks and settings gave me the impression that the Genos sounded better
than the first time I ever played it.

But the drums still sounded dull and somehow hollow, not the taut drums that I would have
liked to hear.

I moved on to other styles and the results were the same, no rich tight drums.

Please note that I'm only going on about Drums and Styles, because these 2 things,
especially tight drums and Bass, are the foundation of a great sound, no matter how good
other accompaniment sounds may be.

I have listened to many right hand voices, as well as voices for left hand layering,
and they are indeed good, but not very much better than other previous generation
Keyboards.

I will not go into details like having to tap the display several times before something happens,
as I believe that this subject has already been covered in some posts.

I have hesitated to share these opinions for quite a few days now, because they seem
to upset some people, particularly a couple of persons who frequently consider that any
questioning of the Genos is tantamount to calling them stupid for having bought one.

I am trying very hard to like and find a good reason to buy this instrument, and have
 reserved the necessary cash since January.

But for the 5th time I came out of the store disappointed, especially after all the praise
that I have read, here and elsewhere.

There must be something that I am missing, that makes some people swoon deliriously
 while leaving others lke me disappointed.

This post is not to bash the Genos, and I want to emphasize that I respect each person's
decision on whether to buy one or live without one.

I am honestly trying to understand, and would appreciate some civil and intelligent
responses that try to avoid the usual "Genos good, Genos better" mantra.

I thank you all in advance.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2018, 06:11:57 AM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
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Offline Joe H

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2018, 06:05:51 AM »
"If in doubt... take no action"

 ;)

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2018, 06:13:16 AM »
Thank you Joe, I like that.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline soryt

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2018, 06:43:51 AM »
It is known to professional musicians that their hearing has deteriorated considerably after a number of years, so it is possible that you can no longer perceive the differences.
the differences between the Tyros drums and the Genos are so incredibly big that it must be immediately audible.
Your audience will certainly hear the difference.
But given your experience with entertaining, there is no need to upgrade except if your Tyros is worn or broken.

best Regards

Soryt  :)

Offline XeeniX

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2018, 06:48:26 AM »
Abby

I for one appreciate your insights after the extensive testing you did. I read your previous post and your replies afterwards when you had tested it for the second time. With some of your conclusions I can agree with others I can't but that is mainly because my approach in playing and using a Genos would be totally different and that imho is one of the, if not THE decisive factor.

You approach it as a professional musician. I am a less then mediocre home player (I am not ashamed to admit that :) ). On top of that simple fact I like to experiment a lot with all the options a keyboard has to offer just for fun. Creating registrations, editing styles and voices and so on. Therefor the Genos would be an improvement for me since it has loads of new things that older models don't offer or only offer in a more limited way like the new playlist option v.s. Musicfinder to name only one.

My T5 has more than enough options to keep me busy for quite a few years to come. The voices are more than fine even if the Genos has improved sounds in certain sections. And yet if an interesting offer would be made I would go for it. Simply because it is a new toy with unexplored areas. I will not go as far as to say it's awesome or as you mentioned that some said "God given" because to me it is only a keyboard. To me it is a toy and not a priority in life.

I would say: Live and let live or in layman's terms to each his own. If you are still happy with your T3 than why the doubts whether you should or shouldn't invest in a Genos?  I'd say don't. After all your testing you, by now, at least know what it can do. Time enough to buy one if really needed as in: When the T3 is starting to walk towards the keyboard version of an elephant graveyard. ;)

I listened to a few of your performances you posted on this forum and was an entertained listener wishing my skills and produced sounds were that good :D

happy gigging,
Peter
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2018, 07:58:46 AM »
Thank you Soryt and Peter.

I appreciate the quick responses. My T3 is slowly reaching the end of it's life, after 8 years
of heavy use.

It is probably good for another couple of years, but I think it would be wise for me to buy
a second keyboard and keep the T3 as a backup, hence my weekly visits to the music
store to test the Genos. Five visits so far, the latest one being last Friday the 27th.

I had posted pictures last December or January, that showed broken buttons and some
wobbly ones on ny T3.

The EXIT button is broken, and the DIRECT ACCESS will be next, as it's already quite wobbly.
I tried to repair these buttons myself, but had to stop because of causing damage to the
display.

There are other buttons too, in the Variations section and others I can't think of now.

I am inclining towards a 61 key T5 too, because of my familiarity with the Tyros functions, but wanted
to try the Genos anyway, just to be sure that I am not going to make an expensive mistake.

I have never seen or played a T5, but I'm guessing that most T5 controls, styles, and voices are
something that I would be familiar with.

I have hounded the music store for months to bring a Genos over, and they too are baffled
as to why I am hesitating.

I have the money, but something about the sound of the Genos is holding me back.

It is not my hearing either Soryt. I heard my tie pin drop to the floor last night, as I was
furiously blasting away with Smoke On The Water, while delivering 1800 Watts worth of sound
outdoors, for a Harley Davidson club.

It's not that I can't hear a difference, it's that the Genos drums sound dull, and not tight.
Maybe I'm using the wrong expression to describe my experience.

For practical purposes, I WANT to have a second keyboard.
A lost gig evening because of keyboard failure would mean a big loss of income for me, not
to mention a loss of reputation for reliability.

Professional musicians will understand this, reputation is everything.

