Author Topic: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?  (Read 1945 times)

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Offline Linson

Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« on: January 27, 2018, 05:26:35 PM »
Hello Friends,
Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords when it's on hold?.. or Is there anyway we can make the Arp work while playing the chords on the left hand?
It will be so nice for a strong left hand players like myself.. Please let me know.

Thank you
 

Offline maartenb

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2018, 08:54:50 PM »
Multipads (can) follow the left hand. Arps not, as far as I know.


Maarten
 

Offline soryt

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2018, 09:51:06 PM »
It is a "shame" that they not follow the left hand.

S :(
 

Offline maartenb

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2018, 10:21:07 PM »
I thought the whole idea of arps was that the fingers of the right hand control the notes played by an arp?


Maarten
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2018, 10:36:56 PM »
Yes I thought that was the idea to.

vanray

  • Guest
Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2018, 10:44:04 PM »
I thought the whole idea of arps was that the fingers of the right hand control the notes played by an arp?


Maarten

Why would that be so important ?
multipad arps are controlled by the left hand.

Would of been nice for yamaha, to have a "FlipSwitch" , to enable users the choice.
a bit like the choice to play BASS , with the left hand.
 

Offline maartenb

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2018, 11:21:12 PM »
Would of been nice for yamaha, to have a "FlipSwitch" , to enable users the choice.
a bit like the choice to play BASS , with the left hand.

Are you going to send this idea to Yamaha support?


Maarten
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2018, 12:31:50 AM »
I thought the whole idea of arps was that the fingers of the right hand control the notes played by an arp?

Maarten

Yes, That's correct.  People who are not familiar with arpeggiators want to reinvent the wheel.  There is more to an arpeggiator than just holding the notes on the keyboard.  We can "play" the arp to give it varying patterns of notes.  Also use the Live Control parameters to create variations, such as Gate Time and Velocity. I use an external MIDI controller to vary (real-time) Attack , Release, Filter Cutoff and Resonance along with Gate Time.  This is a common musical element for EDM.

Multi Pads are recordings of arps or note patterns, chord patterns.  Then there are controller arps which are basically filter messages controlled by LFOs synced to the MIDI clock.

Yamaha fell short on implementing the arpeggiator on the arranger.  With the Motif and Montage we can do so much more.

Joe H

« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 12:11:20 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

vanray

  • Guest
Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2018, 12:41:27 AM »
Are you going to send this idea to Yamaha support?

Maarten

No Maarten, im not,
i doubt that yamaha would say , it cant be done.

Im still waiting for  the next firmware/O.S upgrade
Once thats released , ill know weather or not ,to request a full refund
 

Offline Dromeus

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2018, 03:35:44 AM »
I just tried to "like" Joe's posting but for some reason it didn't work.

multipad arps

I find that term confusing. Multipad and Arpeggiator are very different in nature.

A Multipad may be looped and may react to chord information. If it does, the sound is determined by the Multipad and chord recognition follows the known rules.

The Arpeggiator, in contrast, follows always the keys pressed. There is no chord recognition here, the arp follows the keys pressed meaning that if you press a chord, inversions do matter. The sound is not determined by the arpeggiator, but by the part(s) (R1-3) that are in use by the arpeggiator.
Regards, Michael
 

vanray

  • Guest
Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2018, 05:15:10 AM »
I just tried to "like" Joe's posting but for some reason it didn't work.

I find that term confusing. Multipad and Arpeggiator are very different in nature.



yes your right, they can be
but mutipad arps can be usefull,in their own right too.



 

Offline Joe H

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2018, 12:13:21 PM »
... Multi Pads are recordings of arps or note patterns, and chord patterns.  Then there are controller arps which are basically filter messages controlled by LFOs synced to the MIDI clock...

The term Arp is short for arpeggio... a broken chord.  So Multi Pads can play arpeggios.  But today, Yamaha has taken the original broken chord arpeggio and enhanced it with MIDI capabilities to make so much better and more interesting.  Yamaha uses arps to play drum patterns as well. If you experiment with the S970 or Genos arps by choosing a drum kit, you will be surprised to hear some will work pretty well from creating drum patterns.  Record them and then convert them to Multi Pads and edit the notes to suit the drum kit sounds.

BTW... Joe Waters is working on fixing the LIKE button.

Joe H
« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 05:55:53 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Linson

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #12 on: February 05, 2018, 04:50:23 AM »
Thank you all for your valuable inputs. It's much appreciated.
When we hold the arp, in the voice setting, see attachment  , that means we can free up the right hand. right?
But when we are on the style play mode, it would be nice feature, it can follow chord on the left especially with guitar strumming where we need to follow chords.. I hope , Yamaha listens to these small enhancements..
Thanks again.
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2018, 06:01:40 AM »
Arp Hold just means when we lift our hand from the keybed the arp will continue to play.

We can't make the arp play with the Left Voice in the same way we do with the right. But there is a way to simulate that by playing the arp with the R1 Voice and while playing a CMaj7 sustained chord or a broken chord... and record it.

Then use PadMaker-Midi to convert your recorded arp to a Multi Pad.   It won't be as interesting as playing the arp with the right hand, but it's best we can do.

