Author Topic: Anyone has Stagea?  (Read 9414 times)

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Offline Togge

Anyone has Stagea?
« on: December 25, 2017, 01:20:47 AM »
Does anyone here has a Stagea?
How do you think it compares to your Tyros or Genos soundwise?
 

Jean Abdou

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2017, 04:07:36 AM »
Does anyone here has a Stagea?
How do you think it compares to your Tyros or Genos soundwise?

Have you ever seen the game Guitar hero? The electone should be called the Keyboard Hero.

If you are under 10 years of age and you want to get a keyboard which plays everything for you and you want to look like a clown on the stage who just pretends playing something then go for it...
 

Offline andyg

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2017, 08:05:54 PM »
Sorry Jean, that comment about clowns is a complete lot of rubbish and an insult to those many, many people - myself included - who play organ properly, using both hands and feet, and to those, again like myself, who have helped design them over the years.

The Stagea ELS-02 (and indeed many recent electronic organs, like the big Roland Ateliers, Kawai Dreamatones, Wersis, Bohms and even Lowreys, for that matter) is a superb instrument. You don't have to use any form of automatic assistance - not even a rhythm - and, when you do play it manually, it's capable of doing all sorts of things that are impossible on an arranger keyboard. The two classes of instruments can be very different, even though there are obvious overlaps in some areas. You play them very differently, they respond differently.

And it should be remembered that the electronic organ is the daddy, or perhaps grandaddy, of the arranger keyboard. A little more respect for your elders, please! :)

« Last Edit: December 27, 2017, 08:09:14 PM by andyg »
It's not what you play, it's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

www.andrew-gilbert.com
 
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Offline Toril S

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2017, 08:19:33 PM »
Agreed! I would love to have a proper electronic organ. I play one every time I have a chance. But I have no space for it, so I have a keyboard instead.
Toril S

Genos, Tyros 5, PSR S975, PSR 2100
and PSR-47.
Former keyboards: PSR-S970.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLVwWdb36Yd3LMBjAnm6pTQ?view_as=subscriber



Toril's PSR Performer Page
 

Offline keyplayer

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2017, 08:47:44 PM »
Have you ever seen the game Guitar hero? The electone should be called the Keyboard Hero.

If you are under 10 years of age and you want to get a keyboard which plays everything for you and you want to look like a clown on the stage who just pretends playing something then go for it...

Wow Jean, what a disrespectful way to reply to a novice poster who has only 2 posts in this forum! In delivering your insult to players of all levels and personal preferences you have completeley missed the point of Togge's question - how do the Stagea, Tyros and Genos compare SOUNDWISE !!

Togge, I wish I could answer your question properly but I don't have a Stagea or a Genos, but I know they can all sound fabulous, having heard them both in a home situation and on stage by professionals. I personally have my Tyros 5 in a TRX set up with pedals and it gives me the best of both worlds - keyboard style and organ style, and I like to play using all automatics plus just as a straight organ, or multi -tracking a big arrangement - just because I can and after all it's what I spent my hard earned cash on!

Perhaps somebody here can give you a sensible answer, it is what usually happens. We like to help each other.

Pam

Offline zionip

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2017, 09:42:37 PM »
I admit that I am not good enough to play the "Star Wars" theme song using the Genos in real time.

This young Japanese girl demonstrated the versatility of the Yamaha Electone/Stagea line of organs by playing a wonderfully rendered, and realistic sounding version of "Star Wars":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp5HpjhKHKs

I admire the girl's superb techniques shown by her busy fingers and dancing left leg on the foot pedals - she is far from "look like a clown on the stage who just pretends playing something".  She looks more professional in skills than most home arranger players.

It looks like she was playing on a Yamaha Electone / Stagea ELS-02C.

Thanks,
Paul
« Last Edit: December 27, 2017, 09:46:14 PM by zionip »
 
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Offline panos

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2017, 10:58:42 PM »
Mayde Jean was mistaken the stagea with some other organ?
I dont see that electon play by itself.
But my psr does play by itself every time i press some keys with my left hand  :)
Those electric organs look like the keyboard that Vangelis is using.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zzkalHmY10

If he looks like a clown when he is playing,could you give me an Oscar too pls  ???