I so much want to like this board, pull out some cash, and take it home.
The Harley Davidson crowd already paid for one third of a Genos yesterday.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2018, 08:20:20 AM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2018, 08:40:48 AM »
Than I guess someone close to you needs to do some exercising and lift a foot to err "activate" your decision sensors mwuhaha and force  you to take action. Any action at all :P The most dreadful decision is no decision at all. Pick one and no matter what you pick - (stay at T3 and pray for a longer lifespan, go for T5 for the familiarity and better voices and titled screen, or go for Genos with even better voices and more options but less familiarity and a touchscreen that can't be tilted and so perhaps causing visual problems every now and then during gigs with bright spotlights) - it will be at least A decision and thus better than the non-desisive, doubting path you are on now. :)

kind regards,
Peter
« Last Edit: May 01, 2018, 09:07:12 AM by XeeniX »
 

Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2018, 09:21:58 AM »
Quote
After that I moved on to the Compressor settings, doing basically the same thing.
First the presets,then my tweaks, then StephenM's tweaks again.

Abby, where do I find StephenM's tweaks? I would like to try them.

Also, when you demo'd the Genos, did you play it thorough the identical speakers you play your T3 through? This seems to be a VERY often missed variable - everyone demos a keyboard, but sometimes form an opinion under conditions they can't trust. Not saying you did that, but just thought I'd mention it. You must play the Genos through your system, and at home where you know what your T3 sounds like.

I have a very clear understanding with my music store. I don't demo or buy a $6,000 keyboard in the music store among: the house PA playing crap music of today's vintage, some kid playing Smoke On The Water through a Marshall amp turned up to 11, and a rookie drummer in the corner whose concept of music is "loudest is best" (LOL). No sir, I take it home and A/B it against my old keyboard, through my performance system. Moral: you can't form a reliable opinion until the playing field is level. I did this A/B test with my T5 and Genos. The Genos won hands down. The entire T series is made up of great keyboards, especially in your capable hands (I've heard you play). I would love to hear what you would do with a Genos. Think about it :).
« Last Edit: May 01, 2018, 09:23:46 AM by Lee Batchelor »
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 

Offline markstyles

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2018, 09:27:23 AM »
I believe one must adjust to changes, in new versions of instruments, in new political, business developments, in life in general.. Things are not always going to go the way you want.

The Genos is NOT a Tyros.. I had several issues at first.. But once I let go of my 'pre-conceptions' because I had three generations of Tyros, it was easier to accept the Genos.  There's a few things I'm not thrilled with, but there is little point in bashing now.. 

Just like when you split up with an old girlfriend, the next girlfriend will be different..  You have to accept things grow, change, mutated.. Even your hearing, and tastes change.  If you really feel strongly about the Genos don't buy it. 

But it is fine to express your concerns,  if things are broken, that is a completely different animal.. We are paying top dollar for this top of the line piece of equipment, and it should work perfect.  My experience with Yamaha over the many years, is they care about their products and customers..

You should find the Yamaha department to express your thoughts, regard functionality/design..  However faulty switches, hardware, contact your dealer.  Or it they are flaking out, contact Yamha directly..  Good luck..

Sorry you are not finding the Genos to your expectations.. I am greatly enjoying the extra DSP's and the more mega voices.
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2018, 10:19:15 AM »
Abby, where do I find StephenM's tweaks? I would like to try them.

Also, when you demo'd the Genos, did you play it thorough the identical speakers you play your T3 through?




Hello Lee.

Thank you for the response and advice.

Here are StephenM's settings for Compressor and EQ. I'm sure he won't mind me sharing
them.

I didn't Demo the Genos on my gear, but on my Sennheiser Headphones that I use for making
Registrations om my T3 at home and then playing through my gear.

These are phenomenal headphones that I take everywhere with me. They costed me 95
five ye
Here is an example of a well known song that I worked on at home using the Sennheisers.
It sounds phenomenal on my JBLs and 15 Inch Subwoofer.

It's called Pick Up The Pieces, from Average White Band.
This is a straight sit and play, with no Midi File trickery.


https://app.box.com/s/rdgph7010u4djxe6pajpltritj6w0gen


It makes people jump up and want to dance on tables.

My experience is that, if it sounds right on the Sennheisers, it will sound right everywhere.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 
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Offline DonM

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2018, 10:37:42 AM »
Hi Abby,
As you know I've been following your posts in your ongoing quest to get a new keyboard.  I would like to suggest one thing that you may not have considered.
After 8 years of playing the T3, you may have "grown accustomed to her face" so to speak.
Is it likely that when you hear something different your mind may be interpreting as "not as good"? 
I know from personal experience that this can happen, even to me.  :)
For example you may be so used to hearing the T3 drums that the Genos drums, being admittedly different, don't sound the way you are expecting and thus not as good.
I see so many people get a new arranger and then go to great lengths to make it sound just like the one they are replacing.
Don't get me wrong, I have all the respect in the world for your ability to know what you're hearing, but, having been a little guilty of this myself, thought it might be something you hadn't considered.
For health reasons, I recently sold my beloved Korg PA4X and replaced it with another PSR S970.  (I had one previously for a backup kb).   I TRULY miss the drum sounds, and the vocal processing, and the operating features, on that Korg, but my audiences didn't even know I'd changed keyboards!   Incidentally I will visit with the Genos in the near future.  I don't expect to be blown away, but, like you, I hope I AM.
Now that I'm feeling better, I wish I'd kept the PA4X, but I will carefully audition the Genos, and then decide whether to get one, or simply wait for the Korg top-of-the-line replacement for 4X.
I know you will make the right decision, and that it will be best FOR YOU.  Doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. 
Best wishes my friend!!
DonM
 
