Author Topic: Genos problems  (Read 3755 times)

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Offline Gloria

Genos problems
« on: April 20, 2018, 10:45:16 AM »
Hello Everyone!  A friend of mine asked me "How do you like your Genos? The following is my experience!

"Hi, thanks for thinking of me & saying "all the best,,, ENJOY EVERY MINUTE!" My friend, it's actually been a nightmare of problems!  😕  They boxed it up for me & it didn't fit in my 4 door Oldsmobile or trunk; had to put it in the back seat & have a couple feet of it sticking out the window!  I was thankful I live only 3 mi. away & took a side st. so I could go slow!  They said they don't deliver - yet they have pianos & organs for sale???

 I set it up & found out they didn't include any of the electric cords!  They also had to order  the correct MNS0 speakers (which are on back order until July) so they sent a substitute amp & didn't even include the cords to plug it into the wall, let alone the keyboard!  This was at the only so-called "music store" we have in this area of 600 thousand people - which is Guitar Center, a national chain. I should've ordered on line, but I'm one of these old-fashioned people who want to support our local businesses!  Fortunately I did have a professional & excellent demo by Manuel Dorantes, who is also a member of PSR Tutorial!

"After a lot of phone calls, the store manager appeared at my door with some of the missing equipment and the rest is on back order.  A good thing I can say about the Genos, the sound is really fantastic and once I have the correct set-up, it should sound even better!  The different features, like sliders ---- I have no idea what they do because the store didn't have any Owner's Manuals ??? , but it's not that hard to experiment; I just don't want to ruin something; plus I don't have time to experiment & want to read the manual.  Anyway, that's my experience so far!

Gloria Hanson
« Last Edit: June 22, 2018, 12:34:32 AM by Gloria »
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Ed B

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2018, 10:50:37 AM »
H Gloria
Congratulations on the Genos. Sorry to hear about the poor performance of the vendor.
You can download the manuals
https://usa.yamaha.com/products/musical_instruments/keyboards/arranger_workstations/genos/downloads.html
Regards
Ed B
Keep on learning
 

Offline Gloria

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2018, 10:59:42 AM »
Ed, I really appreciate your help & how you've downloaded the manuals.  :)  I'll print out each pg. & make my own manual, thanks to you.  I guess this is the modern way business is done ????   But it is an awful lot of extra work for the buyer!  :(

Regards, Gloria
« Last Edit: April 20, 2018, 11:02:36 AM by Gloria »
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Pino

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2018, 11:24:04 AM »
Gloria, please try and use the PDF manual
It’s so easy
If you want to search for eg, ‘midi in’
Then it will highlight every page that ‘midi in’ on the page.
And can go directly to that page.

Happy Playing 🎹

Pino
« Last Edit: April 20, 2018, 11:28:43 AM by Pino »
S910 - S950 - S970 - Maui 5s
 

Offline markstyles

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2018, 12:05:59 PM »
Congratulations Gloria..
 

Offline Gloria

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2018, 01:59:24 PM »
PINO, thank you for the above message.  I'm not a computer techie & I'm not even sure what a PDF manual is!   ::)  No instructions or Owners Manual  were included with my keyboard.  I asked about them & the manager said they didn't have any or even offered to get any!

Gloria
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Pino

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2018, 02:19:04 PM »
Books are sometimes ok
I have 6 keyboards and many gadget
I probably would have 25 books so PDF,s is easier for me.

I’m sure someone here better than me will explain how PDF’s work,

Pino
S910 - S950 - S970 - Maui 5s
 

Offline keynote

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2018, 07:02:12 PM »
The Portable Document Format is a file format developed in the 1990s to present documents, including text formatting and images, in a manner independent of application software, hardware, and operating systems. One of the most popular PDF software programs is Adobe Acrobat Reader DC which is a free program and be downloaded from the www.adobe.com website if you don't already have it on your computer. PDF is now an open standard maintained by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO). PDFs can contain links and buttons, form fields, audio, video, and business logic. They can also be signed electronically and are easily viewed using the free Acrobat Reader DC software. The Yamaha Genos manual(s) online i.e. Owner's Manual and Reference Manual are PDF files.

Here in the United States when you purchase a Genos a hard copy of the Owner's Manual is already included in the box along with the power cord and sheet music stand. From your description it sounds like you purchased a Genos that wasn't factory sealed in a box. If that is the case then I can understand why parts may have been missing but Guitar Center certainly should have done a better job providing the necessary parts once the sale was completed. Did you purchase a new Genos that was factory sealed in a box or was it a demo unit? Either way I hope your experience with the Genos is a pleasant one once you get it up and running to your satisfaction.