Offline Togge

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2017, 11:13:50 PM »
I personally have my Tyros 5 in a TRX set up with pedals and it gives me the best of both worlds - keyboard style and organ style, and I like to play using all automatics plus just as a straight organ, or multi -tracking a big arrangement - just because I can and after all it's what I spent my hard earned cash on!

Pam

That sounds interesting but I don't understand how this can happen since the the yamaha keyboard have no manual bass part and as I understand not even any bass sounds that are proper for pedal bass. However I did see the topic on V-console.
I don't really know much about how to play without bass pedals.

My guess is that Stagea 02 is something in between Tyros 5 and Genos soundwise. But it would have been interested to hear from someone with experience.

Sorry if I hijacked this forum with off topic organ.
 

Jean Abdou

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2017, 07:15:38 PM »
First off don't get me wrong, I'm not here to insult someone who plays an Organ. It's just the massive performances you see online done on Electones are not that cool at all. And sometimes an insult to a true musician!

I admit that I am not good enough to play the "Star Wars" theme song using the Genos in real time.

This young Japanese girl demonstrated the versatility of the Yamaha Electone/Stagea line of organs by playing a wonderfully rendered, and realistic sounding version of "Star Wars":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp5HpjhKHKs

I admire the girl's superb techniques shown by her busy fingers and dancing left leg on the foot pedals - she is far from "look like a clown on the stage who just pretends playing something".  She looks more professional in skills than most home arranger players.

It looks like she was playing on a Yamaha Electone / Stagea ELS-02C.

Thanks,
Paul

Here is another one for you sounds 1000% the same:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2I6CIXv-XM
I have zero appreciation for this kind of "talent".

Now playing Organ is different. Find me someone playing the exact same peice here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pi_gwED-gQw
or this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYP7Mxss3_U

Also, I suggest you to try guitar hero! I bet you'll find it difficult! I hope you see the difference between these videos and what you sent.

Now I'm not saying you can't do the same thing with Electone, if you give Electone to the people in these videos they definitely play amazing. For Organ sound, I wouldn't invest in Yamaha as I don't like Yamaha's organ sound (personal opinion).
« Last Edit: December 28, 2017, 07:26:47 PM by Jean Abdou »
 

Offline keyplayer

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2017, 07:52:46 PM »
With all respect Jean you are still 'off topic', the closest you've come to answering Togge's comparison request is saying that you don't like the organ sounds on Yamaha instruments. Let's keep this thread appropriate to the question, Togge only joined us on 5th December and already is apologising for 'hijacking' the forum, which in my opinion isn't true and it was a perfectly legitimate question.

 Pam
 

OregonJim

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2017, 09:12:01 PM »
I would LOVE to have a Stagea, or even see one in person, but Yamaha doesn't import them to the USA (or most other countries outside of Asia).  The only way to get one is through the grey market, and I don't have the funds or the desire to go that route...
 

Jean Abdou

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2017, 01:55:54 AM »
With all respect Jean you are still 'off topic', the closest you've come to answering Togge's comparison request is saying that you don't like the organ sounds on Yamaha instruments. Let's keep this thread appropriate to the question, Togge only joined us on 5th December and already is apologising for 'hijacking' the forum, which in my opinion isn't true and it was a perfectly legitimate question.

 Pam

Legitimate response. I was off the topic. Generally speaking, Yamaha is not good in Organ department. Nord, Korg beat Yamaha by a good margin. I personally prefer to use MaingStage's organ VST. It sounds great for the price. I haven't compared it side by side with Tyros or Genos, but it sounds superior to anything I can do with my MOTIF XF as well as Montage.

Other than that, Stagea has the same AWM and AEM technology used in Tyros and Genos. Yamaha's samples are all the same along all of its ROMplers (according to Yamahasynth.com) and it sounds very similar too. At least the star war songs I've heard the instrument samples are familiar.

