Author Topic: New Tyros 6 or genos  (Read 6146 times)

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Offline Chandeneze

New Tyros 6 or genos
« on: July 30, 2017, 10:15:14 PM »
If Yamaha do not give full access to their ne KB without spending and arm and a leg for extra ram and expansion packs I am finished with Yamaha and believe me there is not one of my many friends that feels the same. Korg is taking the lead and the price is affordable to normal man on the street. seems like Yamaha is in competition with Wersi to see who can charge the most for and instrument

Come on Yamaha  you are going to loose thousands of customers

Chandeneze
 

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2017, 10:26:56 PM »
I don't know about Korg taking the lead but certainly the Korg Pa4x is very much equal to the Tyros 5 and costs a fair bit less.

Offline Chandeneze

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2017, 12:36:28 AM »
Hi Richard,
Must say Yamaha are usually first with new technology. On the other hand The Roland G70 from years ago Hammond sound is still way better than Tyros 5. I nearly dropped from my seat when I tried the PAX4 drawbar sound Closer to a Hammond B3 sound I have never heard on any KB. I am a Hammond man in mind and soul. Organ sound, Piano and sax is the 3 sounds I based my decision on a purchase. I have made a huge selection of styles where I combined intros, endings and mains from Roland, Korg and Yamaha for instance I used a Latin style with Korg as intro 1 Roland Intro 3 and Yamaha intro 3 did this with the endings and main ABCD This gives me a good verity of intros, endings and main parts depending on the song I play.

The reason I did this was to get the best intros and endings in one style and to move away from the Yamaha intros we are familiar with since PSR 9000 Pro. To be hones I can play a song on my 9000 and them on my T4 and the difference is so minimal. My wish list will be a keyboard from Yamaha will all the styles created from P9000 to tyros 5 plus a complete new set of styles. a touch screen ( not to serious. A build in IPad windows based with editing programs installed. Nothing less than 76 keys without a dial searching for voices and styles. A midi to style converter as PAX4 without purchasing extra ram to use the keyboard to its fullest. Add a few dollars extra and complete the keyboard with all the functions usable. A set of pedals can be optional. I miss my foot pedals

Just my idea of a Yamaha KB listening to the Electone organs What a blessing it will be to be an owner but again Only for the rich and the famous.

Regards
to all
Chandeneze       
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2017, 01:14:23 AM »
Hi C,

I really understand your comments.
Yamaha are creating a situation many endusers would like to see differently.

Their present policy is a serious problem and hopefully will be solved very soon.

Jeff
DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2017, 06:03:56 AM »
If you are bored with Yamaha (styles), dislike the concept of expansion packs, don't like the price of Yamaha's TOTL arranger or even the more affordable features of the S770-S970 arrangers, time to switch to another brand and their forum.

Strange I see more used Korg PA4X's for sale in the Korg forums and ongoing Korg issues than used Yamaha Tyros 5s for sale. For months, I have not seen one Tyros 5 for sale in a local national online classified site (Kijiji Canada), but have seen several PA4X's for sale. Ebay is so profit motivated these days, and difficult to gauge true prices, but local/national classifieds are a good measuring stick to more realistic used prices and availability. Yamaha products maintain good prices when we are ready to upgrade to the next model.

I just checked my Kijiji app, and no used Tyros 5's for sale across Canada, but three new Korg PA4X's and one used one for sale (see screen shots). The used Korg was $4,800 CAD, which is about $3,850 USD. There also shows a used Tyros 4 at $4,000 CAD firm ($3,200 USD). I find the trend over time is, more Yamaha users stick to their products, have less issues, have more support, and hold better trade in value when selling or upgrading. I can't believe how someone could be "bored" with the Tyros 5, never mind anyone suggesting Yamaha might be in trouble with the Genos without rethinking their brand.

Regards, Marcus

 
Gear: Triangle
 
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Offline tyrosrick

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2017, 10:24:40 AM »
Marcus, I totally agree with you on the boredom issue. As a fairly new T5 user, as of now, I can't project EVER getting bored with it. With all the styles, rythms, voices, and multipads, plus ear-candy articulations, I can only see boredom coming from a lack of basic keyboarding skills that would be apparent with any manufacturer. In fact, if further automations beyond the T5 are needed, perhaps one should buy a CD, sit back and push Play, and just listen.
Current Gear: Tyros 5 76 key, and a whole lot of ambition.
Past Gear: Motif XF6, and a whole lot of frustration.
and.....Magnus Chord Organ (when I was 10!)
 

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2017, 02:19:58 PM »
The Montage has huge on-board memory and there has been a couple of firmware upgrades adding features already... so I see this as a new design/marketing direction for Yamaha that will most likely be incorporated in all future arrangers.