Mike 
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2018, 07:10:53 PM »
Hello Gloria,
   Pleased you have got your Genos but not pleased with how the dealer has acted. I would certainly drop Yamaha a line as to how you have been treated. All documents should have been in a sealed packet in the box which also should have been sealed also.
   Hope all goes well for you.
 

Offline soryt

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2018, 08:15:02 PM »
Bring the Genos back to the shop and get youre money back , it is a great shame how this store treats its customers.
here in the Netherlands this would mean the end of his business if he does this more often.

Soryt :)
 

Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2018, 08:53:48 PM »
Agreed about returning the Genos. Guitar Center needs to be told about this. You didn't buy a $199 toy keyboard to see if you'd like an arranger style keyboard. You bought a $6,000 keyboard because you are a serious player. Genos is currently the best arranger on the planet.

In Canada, I deal with Long and McQuade (L&M). They have 50 stores and an online order system. Every piece of gear I have ever bought was factory sealed and complete, except a Korg Trinity. I had to settle for the floor model because I needed it at the time and they were back-ordered. L&M dropped the price quite a bit because it had been the floor demo unit.

They lent you a sound system? Did they at least give you two speakers so you can hear the Genos in stereo or did they give you a crappy keyboard amp? They came to your house when they realized that they really screwed up. That means they could have easily delivered your Genos. Three miles away? Come on! Deliver the keyboard! It's not like you're asking them to start an ugly precedent!

I'd tell Yamaha and the Guitar Center head office people about your terrible experience. In my opinion, you have some money coming back or they can exchange your Genos with a factory sealed version. Sorry for the rant, but there's too much "me, me, me" in this world today. I ran a service business for 25 years and became fairly well off as a result. It was all because I "under-promised and over-delivered" unlike too many narcissistic, profit junkie, businesses of today!
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2018, 09:52:06 PM »
Hi Lee,
  This is a bad way to do business and must be reported. Yamaha are a company that gives the best service and after care advice I know of and I am sure will be horrified to hear how there customers are being treated.
 
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Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2018, 10:13:50 PM »
Agreed Eileen!

When I reported the small surface flaw on my Genos, L&M called Yamaha right away. Within 1 day, Yamaha responded with two solutions:

1 - Replace my keyboard but that wouldn't happen until July. They really didn't want to exchange a 5 month old Genos either, which I don't blame them for. Still, they were willing to do it.

2 - Refund part of my purchase.

I chose number two. The whole complaint--> resolution happened in two days. L&M instantly credited my card for the amount authorized by Yamaha. In turn, Yamaha would refund L&M, so I didn't have to wait months for the refund process. Hat's off to L&M and Yamaha for stepping up to the plate with a smile.

Now, if we could only convince Yamaha that Canada should receive new releases on the same schedule as the rest of the planet, I'd be happy. There's no excuse for not having them here in a timely manner when you hear of Genos keyboards sitting in European music stores - not moving or when a state in the U.S. (35 miles across the big lake) has had them for four months.
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 

Offline pjd

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2018, 10:25:31 PM »
"Guitar Center"

That pretty much says it right there. I don't want to start an avalanche of posts, but suffice it to say that Guitar Center is a national chain that is near bankruptcy. (Seriously, if we all post about GC, things will get out of hand...  :o )

If a U.S.A. someone would like to support a small business, then I would recommend Audioworks CT or one of the other smaller shops that are mentioned in the Forum from time to time. These shops reliably handle nationwide delivery and customer support. Full disclosure: I bought both an S950 and Genos from Audioworks and was quite pleased each time.

All the best to you, Gloria! I've had issues like this with GC, too. Hopefully, a few hours playing Genos will help you out!  :D

-- pj


 

Offline Gunnar Jonny

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2018, 10:26:40 PM »
..... No instructions or Owners Manual  were included with my keyboard.  I asked about them & the manager said they didn't have any or even offered to get any!

What a shame, and what a bad way to treat a customer as well as give bad reputation for Yamaha sellers represantives.  :o >:(

Manuals, power-cord, several documents such as i.e. free download offers from Yamaha etc has always been a part of the box contents whatever keyboard I've bought during the years.

Regarding manuals, they often get updated versions when keyboard OS get updates and new functions are added, so to download and read pdf or print out whats new may be a good thing to do.