In my humble opinion, the reason why you can't find these products in north america is the market. Musicians here don't buy them and the sales will be poor. You can make your own version just by hooking two keyboards of your own choice (Genos and Nord for example) and you will have a better sound set and a more complicated performance if you're really into this kind of stuff.
 

Spirit of the old South

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2017, 07:53:35 AM »
With all respect Jean you are still 'off topic', the closest you've come to answering Togge's comparison request is saying that you don't like the organ sounds on Yamaha instruments. Let's keep this thread appropriate to the question, Togge only joined us on 5th December and already is apologising for 'hijacking' the forum, which in my opinion isn't true and it was a perfectly legitimate question.

 Pam

Its Jeanīs natural attitude, he canīt help it, i still need to see a single positive post from him.
 

Offline soundphase

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #13 on: December 29, 2017, 04:36:16 PM »
I personnally love how Marco Cerbella uses his Electone.

I would be very happy to see people who make such criticisms on YouTube, to see what they are able to do by themselves.

The more the time goes, the more I globally find people demanding and uncompromising.

« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 04:39:23 PM by soundphase »
 

Offline andyg

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2017, 11:05:20 PM »
First off don't get me wrong, I'm not here to insult someone who plays an Organ. It's just the massive performances you see online done on Electones are not that cool at all. And sometimes an insult to a true musician!

Jean, you say you don't want to insult someone who plays an organ, but your next two sentences basically do just that, and you follow it up by rubbishing a very fine performance on the D-Deck by a very good organist. This kind of performance is what the modern electronic organ is really all about. It's not just about making Hammond or jazz organ sounds - that's only a tiny part of it. Organs have been trying to be orchestral or 'symphonic' for years, using pipes well before the electronic organ was invented. It's only since the 70s, and especially since things went digital, that designers and players have been able to realise their dreams. Have a listen to some the performances on Roland by the likes of Hector Olivera and see if you think they are 'not cool'.

Comparing the two performances on Hammond (both excellent) to those on an orchestral instrument is like comparing oranges and apples. They're totally different instruments and simply should not be compared as it's pointless. There are plenty of musicians who will play just one of those types of instruments and would be totally lost if they tried the other! And there are some (including me) who will be quite happy to do either, or anything in between. I've heard Ms Dennerlein play jazz on pipe organ, so give her a Stagea and tell her not to use any organ sounds and I'm sure she would turn in a great instrumental performance. She actually does use MIDI'd instruments on Hammond -and sometimes gets vilified by the 'purists' for doing so!

And I can assure you that, good though the 'twinset' organs using Tyros or Genos are - and yes, of course I've played them - they are still not the same as a real organ.

The reasons for Yamaha not selling organs outside the Asian market are well known and it isn't anything to to with lack of interest in the instruments.

Bottom line? Stagea is a superb instrument. It takes a lot of effort and skill to play any organ properly, and the Stagea is no exception. Push it to its limits, push yourself to your limits and it will repay your efforts by the shedload!

« Last Edit: December 30, 2017, 11:07:47 PM by andyg »
It's not what you play, it's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

www.andrew-gilbert.com
 

Jean Abdou

  • Guest
Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #15 on: December 31, 2017, 05:46:55 AM »
Jean, you say you don't want to insult someone who plays an organ, but your next two sentences basically do just that, and you follow it up by rubbishing a very fine performance on the D-Deck by a very good organist. This kind of performance is what the modern electronic organ is really all about. It's not just about making Hammond or jazz organ sounds - that's only a tiny part of it. Organs have been trying to be orchestral or 'symphonic' for years, using pipes well before the electronic organ was invented. It's only since the 70s, and especially since things went digital, that designers and players have been able to realise their dreams. Have a listen to some the performances on Roland by the likes of Hector Olivera and see if you think they are 'not cool'.