 8)

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2017, 04:36:06 PM »
Its not that bad with the pa4x, except 2 or 3 people with a vendetta against Korg, they claim to have problems none can replicate on their pa4x arrangers.  But there is allready a post for pa4x on this forum, no need to change this in another one..  the pa4x is one hell of a keyboard, however, most homeplayers in general are still better off with the tyros5..  because they allready know the interface in and out..


Back to the compkaints about Yamaha's Tyros approach with the expansion packs and the extra memmory...  i think where the extra memmory might belong to the past with the upcomming Genos.. but o also think they might take the expansion part to the next level, by not only offering new sounds, styles and songs, but also new soundengines and maybe even new features...

I don't understand how most Korg enthusiasts consider their Korg arrangers as professional keyboards, yet somehow the Yamaha arrangers belong to the home players. Then this nonsense about Korg arrangers sounding more live or "live like" while Yamaha takes the second seat or reduced to the "home player", because Yamaha spices up the processed sound to sound more "studio like" or somehow must be a requirement to sway in the multitude of the old folk home players.

The Yamaha arrangers are the world leaders in this genre of keyboard, plus most other categories of musical gear. I use and prefer the TOTL Yamaha arranger, because it is the best and most advanced arranger and features in the world money can buy. I know these instruments are very expensive, but it is my choice to select the best gear to address my needs in arranging, producing the sound I want, and finally using my Tyros to perform my music live at a semi-pro capacity.

Despite Yamaha stretching out the Tyros platform to the present Tyros 5, each subsequent model held the lead in the arranger keyboard industry. Equally impressive how Yamaha kept the lead in innovation, features, sound quality, expansion memory, yet controlled costs to the present Tyros 5 model. The Tyros platform was effectively stretched to the limit. I'm sure the expansion and memory issues will be addressed, however, the Tyros 5 has come a long way from the Tyros 3 Dimm memory technology, where loading took like 20 minutes each time I turned on my Tyros 3. My Tyros 5s have worked flawlessly for three years and once my expansion was loaded the first time, expansion is available almost instantaneously after turning on. This means a lot for a live performer.

The new Genos model will be outstanding, still the first choice for the home player because it simply is the best keyboard for those who can afford it, however most likely the first choice for the pro and semi-pro player also.
If I was a pure home player for my own enjoyment, I would certainly lean towards Yamaha, because it provides the best quality keyboards, support and reliability. However, in a home studio and semi-pro gigging capacity, it will still remain the leader in the arranger category and my first choice.

My previous Tyros 4 was sold to a Recording Studio in Toronto. The buyer explained how they had clients that required specific ethnic type sounds to be performed and recorded from expansion samples on the Tyros. Adding that Yamaha was their first choice because of higher quality of the AD output converters and the Tyros 4 could handle all MIDI channels running at the same time without muddling up the final mix. Yamaha quality can push the processing power of their arrangers keyboards better than the competitors and perhaps why Yamaha isn't afraid to add more quality default DSP processing into the final mix for that studio quality processed sound. If I am confident in the product, I can push the envelope and perform better myself as a arranger musician.

Marcus
Gear: Triangle
 

Offline J. Larry

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2017, 09:17:42 PM »
Iíve been with Yamaha for several years, now, since Technics dropped out of contention.  I agree with Marcusí assessment of Yamahaís leadership, etcÖ  And, Iím sticking with Yamaha for now.  I want to see if their next major arranger is incremental or revolutionary, or somewhere in between.  However, I do agree with Chandenezeís assessment of the style issue-----needing an upgrade.  Iíve noticed over the last several models a sameness among many of the styles, with minor changes.  Surely, others have noticed that, too.  But, for me, itís the realistic, authentic-sounding voices that keep me in the Yamaha camp.  Give me that studio---processed---CD-like sound any day, if thatís what they call it. 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2017, 02:35:27 AM »
I don't understand how most Korg enthusiasts consider their Korg arrangers as professional keyboards, yet somehow the Yamaha arrangers belong to the home players. Then this nonsense about Korg arrangers sounding more live or "live like" while Yamaha takes the second seat or reduced to the "home player", because Yamaha spices up the processed sound to sound more "studio like" or somehow must be a requirement to sway in the multitude of the old folk home players.

I've struggled with this conundrum.  On the one hand, as a T5 owner myself, I can experience the clear quality and versatility of the T5 as a professional keyboard (and I speak as someone who has owned Roland, Korg and other keyboards and various hardware over the years). There is no doubt the T5 is an outstanding digital keyboard.

And yet. The Tyros range has always, in my opinion, struggled to escape its 'amateur' image. Just check 98% of Tyros videos on YouTube by non-professional players and owners. It's often quite cringeworthy. Of course, when pro players like Peter Baartmans step up suddenly the keyboard is transformed into something amazing, revealing its true potential in the hands of a capable player, but all too often the Tyros is pegged firmly into the 'old folk home' category simply by how poorly its public image is served by those who take to YT to (presumably) show it off.