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Offline DonM

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2018, 10:40:46 AM »
I just saw the e.q. settings you tried. Man those are some radical settings! 
You would think Yamaha, and the other companies as well, would make these expensive tools sound optimum when you open the box and turn them on.
I know they don't though.  Anyway, good luck again!
DonM
 

Offline stephenm52

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2018, 11:09:08 AM »
Abbey,  No problem at all you posting those EQ settings, Im happy to hear you gave them a try.  Good luck with your future demos and do what you think is best.
GENOS, Clavinova CVP 307, PSR s970, Korg Pa4x-76

Steve's Genos Recordings

Steve's Gig Disks
 
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Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2018, 12:12:17 PM »
Thank you Don and Stephen.

Don, I have not given up on the Genos yet.
I am merely reporting my findings and frustration.

And yes, I too may be guilty of trying to make a new keyboard sound like the one I
want to replace.

On the other hand, whatever keyboard we use, the keyboard becomes us, not the other
way round.

We are the sound, and we will tune whatever instrument, be it Guitars, Drums, Keyboards,
and even tuning/detuning acoustic pianos till the instrument becomes our identifying
fingerprint.

I played in a hotel pool area a few years ago, and there was a tourist who hadn't seen me
 for years.

The last time he had heard me, I was playing Jazz music, with a focus on Nat King Cole
and using a Roland G-800.

This time I was playing Dire Straits and using a T3.

This guy was not a hotel guest, and was just walking past the hotel outside when he heard
the music.

He said he knew it was me, because of my distinctive sound, regardless of the song or
different style of music.

Maybe that's  what it is. I hope this makes sense.

Got to sleep now. It's 5 AM here, important gig today.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline jgriffin

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2018, 12:43:54 PM »
WOWOWOWOWOWOWO!!!!  Pick Me Up...I could dance my you know what off to that Abby.  :)
Janet
PSR Performer page
GENOS, Yamaha Baby Grand, (2) Motif ES8, Tyos 2, (2) Tyros 3, Tyros 5-76, DGX-650 & 660, Yamaha P140, StagePas 300 & 600, (2) Bose Compact, Yamaha
 

Offline panos

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2018, 04:30:18 PM »
Hi Abby,
The sound of drums that you did n't like, reminded me the difference that people find between the drums of Tyros and Pa.
Some think that Pa drums are more realistic and Tyros's more synthesized.
For me it depends whether you like to hear a drummer playing next to you or if you like to  hear the drummer playing in a studio using equipment with effects to boost up sounds.
I think that maybe same happened to you beacause Genos got a new approach of drumkits compare to the other Yamaha's models.

I have read that you are taking your headphones with you,which I also believe is a smart move to test a keyboard's sounds (unless you can take also your speakers with you :P)
but may I ask why some tweked EQ settings should work best whether you can use different models of headphones or differnet models of speakers with a subwoofer or different models of speakers without a subwoofer?
Should n't the Eq settings be tweked not only according to the source of the sound but also according to the exit of the sound and not to mention to the enviroment too?

I hope you find a keyboard or synthesizer that you really like and can boost your creativity along with your Tyros.
A technician can replace those buttons when the season is over.  :)
(Variations section buttons on my psr cost 25 euros+payment of the technician.)

Offline DerekA

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2018, 08:21:28 PM »
Abby

You seem to be trying really hard to convince yourself to get a Genos.

If you don't like it, don't buy it. There's little point in continually looking for something that you're not finding.

You can easily find a used T5-76 for half the price.
Tyros5
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2018, 08:44:49 PM »
Hello Panos.

That's a very interesting question about whether I want to hear a drummer play next to me
or a drummer playing in a studio.

I like to feel that I'm playing with a real drummer next to me.
I posted the song Pick Up The Pieces to illustrate the tight and dry drums that I like ti hear.

If you have noticed, there's almost no reverb effect in the drums.

I do not like overwhelming Echo and Reverb in general, and prefer an absolute minimum
necessary for the drums.

Real drummers do not use reverb, except for 80s music when drum boxes were dripping
with reverb.

I have played in bands till I was 32 years old, and only went it alone because of lack of
discipline among band members.

The drummer in my last band was something to behold, and I always think of him when
tuning drums or listening to drums.

I will repeat again what I said in my original post above. If you've got the drums and bass
nicely tuned and figured out in a style, then you've got your sound.

And the rest of the accompaniment can be either toned down or muted.

I make exceptions for whether I play outdoors or indoors.

A simple quick trick is having my entire user registrations duplicated in another folder, and save
them on the Hard disk.

I then reduce the general master reverb for styles, pads etc, from 64 down to 40 or 32, and
save it all. This will then be what I use for playing indoors.

The reason I take my headphones everywhere is that, through much trial and error,
I have learned how to tweak EQ, Compression, and instrument levels so that the keyboard
sounds as good on my sound system as it does on the headphones.

The subwoofer is for compensating for the lack of depth to the overall sound, since most main
speakers have a problem with very low frequencies.

Best Regards.
Abby.


« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 12:38:13 AM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline Gunnar Jonny

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2018, 09:18:55 PM »
If not manage to mix the effects as you like at Genos itself, maybe there is another way to do it?