Comparing the two performances on Hammond (both excellent) to those on an orchestral instrument is like comparing oranges and apples. They're totally different instruments and simply should not be compared as it's pointless. There are plenty of musicians who will play just one of those types of instruments and would be totally lost if they tried the other! And there are some (including me) who will be quite happy to do either, or anything in between. I've heard Ms Dennerlein play jazz on pipe organ, so give her a Stagea and tell her not to use any organ sounds and I'm sure she would turn in a great instrumental performance. She actually does use MIDI'd instruments on Hammond -and sometimes gets vilified by the 'purists' for doing so!

And I can assure you that, good though the 'twinset' organs using Tyros or Genos are - and yes, of course I've played them - they are still not the same as a real organ.

The reasons for Yamaha not selling organs outside the Asian market are well known and it isn't anything to to with lack of interest in the instruments.

Bottom line? Stagea is a superb instrument. It takes a lot of effort and skill to play any organ properly, and the Stagea is no exception. Push it to its limits, push yourself to your limits and it will repay your efforts by the shedload!


I guess you didn't read my later post Andy. I actually mentioned the exact same thing.

I don't really want to go off the topic again and apologize temporarily, but allow me to be more clear, if a player is playing along a preset MIDI song or an audio file (let's say star wars) in all fairness it is not cool. There are so many performances using Stagea like this online.

The second part of my response relates to the technical part of a performance. Combining two keyboards and an organ-style pedal might is more complicated than Stagea alone but is much more flexible! If you haven't tried a decent organ VST like MainStages B3 organ, try it! You will be surprised how awesome it sounds.

To wrap my discussion up, there have been situations where I didn't not like the imperfections of an acoustic/electric instruments in the mix and I felt a VST is a better option!

Cheerrs and happy new year...
 

Offline andyg

Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2017, 09:53:21 AM »
I'm not keen on the idea of players playing along to commercial MIDI files. I know some people have fun doing this at home and that's perfectly OK, but it makes me angry to see so called 'professional' entertainers doing this for a living, just adding a few right hand notes to someone else's work. I was once asked by a fellow 'organist' on the concert circuit if I could provide her with backing files for her performances. I declined and I'm sure that everyone else she asked did the same. Her time on the circuit was, unsurprisingly, very short!

But I have absolutely no issues with someone working hard, creating their own MIDI files and then multi-tracking with them in concert or on recordings. Multi-tracking has been around for years. I do like people to admit that a piece is multi-tracked and I'm a bit disappointed when someone says that 'everything is live', when I can see and hear that it clearly isn't.

However, my point is that there is no need to do either, if you have the skill to do so. Turn off all the gizmos and play everything yourself! There are plenty of 100% live Electone and Atelier clips on line.

I repeat my earlier comment that when played live - manually - with no automation at all, the organ can do things that the keyboard cannot. It's down to the skills of the player. I'm biased, I've been playing organ for 48 years and have had the privilege to know some of the best artistes on the planet, alas many no longer with us. I'd rather sit down and play organ than any other instrument. I don't care if it has pipes, transistors or microchips.
It's not what you play, it's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

www.andrew-gilbert.com
 
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Re: Anyone has Stagea?
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2020, 08:18:37 PM »
Have you ever seen the game Guitar hero? The electone should be called the Keyboard Hero.

If you are under 10 years of age and you want to get a keyboard which plays everything for you and you want to look like a clown on the stage who just pretends playing something then go for it...

I know this is an old thread, but I had to login to answer to this comment, which in an arranger forum (which I include myself), where you only play chords with the left hand, play a melody line with the right hand and push buttons with the hands and/or pedals, is a complete rubish of joke.

Obviously you never played an organ, and behind those StageA performances you call a clownish performance, there's actually a much greater level of dificulty and articullation in all your body, since you play the instrument with everything you got.

I wish I could play as they do (just search in youtube for Marco Cerbella), and the instrument itself seems capable of making any sound in perfection (it also has the VA technology Yamaha droped in synths long ago) and they can be upgraded with new hardware instead of throwing the instrument away like a tyros or genos.

I can't see any arranger doing what these organs do, much less a synth (and as we are in an arranger forum, we know there is no VST capable of arranging in realtime).

The supreme arranger is a orchestra or a band, followed by the organ.