It's a great shame and it under serves the actual capabilities of the Tyros 5. As a T5 owner myself I've vacillated between the conflict inherent in owning a magnificent keyboard like the T5, who's credibility as very powerful keyboard is somehow crippled by a dreadful public image (terrible YT videos, for instance) and poor reputation (too often as a laughing stock) amongst 'serious' musicians - to the point where I often feel I should have bought a Montage instead, just to feel like I'm still 'cool'.

I'd like to see Yamaha move away from the cheesiness and position the Genos as a more serious, professional instrument - but I can't avoid the feeling that Yamaha knows where its true market lies in the Tyros/Genos brand and it not with the 'cool kids'. I think it's just a fact of life (and business) that arranger keyboards find their own niche, their own particular demographic. My T5 is what it is - but can it ever be what I want it to be?
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 02:37:50 AM by CalUKGR »
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 
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Offline voodoo

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2017, 04:02:58 AM »
And yet. The Tyros range has always, in my opinion, struggled to escape its 'amateur' image. Just check 98% of Tyros videos on YouTube by non-professional players and owners. It's often quite cringeworthy.

That's so true.

I think, this results from the fact, that the Tyros is very good sounding and, most important, very easy to use. Take for example the SA2 voices. They are fantastic, but no editable. And even the normal voices are not editable down to the layers.

In contrast to this, you have the PA4X (or even the smaller models PA600/PA900), which are deeply editable concerning all voice layers and all controllers. And the sound is quite good, as well. And the form factor is more similar to a professional synth than to a colorful blinking entertainer panel.

So in live bands you only see keyboards like Nord Stage/Electro, Kronos or Montage. But this is not fair. The voice capabilities of the Tyros/PSR line are very mighty due to the YEM, which allows to load high class samples. So I use my S970 in my rock band and not the Nord Electro, because the sound options of the S970 are more flexible. And in the small combo, where we use midi drums, the S970 is perfect and not beatable by any pro keyboard.

Uli
Yamaha PSR-S970 (sold)
Yamaha Genos (ordered)
Nord Electro 5D
 

Offline pjd

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2017, 06:11:32 AM »
Uli makes several good points.

I play both an MOX6 (a "synthesizer") and a PSR-S950 (an "arranger".) I've done enough voice programming, A/B testing and analysis to say that they are on the same sonic level. Thanks to its deep editing, I can usually make the MOX6 sound very much like the S950. Frankly, either one could be used at a rock, pop, jazz gig.

The S950 has the advantage of loading new samples -- something that I miss out with the MOX. (Just missed the MOXF by six months or so.) I bought the S950 on the strength of the pipe organ voices in the Church expansion pack and have not been disappointed. I use the MOX at my church gig mainly because it is pounds lighter than the S950. However, I practice on the S950, having set up comparable voices.

No question in my mind. Yamaha mid- and high-end arrangers are "pro" instruments.

All the best -- pj

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2017, 06:14:48 AM »
That's so true.

I think, this results from the fact, that the Tyros is very good sounding and, most important, very easy to use. Take for example the SA2 voices. They are fantastic, but no editable. And even the normal voices are not editable down to the layers.

In contrast to this, you have the PA4X (or even the smaller models PA600/PA900), which are deeply editable concerning all voice layers and all controllers. And the sound is quite good, as well. And the form factor is more similar to a professional synth than to a colorful blinking entertainer panel.

So in live bands you only see keyboards like Nord Stage/Electro, Kronos or Montage. But this is not fair. The voice capabilities of the Tyros/PSR line are very mighty due to the YEM, which allows to load high class samples. So I use my S970 in my rock band and not the Nord Electro, because the sound options of the S970 are more flexible. And in the small combo, where we use midi drums, the S970 is perfect and not beatable by any pro keyboard.

Uli

You are correct, you won't usually find a Tyros or even most brands arranger keyboard in a live band. It is not that type of keyboard. Perhaps Yamaha was at fault steering their Tyros series toward less user editing, and relying on the on-board voices, sound, and only purchased expansion. Of course this would still draw in the home player, but because of the sheer quality of the Tyros sounds and arranging capabilities, plenty of pro users were drawn in as well. Their is a small niche of pro, semi-pro "one-band-man" performers, gigging pros, composers, or used in a home studio setting, however, the Tyros series continued the lead in all these areas. The arranger "toolset" and sounds were there, and Tyros 5 users made known to Yamaha that they want more editing features back, new innovations, and full voice, drum kit creation, and sample editing back.

My position is, Yamaha still kept the lead in overall arranger sound quality and usable features and editing that would suffice both the home player and pro/semi-pro users alike. As Yamaha tried to escape user editing in the Tyros 5 and YEM concept, they rebound the best they could with YEM improvements (and Voice Creator functions) based on push-back from fine people, as found in this forum. Yes, the competitors surpassed Yamaha in many areas of user editing, and the Tyros platform is aged (also cosmetically), but I think the Genos will deliver in spades.