Quote ref. manual page 152:
'You can assign any desired part or drum/percussion instrument sound to any of the LINE OUT jacks, for independent output.'

There are 4 line outs, so if send drums totally dry of effects to i.e. 3 or 4 and then to your mixer / PA could be a solution to fit your needs and taste?

Reminds me back when I had the KN5000. Got the optional HD, and the mounting kit had extra line outputs where we could send bass and drums.
Cheers & Happy Playing.  :)
GJ
_______________________________________________
"Success is not counted by how high you have climbed
but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #19 on: May 01, 2018, 09:39:40 PM »
If not manage to mix the effects as you like at Genos itself, maybe there is another way to do it?

Quote ref. manual page 152:
'You can assign any desired part or drum/percussion instrument sound to any of the LINE OUT jacks, for independent output.'

There are 4 line outs, so if send drums totally dry of effects to i.e. 3 or 4 and then to your mixer / PA could be a solution to fit your needs and taste?

Reminds me back when I had the KN5000. Got the optional HD, and the mounting kit had extra line outputs where we could send bass and drums.


That's a good idea Gunnar. Funny that I never thought of that.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2018, 09:42:42 PM »
WOWOWOWOWOWOWO!!!!  Pick Me Up...I could dance my you know what off to that Abby.  :)

Thanks Janet.

Average White Band, Funk at it's best.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline pjd

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2018, 11:19:44 PM »
This is absolutely the BEST thread! Solid, practical discussion. Thanks!

Lots of good advice there, Abby. Totally agree about dialing down the reverb. I play in a reverberant church. What the heck do I need reverb for? I dial in a little reverb for practice at home.

Many of the voices that I've gravitated to are from the T5. The T5 is a fine instrument with a good action. No shame in going T5. Everybody has to live and work within their means, too.

Best of luck and times to everyone -- pj

Offline jwyvern

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #22 on: May 02, 2018, 01:46:44 AM »
Hi Abby,
If you look at your EQ settings they seem heavily skewed towards the mellow. IE. high positive gains on the lower frequencies and (very) high negative "gains" on most of the high freqs. While this gives a fabulous preset mellow full KB piano sound (eg the cfx) it is perhaps not surprising the sizzle is taken out of the Preset drums and any percussion that is also in the samples.  I only play at home but with my Genos and speaker set up, including 75 year old ears let's be honest :) to me those settings severely distort the sounds from my registrations eg.Big Band ensembles or Strings. I realise what may suit one setup EQ wise may not suit another, and of course Stephen is successfully using them but as a rough comparison, my normal frequency categories are similar to yours,  and the gains at 560hz and above, rather than being minus 6 to minus 8 are all slightly positive, a huge difference ?
John
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 02:18:32 AM by jwyvern »
 

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #23 on: May 02, 2018, 04:55:22 AM »
It is known to professional musicians that their hearing has deteriorated considerably after a number of years, so it is possible that you can no longer perceive the differences.
the differences between the Tyros drums and the Genos are so incredibly big that it must be immediately audible.
Your audience will certainly hear the difference.
But given your experience with entertaining, there is no need to upgrade except if your Tyros is worn or broken.

best Regards

Soryt  :)

Soryt,  Very true, the hearing of professional musicians has deteriorated considerably after a number of years. And unfortunately not only for those who make the 110 dB  popo-noise. If you are interested, classical musicians are even more affected.

                         https://www.hear-it.org/the-dangers-of-being-a-musician-1

But not only musicians. A recent study here found that about half of the young jogging with earphones (often so loud that you can hear it when they pass you)  can no more here grashoppers.  My audience are all over 50 and my experience is they want music either as background noise or to dance to. In both cases I am quite sure the difference between TYROS and GENOS  will not be perceptible or of interest to them.  There is no need to upgrade. I did because of the slight difference in weight makes a huge difference to my old back.

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #24 on: May 02, 2018, 06:05:53 AM »

Hello Lee.

Thank you for the response and advice.

Here are StephenM's settings for Compressor and EQ. I'm sure he won't mind me sharing
them.

I didn't Demo the Genos on my gear, but on my Sennheiser Headphones that I use for making
Registrations om my T3 at home and then playing through my gear.

These are phenomenal headphones that I take everywhere with me. They costed me 95
five ye
Here is an example of a well known song that I worked on at home using the Sennheisers.
It sounds phenomenal on my JBLs and 15 Inch Subwoofer.

It's called Pick Up The Pieces, from Average White Band.
This is a straight sit and play, with no Midi File trickery.


https://app.box.com/s/rdgph7010u4djxe6pajpltritj6w0gen


It makes people jump up and want to dance on tables.

My experience is that, if it sounds right on the Sennheisers, it will sound right everywhere.

Best Regards.
Abby.

Abby,
Your excellent phrasing  -  sax player inheritance ? -  was really top notch.  Really musical phrasing can even make monotonous modern rhythms less disturbing. ;)   After you sent me your photo with the sax i understood how  come your rendering of What a Wonderful World  was so exquisite not only musically but show-wise.   I feel what separates the real musicians from the want to be ones like me is phrasing, that kind of wandering some times a little in front and sometimes a little behind and the syncope just in the right place.  The worst being a midi file with the melody quantized  to  1/16.  The piano playing and the singing of Nat King Cole is the perfect example of  phrasing that I miss in to-day's music. The melodies (and their harmonies)  played by Nat King Cole and Louis Armstrong were not always  very complicated - like Charlie Parker's -  but sometimes less is more.  We have a top notch classical  soprano, Grammy award winner  Carita Mattila.  She was performing at a friend's 60th birthday. Everything was fine as long as she performed classical opera arias. Then she made the mistake of singing "Summer Time".  It was embarrassing, I felt sorry for her.   