Hope things going to be sorted out and that you going to love your Genos.
To me it's the best arranger Yamaha has put together so far. :)
Cheers & Happy Playing.  :)
GJ
_______________________________________________
"Success is not counted by how high you have climbed
but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)
 

Re: Genos problems / manuals and reference manuals
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2018, 06:42:42 AM »
Hi Everyone,
YAMAHA keyboards are delivered with the manual (here there is an English, German, French and Finnish manual in the box) but I have had to download the English reference manual, which also is a PDF. What is impractical with PDF documents is the fact that you cannot alter them as you can with a Word document so you have a huge amount of unnecessary stuff being printed by your computer in case you do not go through all the pages and then specify which pages you want to print. The original idea of PDF was that you cannot alter what you receive. There are dozens of offers for  PDF to Word conversion. They may work with simple documents, with complicated documents like a keyboard manual they are completely useless. The only really working conversion  is that by Adobe which you can subscribe to.  I do convert manuals with that software which permits me to delete all the unnecessary stuff in manuals beginning with "Thanks for buying our XYZ"  to all the legalese which you really do not want to thicken your manual with.  In that way I get a  50 page manual having about 25 pages and can even yellow the important things, and add things I find on sites like this one. If manuals were perfect this site would have less threads.  ;)

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Offline Toril S

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2018, 08:05:21 AM »
Hi Gloria. Call the main office of the Guitar center chain and complain about this. I am so mad at them for doing this to you!!
Toril S

PSR S970, PSR 2100 and PSR-47.

Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline manuel

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2018, 10:20:30 AM »
Dear Gloria

Please call me, I will be glad to make a house call, but, make sure you write all of your questions, that way we can answer one by one, I no longer trust my memory, and that is the advise I give you too....I have some events to play and some demonstrations to do for Yamaha, but, I will be glad to see you.

I will be gone in the near Summer (escaping the Arizona heat to my home town in Mexico for almost 8 weeks), and I will prefer to have you settle with the fabulous Genos....
Keep in touch.

Manuel Dorantes
My 2 Cents

Manuel
 

Offline stephenm52

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2018, 10:52:59 AM »




If a U.S.A. someone would like to support a small business, then I would recommend Audioworks CT or one of the other smaller shops that are mentioned in the Forum from time to time. These shops reliably handle nationwide delivery and customer support. Full disclosure: I bought both an S950 and Genos from Audioworks and was quite pleased each time.


Gloria congratulations on your Genos and sorry to hear of your problems with GC.  I echo PJDs comments about AudioWorksCt.   I met Frank back in 2007 and have bought 10 arrangers from him since meeting him.  He’s  a top guy who you can call any time for follow up. 
« Last Edit: April 21, 2018, 10:55:01 AM by stephenm52 »
GENOS, Clavinova CVP 307, PSR s970, Korg Pa4x-76

Steve's Genos Recordings

Steve's Gig Disks
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2018, 10:53:06 AM »
Gloria,

I would suggest you ask the store to replace their "demo" Genos with a factory sealed instrument. They sure do sloppy business at that store.

 >:(   :(   :o

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Gloria

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #20 on: April 21, 2018, 11:18:45 AM »
Hi fellow keyboard players.  Yes, even though this keyboard was a demo, I still expected service from Guitar Center.  I want to thank the following for their understanding & support:  Ed B, Pino, Mark, Mike, Eileen L.,
Soryt,  (and Lee, they only sent one speaker so I don't even have stereo.)  Thanks also to  PJ,  GJ, Kaarlo, Toril S., Manuel D., Stephen & Joe H.

Thank you all for your concern & advice through this great PSR Tutorial Forum.

Regards, Gloria
« Last Edit: April 21, 2018, 11:30:47 AM by Gloria »
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page
 

Offline DonM

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2018, 02:53:10 PM »
Gloria, I answered on another forum so won't repeat here except to encourage you to use the PDF manuals.  I sent you a link to them. 
They are SO much easier to use than the paper manuals.  It won't take you long to get used to the way the PDFs work.
DonM
 

Offline panos

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #22 on: April 21, 2018, 04:04:12 PM »
Kaarlo you could take a look here on how to manage pdf files easilly.
https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,43649.msg344820.html#msg344820
Sometimes there is also a function avaiiable called bookmarks, where you can easilly navigate to some basic parts of the pdf when there are many pages.
Take a look at the pictures below.