Two of the best pro Tyros 5 users I have come across were past forum members here. Both were banned...very unfortunate. Both ends of the creative spectrum, but superb creative composer/musicians, thinking outside-of-the-box, and choosing the Tyros 5 arranger for their arranging and final recordings.

One of the best Tyros 5 users I have come across was Alan-Russell. Hope he doesn't get mad me re-posting some of his links, as they were wiped out last year. Best example of pro arranging on his Tyros 5 and use of the ultra realistic SA2 voices. He was skilled and musically inclined enough to subtly use the SA2 effects as to get realistic results without overusing the effects. Orchestrations is a small genre of the capabilities of the Tyros 5 arranger, but in the right hands creates wonderful results as below.

Tyros 5. Arrangement. "Shiney Stockings"
https://app.box.com/s/9pamnoi88lq451h1zbviqslc74beln5n
Alan Russell Orchestration (c) 2016

"God Bless the Child"
https://app.box.com/s/dgpndg358i6a09rs9p6txvjm1vw51inb
Alan Russell Orchestration (c) 2016

"Stoned Soul Picnic"
https://app.box.com/s/mvuhakl49384b7jlw799u4u9157ic2ur
Alan Russell Orchestration (c) 2016

"Somebody Loves Me" Tyros 5. Multi-Track. Live 16
https://app.box.com/s/kejxx4z3gtqdek7iwjedf9rp0py4hywz
Alan Russell Orchestration (c) 2016

Then this is how his work was received in another forum with comments like this:
..."Great sound and playing, however what gives the game away that it is not real, (For even those who are not musicians) are the SA2 voices, which operate and add effects that no player would ever do, (SA2 while sounding great for home players, totally kills any form of realism for those that listen to real bands etc.) so drop these, and a lot of normal listeners having a general listen would not know that it was played on a keyboard...."

Both Alan-Russell and I have countered comments as above, but this person could never name another arranger keyboard, produce an example, or an alternate way of composing and creating another method of obtaining better or more authentic orchestration scores then through the Tyros 5 pro arranger. I wish Allan well, and hope perhaps the Genos could work even better for him, if that is in his future.

I personally think more pros and semi-pros use high end arrangers like the Tyros 5, for studio, commercial, live, or just for retirement use, but are hidden or just choose to stay out of public or forum light.

Regards, Marcus
Gear: Triangle
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2017, 06:21:59 AM »
Just wanted to say great post, Marcus. Good to read about how the Tyros is perceived and used by pro- and semi-pro musicians. It's strange how perceptions can impede the impact of a hugely capable keyboard like the Tyros 5 in the pro-arena.
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2017, 07:13:19 AM »
Marcus wrote:

Then this is how his work was received in another forum with comments like this:
..."Great sound and playing, however what gives the game away that it is not real, (For even those who are not musicians) are the SA2 voices, which operate and add effects that no player would ever do, (SA2 while sounding great for home players, totally kills any form of realism for those that listen to real bands etc.) so drop these, and a lot of normal listeners having a general listen would not know that it was played on a keyboard...."


These kind of comments are grounded in ignorance.  I followed Alan's progress with playing the SA2 wind instruments. He got pretty good at it I must say... but some of his articulations were off a bit.   Having tried with years of practice to emulate a real sax and flute with the VL synthesis, (which has even better articulation than SA2)... it is VERY difficult to get it just right on a keyboard... especially if you are not a horn player to begin with.

I would also like to associate myself with the many comments above on Yamaha's leadership and quality made arrangers by those several members who have stated so.

 8)

Joe H   
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 07:19:14 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline tyrosrick

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2017, 10:33:19 AM »
"Two of the best pro Tyros 5 users I have come across were past forum members here. Both were banned...very unfortunate"

Marcus, why were they banned?
Current Gear: Tyros 5 76 key, and a whole lot of ambition.
Past Gear: Motif XF6, and a whole lot of frustration.
and.....Magnus Chord Organ (when I was 10!)
 

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2017, 10:46:30 AM »
Hi Joe
We have similar Yamaha knowledge and experience with VL synthesis. Yamaha has always held the lead in innovation and technology. I have used a breath controller with my (Physical Modeling) VL board, with mixed results, but real authentic humanization can be be applied to certain voices with the WX wind controllers. As you say, it helps to be a horn/woodwind player ... to know the techniques and trigger note from the wind controller.

Yamaha WX11 Digital Wind Instrument Played by Roger Hagarty
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AH_w7AW7jPU

For a keyboard player, Yamaha adding Mega Voice technology within style programming certainly helped to raise the bar for how to make an instrument sound and act authentically. Same as the SA (Super Articulation) technology, which auto-applies realistic playing nuances to your keyboard playing. Better yet, is the SA2 technology, where the users has manual control to activate certain realistic articulations by means of the ART 1,2 buttons or through foot controls while continuing with auto-SA. Add a velocity sensitive keyboard with after-touch with all these combined technologies, nothing touches the realism of these SA2 voices. Of course, the more musical knowledge and playing technique the keyboard players has, the more authentic the voice is. However, for live playing and user control, no technology can touch this. I hope Yamaha continues improving in all these areas with the Genos or adding new technology.