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2018, 08:46:01 AM »
Hello Panos.




If you have noticed, there's almost no reverb effect in the drums.

I do not like overwhelming Echo and Reverb in general, and prefer an absolute minimum
necessary for the drums.

Real drummers do not use reverb, except for 80s music when drum boxes were dripping
with reverb.


Best Regards.
Abby.

Abby,
I feel exactly like you , "I do not like overwhelming Echo and Reverb in general, and prefer an absolute minimum
necessary for the drums."

I seems effects of all kinds are much overdone. I can still remember when the first echo-machines came out. Until the fifties there were no effects.
The Vocal Harmony on Genos is better than on Tyros - cannot really say why,  what makes it better, but I  have both Helicon and Digitech Studio rack units and the Roland V 7 so I am sure it is not an illusion. BUT you have to use the different voice  settings without the effects or diminish them drastically for a reasonably authentic  singer effect.

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2018, 03:22:59 AM »
Abby

You seem to be trying really hard to convince yourself to get a Genos.

If you don't like it, don't buy it.


Hello Derek.

I was actually looking for some constructive suggestions. That perhaps I'm missing
a trick or tweak to make it sound more alive.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 03:24:45 AM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline DonM

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2018, 10:06:14 AM »
I usually reduce reverb on drums.  Yamaha is notorious for using too much.  Haven't played the Genos yet though.

Offline soryt

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2018, 08:34:53 PM »
To make a long story short , you need a young Tyros 5/ 61 in excellent condition ,playing for many years save .

Soryt  8)
 
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Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2018, 12:34:36 AM »
Not a bad idea Soryt, and it is something I have been seriously considering.
I have also considered the keyboard brand that may not be named here.

Sadly I have not seen, or been able to try out either of these two keyboards.

I have tested a friend's T4 a couple of years ago, and was already VERY impressed.

The T5 would be because I am so familiar with the Tyros series controls, especially
EQ and Compressor settings, but also the tilt screen.

I sometimes play under bright stage lights, or in bright daylight, during the spring
and summer months, so a tilting screen is very helpful to have.

I have heard that the keyboard brand that may not be named here sounds more
authentic and alive, like a real band.

But it does not have the vast support network and the availability of thousands of
modified styles that Yamaha keyboard owners enjoy.

So it will have to be a Yamaha, and maybe buy the other keyboard that cannot be
named just for specific gigs.

I am a very stubborn man though, so I haven't given up on my quest of getting the
Genos to sound just how I'd like it to.

If I manage to find that recipe, I might end up being a Genos owner after all.

Besides, I like the great company and camaraderie here.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2018, 12:53:10 AM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
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Offline panos

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #30 on: May 05, 2018, 01:12:10 AM »
Is Korg about to release the "Lord Voldemort" series or something?  ;D
If there wasn't Korg to keep up the competition, Yamaha's keyboards wouldn't be that good. :)

Offline keynote

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2018, 02:28:48 AM »
Here you go Abby... Tyros 5 with extras.

Yamaha Tyros 5 for sale at A&C Hamilton UK

I have played the Tyros 5 and it is a great sounding keyboard. Since it is a Tyros it will be easy for you to setup and also easy to navigate the menus. You will also save a lot of money over the more expensive Genos. The Genos is a rather new concept compared with the Tyros series so it would take a while to familiarize yourself with it. A&C Hamilton also has free shipping on items over 100.

PS: It seems you are struggling to justify the cost of buying a Genos and I can understand your conundrum.  Since I too have owned a Tyros 3 I can tell you straight up the Genos sounds a lot better than the Tyros 3 and also better than the Tyros 5 although the difference isn't night and day. One of the big improvements on the Genos is the new 32-bit digital to analog converters which makes it sound more polished and indeed more professional sounding. Of course you need to listen to the Genos through a quality sound system in order to hear and understand its full capability. Having said that the Tyros 5 is still one of the best sounding arrangers currently on the market and A&C Hamilton also includes a 1 year warranty and free lifetime support if you ever should need it.

Mike
 
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Offline DonM

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #32 on: May 05, 2018, 04:04:57 AM »
One thought...there ARE plenty of styles available for Korg.  And it has a midi-to-style converter built in that actually works very well. 
You can get plenty of support on the Korg forum and it is even monitored by Korg people. 
DonM
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #33 on: May 05, 2018, 04:09:15 AM »
Thank you Mike for your suggestion.

A T5 (61 keys) is something I'm considering, because of familiarity.
But also because I was very impressed by the T4.

My conundrum is more about sound than it would be about ustifying the price of
 the Genos.
l get to deduct the Genos from ny taxes anyway, if I decide to buy it.

Better to buy something nice for myself, than to give money that I've sweated for
to the taxman.

I'm trying to make the Genos sound nice.

To be fair and honest, I have hardly listened to the voices.
I have listened to as many as I could, but 90% of the morning was dedicated to
listening to the various Rythm sections (Styles) and tweaking the EQ and Compressor.

Styles is basically what I buy arrangers for, especially the drums.
And I  just can't seem to get the drums to sound right.