 ;)

Joe H
« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 06:02:53 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Linson

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2018, 12:21:02 AM »
Thanks Joe. A lot to learn from you!!..
 

Offline Grayfox

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2018, 01:50:41 AM »
Someone said you canít have arpeggios following your left hand.
If an arpeggio is a Broken chord then I have had many keyboards over the years that had them playing in the background and were controlled by your chord. Or have they redifined the word arpeggio.
Graham
Graham Foxall

Current Yamaha GENOS + GNS MS01
with 2 Yamaha MSR100 Speakers
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2018, 01:54:48 AM »
The term Arp is short for arpeggio... a broken chord.  So Multi Pads can play arpeggios.  But today, Yamaha has taken the original broken chord arpeggio and enhanced it with MIDI capabilities to make so much better and more interesting.  Yamaha uses arps to play drum patterns as well. If you experiment with the S970 or Genos arps by choosing a drum kit, you will be surprised to hear some will work pretty well from creating drum patterns.  Record them and then convert them to Multi Pads and edit the notes to suit the drum kit sounds.

Joe H

I stated the answer to your question above.  Yes, Yamaha has taken the original arppegiator of Up/Down/Up-Down and extended the possibilties dramatically.

Some Yamaha arps have controller data only such as Expression, Filter Cut-off as well as including note Velocity in the arp sequence for dynamics.  Also they added system exclusive control of Arp Gate Time, Arp Velocity, and the ability to modify the arp real-time with XG controllers.  Many of Yamaha arps today play as a rhythmic pattern rather than a broken chord.

Take a look over here:  http://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,39857.msg338544.html#msg338544

Joe H
« Last Edit: February 06, 2018, 11:01:40 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2018, 01:53:04 PM »
Yes, That's correct.  People who are not familiar with arpeggiators want to reinvent the wheel.  There is more to an arpeggiator than just holding the notes on the keyboard.  We can "play" the arp to give it varying patterns of notes.  Also use the Live Control parameters to create variations, such as Gate Time and Velocity. I use an external MIDI controller to vary (real-time) Attack , Release, Filter Cutoff and Resonance along with Gate Time.  This is a common musical element for EDM.

Multi Pads are recordings of arps or note patterns, chord patterns.  Then there are controller arps which are basically filter messages controlled by LFOs synced to the MIDI clock.

Yamaha fell short on implementing the arpeggiator on the arranger.  With the Motif and Montage we can do so much more.

Joe H

I agree the arpeggiator on the Genos feels like a toy version compared to my MOXF;.

On my MOXF i can layer arps everywhere on the keyboard.
So when i choose to add them to my left hand, i can. (and midi the left hand to the Genos)
And that is actually a lot of fun, combining arps with the chord progression.
"Playing" them in between the full fingered chords.

I remember a topic about this at early release.
Where quite some people where dissatisfied with the arps in the Genos.
The main reason i bought the MOXF however, is that i can not load any user arps in the Genos.

Combining the MOXF with the Genos really adds another layer
I might take this one step further and convert the MOXF into a Montage
Prices dropped considerably in europe.
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2018, 12:29:57 AM »
Spirit,

Did you know you can play the MOXF Arps on the Genos? I do this with my Motif Rack XS. If you create the right MIDI configuration on the Genos, you should be able to play a single arp on R1.

A more complex setup should allow you to play 3 arps on R1, R2, R3.  And maybe  4th arp on Left hand.

I also play Performances using a special setup where the left-hand chord is split (ACMP is turned On) so I can set the octave range separately.  If you go to the link I provided above and look at the previous post over on that other thread, you will hear 2 Motif Rack XS Performances played using the S970 as a controller keyboard.

I bought the MRXS so I could have 6600 arps to play on my S970.  I can record them with the on-board sequencer and turn them into Multi Pads and style Parts.

Joe H
« Last Edit: February 07, 2018, 12:32:30 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Re: Does arpeggiators follow left hand chords?
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2018, 01:55:20 PM »
Spirit,

Did you know you can play the MOXF Arps on the Genos? I do this with my Motif Rack XS. If you create the right MIDI configuration on the Genos, you should be able to play a single arp on R1.

A more complex setup should allow you to play 3 arps on R1, R2, R3.  And maybe  4th arp on Left hand.

I also play Performances using a special setup where the left-hand chord is split (ACMP is turned On) so I can set the octave range separately.  If you go to the link I provided above and look at the previous post over on that other thread, you will hear 2 Motif Rack XS Performances played using the S970 as a controller keyboard.

I bought the MRXS so I could have 6600 arps to play on my S970.  I can record them with the on-board sequencer and turn them into Multi Pads and style Parts.

Joe H

Yes i know, its an option i keep in mind.

But in general i prefer to play the 88 keys of the MOXF to the Genos keybed.
Except off course for organ and lightning fast synth parts, they play better on the Genos.
So i mostly use the MOXF as the masterkey and the Genos as the slave right now.

I guess the other way around would work just as well.

I love what you are doing with arps. Its one of the reasons i started looking into them when i got the Genos.
Still enjoy the Genos very much, but combined with the MOXF its even a much much stronger combination.