Of course professional studios and other pros in the industry can get ultimate realism and professional results with expensive equipment, software, and high quality VTSs, but for live playing, these TOTL arrangers are second to none. My view is, Yamaha just does it the best. Whether for the enjoyment of the home player or the most demanding professional. Peter Baartmans said it best in the following video (see 1:40) -

"...The Tyros 5 is regarded as the most amazing digital keyboard in the world. Not only in the US, but in Europe and Asia. An amazing product...it is a product for everybody. From the most demanding musician, for producers, for studios...for people like you (audience) to enjoy some music...for teachers, because Yamaha always thinks of you, the player. How can we make the instrument work to satisfy every player. And one thing in this whole thing, is the most important...it has to sound good..."

Peter Baartmans Tyros 5 Concert At Keyboardamerica (Video 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1egfUuyPMqM 

Marcus
Gear: Triangle
 

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2017, 11:18:00 AM »
"Two of the best pro Tyros 5 users I have come across were past forum members here. Both were banned...very unfortunate"

Marcus, why were they banned?

There is always a fair gap between your beginner player and the more advanced players and others who use their products professionally in these forums. (B.*.*.*.) used his(?) Tyros 5 professionally for commercial sound tracks. He thought outside the box, was unique, and provided the most informative insight and posts, however to some were considered too far from the norm. I personally loved his posts, insight, responses, and posted work, but I guess others thought, not, and was banned. I don't remember seeing anything offensive, but miss his posts.

I think Alan was banned unjustly. He was even confused. This is a quote from him from another forum.
"I was also banned. I made constructive critiques to a few regulars in the Song's Forum and some admin saw it as harrassment. I got clipped."
Alan Russell


My understanding was, he made a constructive critique and advice to someone who posted a song. Alan has a professional music background, and was wholeheartedly giving positive advice, but apparently was viewed as harassing the person he was trying to help. As I said, that gap can create problems, hard feelings, non-direct intimidation or unintended misunderstandings. I miss both forum members, but I don't make or interpret the rules.

Regards, Marcus 
Gear: Triangle
 
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Offline tyrosrick

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2017, 12:22:22 PM »
Yeah, it sounds like he/they got a raw deal.
Current Gear: Tyros 5 76 key, and a whole lot of ambition.
Past Gear: Motif XF6, and a whole lot of frustration.
and.....Magnus Chord Organ (when I was 10!)
 

Offline EileenL

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2017, 12:54:29 PM »
I always say that if you can not accept constructive critique then you should not post your songs. We all gain a lot from others.

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #20 on: August 01, 2017, 03:35:23 PM »
I always say that if you can not accept constructive critique then you should not post your songs. We all gain a lot from others.

Well there is another side to that.  We should not give that kind of "advice" unless it is asked for.  Sometime unsolicited advice is NOT welcome, particularly when it come to commenting on our playing skills or even our tastes in music.

and I might add... there is an old saying that goes something like this... get the LOG out of your own eye before you attempt to get the splinter out of another's.

 ;)

Joe H
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 05:49:40 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Online Roger Brenizer

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #21 on: August 01, 2017, 03:51:46 PM »
Yes, Joe, I think we need to remember that not everyone who posts their music on the forum is looking for a critique or constructive criticism.  The context of our words can destroy a novice or intermediate players confidence in themselves.

In the old Walt Disney movie, Bambi, Thumper's mother reminded him of something his father had taught him; "If you don't have something nice to say about someone, then don't say anything at all."

The old saying you are referring to can be found in Biblical scripture:  Matthew 7:3-5 King James Version (KJV)
"Music Is My Life"
My best regards,
Roger

(The older I get...the better I used to be...LOL!!!)
Rogerís PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #22 on: August 01, 2017, 04:04:27 PM »
Yeah, it sounds like he/they got a raw deal.

No one is perfect, but I think the Administrators and Moderators do a pretty good job of things around here.  And part of their job is to deal with certain unpleasant circumstances from time to time.  So we need to respect they decisions... even if we may not agree with them.

Joe H
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 05:27:44 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline EileenL

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #23 on: August 01, 2017, 04:15:16 PM »
Note I did say constructive critique and that consist of very friendly help such as maybe trying a different style or suggesting a different chord. I know I welcome this from players that are much better than I and I try these things out and in most cases the performance sounds better so I am very grateful.

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2017, 04:22:07 PM »
Peter Baartmans is amazing on any keyboard.
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2017, 09:26:00 PM »
Joe and Roger are absolutely right.
We call it * Respect *  :).

Jeff



DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline EileenL

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #26 on: August 02, 2017, 02:44:06 AM »
I think we have got slightly of the topic. Roll on the new keyboard and let us hope it is a winner.