In my performances I practically only use Saxes, a couple of favourite Guitars, and Brass.
Of the hundreds of songs that I play, I only use Organs in 5 songs, and Strings in maybe
another 5 songs.

It would be great to see some more EQ settings from members here.
I would love to try out as many as possible.

Best Regards.
Abby.

Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Offline Al Ram

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #34 on: May 05, 2018, 04:17:28 AM »
One thought...there ARE plenty of styles available for Korg.  And it has a midi-to-style converter built in that actually works very well. 
You can get plenty of support on the Korg forum and it is even monitored by Korg people.

I really like the Korg styles . . .    thanks
AL
San Diego/Tijuana
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #35 on: May 05, 2018, 04:23:35 AM »
Hello Don.

Yes, I actually saw a demonstrator do the converting on YouTube.
I remember asking you a while back about your experiences with the Korg

I think it was via PM though.
I didn't want to mention the Korg here because it seems to upset some people.

The weight of the Korg would not be a problem for me.
As you know, I move around 185 Kilos of gear rwice everyday,  transporting it, setting it up,
then breaking down, and taking it all home. So a few more kilos won't matter.

I am seriously considering the Korg, as well as the T5.

I rather like the vocal Ooohs and Doo Daps of the T5, in oldie Rock n Roll
as well as in Brazilian styles, plus the Scat style for Al Jarreau's "Roof Garden"

I think that you, doing what I do, will understand better.

I don't have much use for a lot of fancy sounds, besides most top arrangers generally
have nice voices anyway.

I'm more interested in a nice slapping Bass and Rythm section.
I heard some nice PA4X Funk being demonstrated on a French YouTube channel
the other day, quite impressive.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2018, 09:16:06 PM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 
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Offline valio7771

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #36 on: May 06, 2018, 11:54:27 PM »
Hey Abby,

Here's my opinion on what I would do if I where you, if in doubt what to be the upgrade after Tyros 3.

I worked actively on stage at least 5 days a week, with my old 9000Pro as my main keyboard for strait 18 years (and it never ever failed on me, even once), and I also came to a point where I wanted to upgrade for something new and fresh. I bought Korg PA900 which was an amassing value for money keyboard, but I end up working with it for only about 6 month and than sold it, because I didn't like how Korg organised the workflow with their keyboards for live performace, although there where number of advantages over Yamaha in terms of how can you 'mould' it to your taste by giving you the freedom to edit and rearrange all the sounds and styles, and easily get lots of new ones in it for FREE, but I guess that all those good sides of Korg weren't enough to hook me up for it.

So about 3 years ago, I found really nice offer for second hand Tyros 5 and I bought it. The jump between 9000Pro and Tyros 5 is massive in terms of sound and features, and in the beginning I also didn't liked how some things sounded and where organised in it, but in overall, I felt like I was swimming back in my own waters (after the brief Korg 'relationship'). I still miss some things that I've been used in my 9000Pro, but I adapted to the few changes fairly quickly, and I'm a very happy man now.

Now if you allow me, without me trying to over-impose my opinion over your, here's a couple of friendly advices that I also took from other people that knew more than I:

1)
Don't overuse EQ and Compressor in the pursue for better sound. There is a golden rule in sound shaping...less is always more! Those EQ's are there to compensate for the frequency imperfections in the sound reproducer, whether is your headphones or speakers in combination with the acoustics of room that you're listening it in, you're not fixing imperfections in the keyboard this way. Yamaha have employed sound engineers that have brains bigger than Jupiter, which job is to make sure that their keyboards sounds at it's optimal in their Neutral/Flat EQ settings. I know it takes time to adjust if you're used to heavy EQ usage, it's kind of a bad habit like smoking but trust me, if you give your self a chance to listen to your new keyboard the way it comes out of the factory, you'll realize that it makes sense to be this way and you'll thank me later. I used to be like that before, and now I'm very careful and aware when and how much EQ intervention is needed, mainly because I know my speakers frequency response, and with only few minor changes I can adapt the EQ to the room I'm playing in.

2)
Compressor you use ONLY if you look for certain 'colour' in a particular song/genre of music, as it's name suggests, it compresses the sound by narrowing the dynamic range of the sound in order to attenuate only certain range of audio signal by suppressing another. So in overall your sound may become more punchy, but it will be in expense for expressiveness and the dynamic pallet of the sound in total. The compressor (as part of the total sum of the sound) is very commonly used in the modern EDM music, usually in it's extreme settings because that's the sound that they are looking for, very prominent bass and kick drum that makes everything else to 'dip' with each kick, and that's so much for the dynamics in the electronic music (if at all). Philharmonic orchestra, or a simple R&R band is like a breathing organism compared to that, and if you get rid of the dynamics in the band, everything starts to sound louder but dry, bland and unnatural. So, be wise using this option as well. Using compressor in a individual instrument/part is a whole another subject, but I digress...so I'll stop here.

In overall:
Do not try to fool your ears with fancy EQ gymnastics, and give your self some time to adapt to your new keyboard (whatever it is) by listening to it as it designed to sound by those very very highly skilled audio engineers.
Don't expect your new keyboard to instantly sound better than your previous one, you're just too used to the sound of your old one and it takes time for your ears to adapt to the new one.
If you find that Tyros 3 drums sound better than the Genos drums, although I can't agree with you on that under any circumstances, than maybe you don't have to buy it.
I think Tyros 5 may be a better and much more financially friendly alternative for you, since it's still a Tyros, and there are only few major differences, you may adapt much faster to it.
Also, I think that upgrading from Tyros 3 to Tyros 5 or Genos makes more sense, than from Tyros 5 to Genos since there is not such a big jump in generations and not a lot of new features for your buck, that's why I'll probably wait another 3-4 years for Genos 2 or however they decide to name it and see if it's worth doing it.