As for the way Gloria got her Genos,
no matter if you are selling musical instruments or doing something else that is not a way to treat a lady.This is not just bad business.This is luck of respect...  :(
« Last Edit: April 21, 2018, 04:07:23 PM by panos »
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2018, 09:14:37 PM »
Hi Gloria,
  If this was a demo keyboard I hope you got it at a good knock down price and you should also get a refund for all the trouble this store has caused you. I hope the store provides you with the missing parts very quickly.

Offline jgriffin

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #24 on: April 23, 2018, 01:49:44 AM »
Gloria....one big advantage to the .pdf files is that the owner's and reference manuals have now been updated about four times!  The difficulty is in trying to figure out what has been revised/updated/deleted, etc.  If anyone has a tip on that I would be grateful.

I usually just print out the particular pages related to whatever I'm working on at the time and make my handwritten notes on those copies.  Over the years I've collected reams of docments that just keep piling up.  I think a bonfire would be appropriate at this point!

You can load the .pdf file to a flash drive and take it to a printing business (such as Office Depot) and they will print the manual in black and white (much cheaper than color) on both sides of the paper for you.  It does cost though and with the Genos manual updates still in flux that would probably be a waste of money at this point.

I will say that my Genos came with an owner's manual.  I don't use it because there is no reliability that what I need has not changed by now.

It's a continuous adventure in learning and as usual I lean heavily on this forum for information and support!
Janet
PSR Performer page
GENOS, Yamaha Baby Grand, (2) Motif ES8, Tyos 2, (2) Tyros 3, Tyros 5-76, DGX-650 & 660, Yamaha P140, StagePas 300 & 600, (2) Bose Compact, Yamaha
 

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #25 on: April 23, 2018, 04:07:43 AM »
Gloria....one big advantage to the .pdf files is that the owner's and reference manuals have now been updated about four times!  The difficulty is in trying to figure out what has been revised/updated/deleted, etc.  If anyone has a tip on that I would be grateful.

I usually just print out the particular pages related to whatever I'm working on at the time and make my handwritten notes on those copies.  Over the years I've collected reams of docments that just keep piling up.  I think a bonfire would be appropriate at this point!

You can load the .pdf file to a flash drive and take it to a printing business (such as Office Depot) and they will print the manual in black and white (much cheaper than color) on both sides of the paper for you.  It does cost though and with the Genos manual updates still in flux that would probably be a waste of money at this point.

I will say that my Genos came with an owner's manual.  I don't use it because there is no reliability that what I need has not changed by now.

It's a continuous adventure in learning and as usual I lean heavily on this forum for information and support!


Very well said indeed !
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2018, 04:13:39 AM »
Gloria....one big advantage to the .pdf files is that the owner's and reference manuals have now been updated about four times!  The difficulty is in trying to figure out what has been revised/updated/deleted, etc.  If anyone has a tip on that I would be grateful.

I usually just print out the particular pages related to whatever I'm working on at the time and make my handwritten notes on those copies.  Over the years I've collected reams of docments that just keep piling up.  I think a bonfire would be appropriate at this point!

You can load the .pdf file to a flash drive and take it to a printing business (such as Office Depot) and they will print the manual in black and white (much cheaper than color) on both sides of the paper for you.  It does cost though and with the Genos manual updates still in flux that would probably be a waste of money at this point.

I will say that my Genos came with an owner's manual.  I don't use it because there is no reliability that what I need has not changed by now.

It's a continuous adventure in learning and as usual I lean heavily on this forum for information and support!


Very well said indeed ! In case you really referred to Genos I was not aware of the fact that

            owner's and reference manuals have now been updated about four times! 

Will have to download them again. Thanks for the tip.

Cheers

Kaarlo
The year you were born is unimportant as long as you can still play your keyboard and don't have to change the treble setting
 

Offline Lloyd E

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2018, 04:26:43 AM »
Guitar Center should be banned from selling Yamaha products. Are they an authorized dealer? I can't imagine a company being so sloppy.  They certainly owe you one big
discount for the way they mishandled the transaction. So sorry you were exposed to this sad state of affairs.  Sincerely, Lloyd
Music is the way to go
 

Offline DonM

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #28 on: April 23, 2018, 06:27:27 AM »
I could tell you about a trip I made to the local GC a couple of years ago.  I won't go into detail, but I had a pocketful of money, they had a mixer I wanted in stock.  My wife and I were there 30 minutes and totally ignored, even though I walked up to the counter and stood there for about five minutes watching the "kids" talk to each other.
I posted a complaint on their website and a pretty big honcho had the store manager call me and apologize and offer a discount on my purchase.
He didn't even act sincere then!  Of course I had already ordered one from Sweetwater and already received it by then, and at a lower price.
It was my last trip to GC. 
DonM
 

Offline jgriffin

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #29 on: April 23, 2018, 12:17:08 PM »
Yes Kaarlo - you can tell by the file names......genos_en_om_d0 and genos_en_rm_d0 are the two latest.  They are going up the alphabet i.e. this last time from c0 to d0.

Again - it would be really nice to know what changes were made.  It's like trying to find a needle in a hay stack!  Maybe that information is posted somewhere but I am not aware of that location.

Have a good evening!



Yes Don.....I agree about GC and they are really sneaky on their discount policies.  I have to pull my angry granny face on them when that happens!  I can be a real bitch at times like this.   :)
Janet
PSR Performer page
GENOS, Yamaha Baby Grand, (2) Motif ES8, Tyos 2, (2) Tyros 3, Tyros 5-76, DGX-650 & 660, Yamaha P140, StagePas 300 & 600, (2) Bose Compact, Yamaha
 

Offline Stijn

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2018, 08:54:28 PM »


Again - it would be really nice to know what changes were made.  It's like trying to find a needle in a hay stack!  Maybe that information is posted somewhere but I am not aware of that location.
!



Hi Janet,

I compared the Genos manuals.

links removed;  see my new post below.

Regards,
Stijn
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 05:49:07 AM by Stijn »
One good thing about music; when it hits you, you feel no pain.
 
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Offline jgriffin

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2018, 10:11:27 AM »
Amazing.....thanks Stijn!  Did not think that was possible!  Downloaded and saved for future reference.  YOU ROCK!
Janet
PSR Performer page
GENOS, Yamaha Baby Grand, (2) Motif ES8, Tyos 2, (2) Tyros 3, Tyros 5-76, DGX-650 & 660, Yamaha P140, StagePas 300 & 600, (2) Bose Compact, Yamaha
 

Offline Stijn

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2018, 05:47:56 AM »
Hi Janet,

I made another set of comparisons. In these comparisons the changes are better noticeable with side by side pages.

Operator Manual (from version b to d) = https://www.dropbox.com/s/nntftiq79mglnxj/OM%20Comparison%20b-d.pdf?dl=0
Reference Manual (from version b to c) =https://www.dropbox.com/s/8r4km7mra8lnfrg/RM%20Comparison%20b-c.pdf?dl=0
Reference Manual (from version c to d) = https://www.dropbox.com/s/zk5dl9il8nnf0z3/RM%20Comparison%20c-d.pdf?dl=0

Regards,
Stijn
One good thing about music; when it hits you, you feel no pain.
 
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Offline guitpic1

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #33 on: April 26, 2018, 06:28:33 AM »
Are these Genos problems, or vendor issues?
guitpic1

Genos, S970, DGX650, Bose S1 Pro(x2)JBL Eon One, SSV.3, DXR10
 

Offline Ernie

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #34 on: April 26, 2018, 05:44:57 PM »
Hi Gloria,

I hope they 'll sent you the speakers soon.
And I hope you will have big fun with the Genos after this difficult start.

Regards
Ernie
 

Offline Gloria

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #35 on: April 27, 2018, 03:44:40 AM »
Guitpic - these are vendor problems & they are not delivering what is suppose to go with this keyboard - right down to not even including the music rack!

ERNIE - thanks for your good wishes, this has been so disappointing.

Regards, Gloria
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page
 

Offline markstyles

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #36 on: April 28, 2018, 05:34:48 AM »
So they obviously sent you an open box, a demo, or a returned product..  For the price you are paying, it should be a sealed factory fresh unit..

Sorry, to hear of your problems.   The Genos is a great kbd though.
 

Offline Gloria

Re: Genos problems
« Reply #37 on: May 02, 2018, 02:24:34 AM »
MARK - Thanks for your kind reply.  The price I paid for the Genos (used as a demonstrator model in Guitar Center) was discounted.  I'm complaining because I didn't receive the music rack, cords, etc., things that always come with an instrument, whether it's new or used. (Although 3 wks. later they came to the house with 3 music racks, BUT NONE OF THEM FIT THE GENOS!  I had to buy an amp to hear the Genos, because the Yamaha speakers aren't deliverable until around July! They also forgot to include any cords to plug the keyboard into the amp & didn't even include a cord to plug the amp INTO THE WALL SOCKET !   ::)

Gloria
« Last Edit: May 22, 2018, 08:25:29 AM by Gloria »
"Music is the Universal Language"
PSR Performer Page