Offline tyrosrick

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2017, 02:48:27 AM »
Joe, my "raw deal" remark was based upon the way Marcus originally explained the reason. Perhaps there was more to the issue beyond what was presented in this string. However, if they were in fact banned without an opportunity to perhaps clarify their position, maybe even apologize to the offended party, and instead were summarily and immediately banned, then I stand by my comment that they received a raw deal from those in charge.
Current Gear: Tyros 5 76 key, and a whole lot of ambition.
Past Gear: Motif XF6, and a whole lot of frustration.
and.....Magnus Chord Organ (when I was 10!)
 

Offline Cosmorot

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2017, 05:00:14 AM »
Marcus, great examples of sound T5.
In general, it's strange that at this forum people are agitating to change Yam to Korg. Similar to sabotage  8)
I scrupulously choose each instrument to buy. After all, virtual samplers and synthesizers can easily replace modern keys.
But the T5 was able to alleviate the computer's CPU load by 70%! I did not find any sounds in Korg that could be used for show business.
(By the way the compositions written on Korg M3 on the Envato market were not missed in quality) Paradox  ???
In Japan, a "silicone syndrome" was born. What does it mean? They say that if the robot does not look like a human
 it causes sympathy. When a robot has human features - it causes antipathy, as an defective person. And only when the robot will be completely similar to the person - it will cause sympathy.
The same goes for the sound! While it looks like a "live" instruments - The listener hears a dirty trick. If the sound completely causes a feeling of "live" sound - it causes sympathy.
 Tyros 5 is the same "android" that looks like a person! I do not regret a single spent cents!
This is the same sound!
Korg for me ended on M1 ....
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2017, 05:32:28 AM »
Hi Eileen,

It must be very difficult for you to be an " ordinary " member of this group and be a representative of the Yami UK Management Team simultaneously. :P
Your " Silence Agreement " does not allow you to discuss any new products with us whilst you exactly know what the future will bring. 

It seems not to be easy at all. :'(

Best regards,
Jeff


 
« Last Edit: August 02, 2017, 05:33:49 AM by Jeff Hollande »
DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline EileenL

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2017, 07:03:59 AM »
Believe me Jeff I know no more than anyone does on this forum and am eagerly awaiting what is in store for us.

Offline Constrictor

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2017, 08:21:47 AM »
If Yamaha do not give full access to their ne KB without spending and arm and a leg for extra ram and expansion packs I am finished with Yamaha and believe me there is not one of my many friends that feels the same. Korg is taking the lead and the price is affordable to normal man on the street. seems like Yamaha is in competition with Wersi to see who can charge the most for and instrument

Come on Yamaha  you are going to loose thousands of customers

Chandeneze

Chandeneze, you're perfectly right for me.
Yamaha, has reached excessive prices with closed software and limited modifications.
Korg, it's very different.
I share what you say.
A greeting.
Franco

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #32 on: August 02, 2017, 08:27:17 AM »
I believe you. No doubt in my mind if you say so, Eileen.😄

It is hard to understand for me why Yami are forcing all people to sign agreements even when these people are not informed about new products to be launched soon unless they do not want to take any risk and demand all people involved are obliged to sign these agreements.

That might be the answer why there are never any leaks at all.

I must admit I am very impressed a multinational cy like Yami is able to hide all new product information even when the products are on their way to international customers all over the world shipped by third parties.

WOW !👏

Jeff

« Last Edit: August 02, 2017, 08:42:19 AM by Jeff Hollande »
DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline J. Larry

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2017, 09:19:43 AM »
Yes, thatís amazing how such information could be kept under wraps in this day of ďleaksĒ and ease of information flow in a media age.  Iíve often wondered if Yamaha has beta testers for new keyboards-----people like us, who play for fun, or maybe even professionally.  Or, do they keep testing and bug-fixing entirely in-house with the employee-demonstrators we see all the time in videos?
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #34 on: August 02, 2017, 10:04:26 AM »
A good question.

I am afraid Peter Baartmans will not give us the answer either.
Peter must have signed the Silence Contract too just like everybody within the Yami Group.

Apparently Yami can teach many companies how to hide secrets till the end. 😄

Jeff
DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline browzer

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #35 on: August 02, 2017, 10:06:36 AM »
Jeff,

I vaguely recalled reading quite a few comments from yourself (about 5 years ago) regarding the release of the PSR S950 where you predicted the release date and change of name of the Tyros series so I went back and had a look.

quoted is your very first PSR Tutorial forum post:

Hi Guys,

It has been confirmed the S910 successor, the PSRS950 will be available in the European shops at the end of this year.
No specs yet. Early October 2012.

The Successor of the Tyros4 will be available at the end of 2013.
The brand name Tyros will no longer be applicable.

Best regards from The Netherlands, Jeff :)

Since the follow up to the Tyros 4 was another Tyros and the S950 was released before Early October 2012 I'm hoping you are now using a different information source to stake your reputation on.  ;) ;)

I'll predict that Yamaha will release the information in a similar manner to what Apple (Etc) does with a new product and that is they will do it when they feel it is exactly the right time to do so. I'm really looking forward to seeing the specifications but I'm not going to get my knickers in a twist about it, I'm too busy enjoying my Tyros 5.

Ronnie
Tyros 5
 

Offline billtracy

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #36 on: August 02, 2017, 11:40:55 AM »
Jeff,

I vaguely recalled reading quite a few comments from yourself (about 5 years ago) regarding the release of the PSR S950 where you predicted the release date and change of name of the Tyros series so I went back and had a look.

quoted is your very first PSR Tutorial forum post:

Since the follow up to the Tyros 4 was another Tyros and the S950 was released before Early October 2012 I'm hoping you are now using a different information source to stake your reputation on.  ;) ;)

I'll predict that Yamaha will release the information in a similar manner to what Apple (Etc) does with a new product and that is they will do it when they feel it is exactly the right time to do so. I'm really looking forward to seeing the specifications but I'm not going to get my knickers in a twist about it, I'm too busy enjoying my Tyros 5.

Ronnie

Well, looks like Jeff is batting 0 for 1. :)

In his defense, there are at least two other tipsters who have essentially the same information-the new line will be called Genos and will be announced in September and shown to dealers. So, perhaps he has it right this time.  ;)
Current Gear: Roland E-A7, KRK Rokit 5s, Voicelive Play.
Previously Owned: Yamaha PSR-740, Yamaha PSR-1100, Yamaha PSR-S750, Roland BK-3.
 

Offline Marcus

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #37 on: August 02, 2017, 11:45:32 AM »
I recall this sneak photo, with a cut-out image of the Tyros 5 which I downloaded October 24, 2013. We discerned for days whether it was fake. It ended up being real, and secretly taken by a cell phone at a new Tyros 5 demo. We were also trying to guess what the purple type tone from the picture was. When we later saw the actual picture, lights from the display gave the appearance of a purple grey Tyros, but was just a darker tone grey compared to the Tyros 4.

It was also fun trying to guess what certain buttons were, and other new features from the blurry photo. I guess like peeking in the room on Christmas morning to check what Santa brought under the tree.

Marcus
Gear: Triangle
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #38 on: August 02, 2017, 12:05:57 PM »
Hi Ronnie,

Thank you for your message.

Tyros5

At that time one of Holland's most important dealers announced ( black on white ) - on the internet - the Tyros name would no longer exist after the Tyros4. Do not shoot the piano player, plse.  ;)

Delivery date of T5 was correct : at the end of 2013.

S950

Name was correct.
Delivery was a couple of weeks earlier.
It is always very difficult to predict exact dates.
All depends on shipping - and regional arrival dates and dealer orders. From Japan to Europe ( by boat ) approx. 3 months.

Genos

Exact dates of dealer meetings - and/or delivery dates can never be predicted.

- I said the dealer meeting will take place in Germany on September 10, 2017. It might be a week later as some are saying. Important ? I guess not.

- I told you the first deliveries will be available in October 2017. Might also be November 2017.

As I said before if none of my predictions are correct I will leave this Forum.


Regards, Jeff

DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #39 on: August 02, 2017, 12:26:15 PM »
... I must admit I am very impressed a multinational cy like Yami is able to hide all new product information even when the products are on their way to international customers all over the world shipped by third parties.

WOW !

Jeff

Yamaha probably owns the boats that are transporting the keyboards... manned by Yamaha employees.     ;D

Joe H
« Last Edit: August 02, 2017, 12:30:53 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline browzer

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #40 on: August 02, 2017, 12:35:39 PM »
Jeff,

I hope you don't think I was being so serious I was just trying to lighten the thread, I don't think you should be that worried, at least one of your predictions will be near enough to keep you with us on the forum, where would we be without our chief speculator to keep us interested enough to keep commenting, you never know Yamaha might be listening for ides for the Genos 2.  :)

Now talking of the Genos 2, will it incorporate Siri or Cortana?  ;D

All the best

Ronnie

Tyros 5
 

Offline Joe H

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #41 on: August 02, 2017, 12:39:52 PM »
... Now talking of the Genos 2, will it incorporate Siri or Cortana?  ;D ...

Ronnie

Don't be surprised if we are forced to talk to our arrangers one day... and then the darn things talk back to us (as well as start singing, as has already be discussed in another thread)

 :D

Joe H
« Last Edit: August 02, 2017, 03:20:38 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #42 on: August 02, 2017, 12:50:23 PM »
Ronnie :

No, no I am very serious.

I will leave if my Genos information is not correct.

Jeff




DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Online Roger Brenizer

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #43 on: August 02, 2017, 12:52:08 PM »
I believe you've forgotten, Jeff, that you aren't going anywhere.  You're currently in Lock Down!!!   ;)
"Music Is My Life"
My best regards,
Roger

(The older I get...the better I used to be...LOL!!!)
Rogerís PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #44 on: August 02, 2017, 09:09:51 PM »
Hi Roger,

I absolutely hope you are right.

I would miss my good friends I know for so many, many years.😥

But I will go if my Genos prediction is completely wrong.

I have made this decision a couple of weeks ago, announced it and that will not change.
Then I will no longer send any messages to this Forum.

I am who I am and that will not change either.
I am too old, I guess.😉

Cross my fingers.

Take care, Jeff

BTW
Up to now NOBODY confirmed the new arranger kb will be called GENOS !!!
« Last Edit: August 02, 2017, 09:37:27 PM by Jeff Hollande »
DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Online Roger Brenizer

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #45 on: August 02, 2017, 09:38:37 PM »
I only know one way to respond to you, Jeff.  :'(  :'(  :'(
"Music Is My Life"
My best regards,
Roger

(The older I get...the better I used to be...LOL!!!)
Rogerís PSR Performer Page
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #46 on: August 02, 2017, 11:15:33 PM »
Hi Roger,

I wish my prediction is correct ! :)

I am almost sure I am right.  :P
Time will tell.

Best regards, Jeff

DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline TwinTyros

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #47 on: August 02, 2017, 11:37:17 PM »
OMG. I've never seen a keyboard/organ community which will let their involved in all the speculations, rumours etc about a new Yamaha keyboard as we here.
And at the end, what will it bring us??? As soon the Tyros 6 is released we are back to business like we did in the period from the T1-T5.
At each upcoming new model we start over and over with this again. It seems it's more like a chronic Yamaha virus what we cannot cure.

I've been a player at Wersi organs for more than 30 years, and in all those year in the whole Wersi community I've never seen so much speculations, rumours etc as the Yamaha community. And why, maybe Wersi players are more patient in what will come and see and also if Wersi is introducing a new line/model the give us a slide more pre information. (Yamaha you could give us a bit more info, as you know already, the new models in the past were not so spectacular new and much more better than you hoped).

Be honest, was it each time so really spectacular great and shocking news when Yamaha released a new model. For example, The T1 yes it was, the T2 up to T5 no way, it was more a re-designed pre model with some new voices/rhythms. So really spectacular was it not. The new PSR670-770-970 same story when you compare these with the pre-models.

My first Yamaha was the T4, then I bought almost 3 years later a new T5 sold this one and bought again a new T5, was it a big step forward to do. Not really, ok, the T5 had full access to 2GB flash (only MUTEC, because Yamaha did not ever sold this one), a bigger harddisk, (not really necessary) and further a slight more extra's but not shocking comparing to the pre Tyros models. Now my T5 is barely used. I did invest more than 20K Euro at my Wersi organ and plays it more than my 4K Euro T5.

Al the time we spent at the rumours/speculations is so much waste of time i think. You will see when that "new" key is available
Am I going to upgrade my T5 for the "T6"?? No Thanks, the used market is full and the price for a T5 is  so dramatic low, I almost get a hart-attack.

So dear members, I wait for the moment when Yamaha introduce the new "Tyros 6" and will be glad to hear al your stories what you like or like not about that key. Possible it will be the same story a all the other stories I've read about current key.

So my dear friends, let's meet again in a couple of weeks.
Keep laughing and enjoying each day you live.

Bye
Regards,
Marcel
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #48 on: August 03, 2017, 12:29:06 AM »
Hi Marcel :

I agree the Tyros 2, 3, 4 and 5 were updates and surely no real upgrades. Not all members will agree with my words.  ::)

The reason why we are speculating is very simple : most of us like it and have fun.  ;)

Yamaha's ( present ) policy is to say nor to show nothing at all. Happened also to the T3, T4 and T5.

In my eyes a very bizarre strategy ... but who am I  ???

On the other hand I must admire Yami they are Masters in hiding new product information.
Even the name Genos has never confirmed yet.  :-[

Personally I do not like their marketing strategy at all but by forcing all their employees, dealers and transport companies to sign a Silent Agreement, they also force us to speculate and I think Yamaha like it.  ;)

More than one year we are discussing the new high end arranger keyboard whilst nobody knows how it will looke like.
But again ... it is funny !

Best wishes from The Netherlands, Jeff
   

DAWS MAC & WIN
 

Offline Jeff Hollande

Re: New Tyros 6 or genos
« Reply #49 on: August 03, 2017, 03:35:50 AM »
Maybe the genos is an accordeon, or even a new ipad app with arranger functionallity :) :)

If Yamaha want to preserve the Tyros brand name ( Tyros6 e.g. ) you might be quite right.  ;)
But I should be very surprised if it not will be called * Genos * or maybe a complete new name we have never heard before ... who knows.  :-[

Jeff
DAWS MAC & WIN