No bad feelings here, just my opinion and friendly advice.

Stay classy! 8)

Valentin
« Last Edit: May 07, 2018, 08:12:53 AM by valio7771 »
 
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Offline Gunnar Jonny

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #37 on: May 07, 2018, 12:46:29 AM »
.......  There is a golden rule in sound shaping...less is always more! .........

Nice post Valentin.
Btw,
the rule quoted above, is the same I was lucky enough to learn many years ago.  8)
Cheers & Happy Playing.  :)
GJ
_______________________________________________
"Success is not counted by how high you have climbed
but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)
 
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Offline Eric, B

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #38 on: May 07, 2018, 04:34:28 AM »
Very well put Valentine.
Thank you. Fully agree.
Our ears have to get used to a new board for a while before we can fully appreciate it.
Especially the Genos as it sounds so different ...
Eric
Genos, PSR-S970
 
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Offline Toril S

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #39 on: May 07, 2018, 06:38:51 AM »
You keep us in suspense, Abby :) I like that! I would stick to Yamaha, and keep the T3 as a backup, - and then take a leap of feith to the Genos :)
Toril S

PSR S970, PSR 2100 and PSR-47.

Toril's PSR Performer Page
 
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Offline valio7771

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #40 on: May 07, 2018, 12:51:55 PM »
Excuse me everyone if I'm getting to technical here, but I couldn't resist myself to throw some more light and explain myself with simple words, by taking one example from this post, considering EQ.

Again, I want to stress enough the fact that with the example that I'm giving, I'm NOT trying to ridicule the person by exposing his 'mistakes', and showing myself as a 'superior' to him....NO, this is NOT my intention!!! If those settings work for him, and he likes how his keyboard sounds, I'm absolutely fine with that, and I'm not judging anybody.
Everybody is free to ignore what I'm about to say, but if this ends up helping somebody reading it, I'll be more than happy that I helped someone in some way, so let's crack on.

I've saw John early explained those EQ settings from the picture below, and he did pretty good and simple explanation, but I want to elaborate a little bit more on that.


Starting from left to right:

1)
We see that there is +8dB over 140Hz - even the cheapest and crappiest 10" speakers can easily reproduce at least 80Hz at very high sound levels, no problem. So there is no practical reason to give so much gain mid-bass frequency, as long as you're working with speakers not bigger than 6". Such setting may also be very unhealthy for the subwoofers since this is approximately the highest frequency that a sub can reproduce, and if you're pushing it all night, every night like this, you can seriously damage your subs. So I would avoid those settings as any cost, and dial it at around 45-70Hz for 12" subs, 40-60Hz for 15" subs, and around 32-40Hz for 18"subs. and respectively +/-2 dB depending on the room, IF NEEDED !

Important !!! What is Q?
Q-stands for Q factor, that determines how 'wide' the resonator is in relation to the centre frequency....sounds complicated? Trust me it's not, if you let me rephrase it in simple words.
If you imagine the shape of two mountains, one has very pointy top and very steep sides, and another that has very rounded and wide top and gently sloped sides. If you draw an imaginary line through the middle of the mountain, from the highest point to the bottom, this is your frequency 'centre'. The bigger the Q number is, the wider the sides of the mountains are...the smaller the number, the mountain is thinner and sharper.
If you translate those shapes on the frequency graph, the 'mountain' becomes the so called resonator/oscillator. The bigger the Q number, the wider the resonator is, so takes over the neighbouring frequencies around it's centre frequency, and wider band of frequencies are 'involved' in the following EQ process, and vice versa with the smaller Q number.
*EDIT few days after the original post, as reminded by Lee Batchelor:
Critical mistake!!! It's the exact opposite of what I just said. The higher the Q number, the thinner the band wave is, and vice versa, so read everything below in reverse relationship.

2)
+9dB over 315Hz with 0.7Q - here is where I would probably dial mid-bass from 120-200Hz and start to consider which diapason of those frequencies my PA in it's entirety can cope safely under high SPL(Sound Pressure Levels).

3)
-6dB over 560Hz with 4.3Q - so what I see here is fairly wide band of frequencies that are turned down, I can't guess the reason why is it so.
From here on, I can't give you any advices what you should dial, since there is no such thing as 'universal' EQ settings that will sound wicked on anything, in fact...there is such setting, and this is FLAT which I'll encourage everyone to chose.

4)
+4dB over 800Hz with 6.6Q - I'm starting to notice a certain Q pattern here, the higher the frequencies go, the wider the Q becomes until they basically overlap after about 3.0kHz all the way to 10kHz, but at the same time less and less gain is added to each frequency, otherwise the overall sound would have been even more tinny and harsh in the mid/mid-high diapason.

5)
-7db over 1.3kHz with 8.4Q - human hearing is very sensitive in this frequency band and it is easily perceived even by the people who have difficulty in hearing. Again, we see very wide Q band which has been turned down because is very piercing.

6)
-8dB over 3.6kHz with 11Q - Q band is getting wider, and it resulted in significant intervention over the amount of dB needed to 'subdue' the thinning of the sound.

7)
-7dB over 5.6kHz with widest possible Q - again, we're keep adding more and wider band of high frequencies, but than, we have to turn them down because it sounds thin and high pitched. And this is still mid-high diapason where human hearing is still very sensitive.

8 )
-6dB over 10kHz (I'm surprised how the keyboard didn't pop-up a message "System Error. Run out of Q"...just kidding ;)
Here is where I'll advice everyone to double check your HF(high-frequency) driver specifications, in order to dial this setting to your specific speaker. Adult man/woman above 70 y.o. with averagely good hearing, will struggle to hear anything above 12kHz (there is always exceptions of coarse), although it is scientifically proven that women in general have slight advantage over man in this aspect.

Noticed something curious in this order and gaping of frequencies?
From knob 3 to 7 there is exactly 10kHz frequency range in total (from 560Hz to 5.6kHz) , and since the Q is quite wide in overall, so there is not a single frequency gap at all along from knob 5 to 8, and than there is massive, nearly 5kHz frequency gap ONLY between knob 7 to 8. That could have been spread much more reasonably so there is no big frequency gaps, and the overall sound would have been much fuller and richer...anyway, this is just an example.

So, how to conclude all this...simply use Flat EQ in 90% of the time, because it's practical, true to ears, convenient and very professional.
Know your PA, and use the EQ as a chef uses salt...to much of it spoils the dish. Use EQ to fix imperfections in speakers, not in keyboards.

I wish everyone lot's of fun playing with your keyboards, whether professionally or at home.

Yours,

Valentin
« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 09:06:43 PM by valio7771 »
 
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Offline DonM

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #41 on: May 07, 2018, 03:18:34 PM »
Well said and very perceptive.  EQ, as you said, is a very personal matter, but extremes should be avoided.  As I've said for years, boosting every frequency is simply turning up the volume.

DonM
 
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Online terryB

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #42 on: May 07, 2018, 04:34:12 PM »
Thanks Valentin for that detailed and informative explanation of EQ settings.
I tried the settings that Abby used (as in your post above) and they did not suit my surroundings at all. In fact they knocked all higher frequency sound, took out the crispness in the drums and produced a totally 'muzzy' sound.

I have tried several sets of settings from previous posts, plus adding to the Yamaha preset settings, but as Don says you are just increasing the volume. So now I will just use the best sounding preset and set the volume to what I want to hear.

Cheers
Terry

 

Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #43 on: May 07, 2018, 08:26:06 PM »
Quote
The bigger the Q number, the wider the resonator is, so takes over the neighbouring frequencies around it's centre frequency, and wider band of frequencies are 'involved' in the following EQ process, and vice versa with the smaller Q number.

I believe you have that backwards, Valentin. A wave with a Q factor of 1 has a wider base than the base of a wave that has a Q factor of 2 (for example). It's an inverse relationship. The higher the Q factor, the skinnier the wave. See the picture.

Great explanation my friend! Thanks for posting all that info.


« Last Edit: May 07, 2018, 08:27:19 PM by Lee Batchelor »
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 
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Offline Tankdave

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #44 on: May 07, 2018, 09:58:28 PM »
I was wondering about the Q value explaination? 

After reading all this I had an experiment and the low Q values on the Genos do make more notable difference.

So we saying that the lower Q-values are indeed the "wider" ones
 

Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #45 on: May 07, 2018, 10:57:43 PM »
That's correct, Dave.
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 

Offline panos

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #46 on: May 08, 2018, 12:26:31 AM »
I found a couple of videos for the "Q" value.
Hope they are helpful with the graphics,because these technical things in a foreign language for some of us, is giving us a really hard time  ;D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ikzPfIXRmQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDAgY6ZEAds
 
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Offline tyrosman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #47 on: May 08, 2018, 01:02:07 AM »
the only way I see this Abby you Either Buy it or Don't Genos is a fantastic Keyboard all Round
Genos
 

Offline Pianoman

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #48 on: May 08, 2018, 01:33:47 AM »
Thank you Valentin.

Your explanation is very helpful. And thank you Lee for the graph as well.
The EQ settings I posted belong to StephenM, which I used as starting point, after
trying the preset EQs of the Genos, which did not satisfy me.

I then kept adding my own tweaks to see if that would make the instrument give me a
sound that I might like.

Lee wanted to see the settings of StephenM, that's why I posted them.

I would love to see which settings you use, if you don't mind posting a
picture or screen grab.

I would like to try them.

Best Regards.
Abby.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2018, 09:39:28 PM by Pianoman »
Musicians don't retire; they stop when there's no more music in them.

Louis Armstrong.


Welcome To My YouTube Videos.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJo1iW9nz1GWzeg1QBl-1wVx14CDWlBqx
 

Re: Genos - Is There Something I Am Missing?
« Reply #49 on: May 08, 2018, 02:10:31 AM »
the only way I see this Abby you Either Buy it or Don't Genos is a fantastic Keyboard all Round

No doubt, and that is a general and accepted attitude on this site,  like  enjoy what you have and don't worry about  money...because once you're dead, 'you can't take it with you.'

But  is not  the the whole idea of this site is to give us information so that we can make an intelligent decision based on verified details. I have no difficulty with your statement "Genos is a fantastic Keyboard..."  its the last two words that I  am so far not sure about and seriously contemplating whether I should wait for Genos II.
For different players different things are important. He who does not have to re-tweak 200 midi files the Genos-way has less to ponder.

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting