Author Topic: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?  (Read 3360 times)

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Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #50 on: July 23, 2017, 01:03:47 PM »
When I am reading all the expectations and wishes ( BTW I love to read them 😄 )  I hope and pray some of you will not be disappointed when the new keyboard will arrive in a couple of months.

The final product is finished and on its way to the enduser.
Nothing can be changed now. It is like it is and maybe some software updates ( bugs ) will follow later.

No doubt there will be improvements and probably important changes but in my opinion Yamaha will continue and follow their own traditional way of upgrading a product.

It means Yamaha will do what is possible to make the home player and gigger happy by introducing a plug-and-play arranger keyboard with more and better features and a better sound than ever before.

Jeff

XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #51 on: July 23, 2017, 01:34:15 PM »
Excellent points, Cal...Yamaha certainly has a "global" philosophy for styles. They are trying to be all things to all people. For me, I could care less about EDM, Ambient & Chill, R'n'B, Ethnic, and Asian instruments. I simply have no use for that stuff because my clients don't. Rather than fill the T5 memory full of things I'll never use, let me decide which styles I want to load. That's what Nord does. They sell you a keyboard loaded to the roof with voices, pianos, and synth samples. I can delete the whole lot and upload only those things I want. Yamaha brags about the 500 (give or take??) styles on the T5. If I only use 40 or 50 of them, the rest are useless. Let me free up memory to download other styles from the Yamaha Genos website...again, that's what Nord does. Instead, Yamaha creates an additional revenue stream by making you buy expansion modules and extra styles. I don't deny for one minute that style development is very pricey. I simply object to paying huge dollars for something and then find I need to contribute even more for some of the "extra neat stuff."

Someone wrote about the price we have to pay. Yamaha sets their price but they could care less about the extra that consumers must pay. There's VAT in Europe, HST in Canada, God knows what in the U.S., import tax, duty tax...the list of extra taxes goes on. All we want is value, and I feel that the Yamaha business model is stuck in the 1980s just like their terrible piano voices on the T5 :).
« Last Edit: July 23, 2017, 06:45:51 PM by Lee Batchelor »
Current Gear: Tyros 5, Nord Electro 5D, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compact speakers, 15 inch subwoofer designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44 sound interface.
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #52 on: July 23, 2017, 01:34:26 PM »
There are actually many good reasons to have your own currency. If you don't, you end up like Greece -- unable to deflate your currency in response to economic conditions. A common currency is great for tourists, but not for locals.

Fred

I think deflation and inflation are tricks to hide the problems, not solve them and make them only worse on the long run..
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #53 on: July 23, 2017, 01:36:49 PM »
When I am reading all the expectations and wishes ( BTW I love to read them 😄 )  I hope and pray some of you will not be disappointed when the new keyboard will arrive in a couple of months.

The final product is finished and on its way to the enduser.
Nothing can be changed now. It is like it is and maybe some software updates ( bugs ) will follow later.

No doubt there will be improvements and probably important changes but in my opinion Yamaha will continue and follow their own traditional way of upgrading a product.

It means Yamaha will do what is possible to make the home player and gigger happy by introducing a plug-and-play arranger keyboard with more and better features and a better sound than ever before.

Jeff

Or maybe Yamaha had to react to the dropping sales of arranger keyboards in the western market, while it still raises in the asian markets..  and add features to pull in more people in the main western market while keeping the current and asian markets happy
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Offline J. Larry

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #54 on: July 23, 2017, 04:43:28 PM »
With all the wishes and expectations posted over the past few months, I’ll read with interest the various postings, after folks have digested the styles, sounds, and features of the new board.  Will most be disappointed or exuberant? Maybe even speechless? Of course, it won’t be scientific, since most who post have either a gripe or compliment to make.  Possibly, most remain silent.  And, by the way, I applaud Lee’s post about all the unused styles on the T5.  I have the T5, with little use for the majority of styles.  How about purchasing a board empty of styles and only pay your dealer for the needed/wanted styles that are offered as special packages?  Why couldn’t a manufacturer offer a price scale based on available/selected options?





Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #55 on: July 23, 2017, 10:40:15 PM »
Hi B,

More than 90% of Yamaha's high end arranger keyboard's production is exported mainly to Europe, UK, Canada, Australia and the USA.

As far as I know Korg's high end models are manufactured in Italy but this information needs to be checked.👏

It is obvious Yamaha are obliged to follow the needs and expectations of their foreign customers very closely to keep their market position.

I may hope their local Yamaha distribution centres are fully aware of their enduser's needs, expectations and wishes to increase sales.

Personally I am afraid Yamaha Japan do not receive all the local marketing information they should know to understand the export enduser's needs better.

I believe the local Yamaha distribution centres focus on daily activities like stock, dealer control, forecast, sales results, competition and payments instead of the enduser's feedback.


Jeff
« Last Edit: July 23, 2017, 10:54:48 PM by Jeff Hollande »
XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #56 on: July 24, 2017, 01:17:23 AM »
Excellent points, Cal...Yamaha certainly has a "global" philosophy for styles. They are trying to be all things to all people. For me, I could care less about EDM, Ambient & Chill, R'n'B, Ethnic, and Asian instruments. I simply have no use for that stuff because my clients don't. Rather than fill the T5 memory full of things I'll never use, let me decide which styles I want to load. That's what Nord does. They sell you a keyboard loaded to the roof with voices, pianos, and synth samples. I can delete the whole lot and upload only those things I want. Yamaha brags about the 500 (give or take??) styles on the T5. If I only use 40 or 50 of them, the rest are useless. Let me free up memory to download other styles from the Yamaha Genos website...again, that's what Nord does. Instead, Yamaha creates an additional revenue stream by making you buy expansion modules and extra styles. I don't deny for one minute that style development is very pricey. I simply object to paying huge dollars for something and then find I need to contribute even more for some of the "extra neat stuff."

Agreed. I guess I was just arguing that I'd like to see some more 'diversity' in the online offerings as far as Styles and Sounds go. Tyros 5 hasn't been well-served in this respect, in my opinion. As of writing this, the Styles are mostly really cheesy Euro-pop/dance/folk/jazz/easy listening/soft rock, etc. The funny thing is that the T5 itself ships with a few (a precious few!) more experimental Styles (mostly those in the Ballad section - I'm thinking 'Chillout', etc) where we are given glimpses of what potential the T5's synth engine promises... but, mostly, we are served up the usual array of more conventional Styles and left to ponder what might have been.

I've said it before but it's worth restating: The T5 is a fantastic 'box of sounds' for any DAW-based musicians. As a multi-timbral MIDI sound generator and even as a MIDI master keyboard it's a brilliant workhorse and asset. But it's hampered, imo, by its out-dated Styles and the way that its arranger is not at all intuitive or compliant when struggling to integrate its many, many features into a DAW. These issues may or may not be important to traditional Tyros owners, I dunno. I can just state my perspective.

Oh, and one other thing, Yamaha: The Tyros 5 onboard sequencer is a textbook example of wasted time and effort. It's opaque, unintuitive, over-fussy and a liability. I would much rather the next arranger iteration came without any onboard sequencer if it means all that effort could instead be spent developing a dedicated PC/Mac DAW app for it instead. Really: who still uses an onboard sequencer these days? Anyone? Why waste any time or money developing one in this age?
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 01:20:17 AM by CalUKGR »
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #57 on: July 24, 2017, 01:19:01 AM »
Jeff, Korg is designed/developed in Italy... (the pa range of arranger, Kronos comes from Japan)

But produced in China, like most other major electronic brands weather instruments, TV, radio, laptops and such are all build in Asia. Even the high quallity apple products come from there.

Seems european labor is to expensive for production. Just look at our Dutch economy, where even the helpdesk of big companies is exported to India. There is jot much production left in Holland, except those things that can only be done locally.

All stands with the quallity controll of companies producing in China, Apple is king of that market. And i must admit, the buildquallity of the pa4x for a chinese product does not leave much room for complaints.
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #58 on: July 24, 2017, 01:31:55 AM »
With all the wishes and expectations posted over the past few months, I’ll read with interest the various postings, after folks have digested the styles, sounds, and features of the new board.  Will most be disappointed or exuberant? Maybe even speechless? Of course, it won’t be scientific, since most who post have either a gripe or compliment to make.  Possibly, most remain silent.  And, by the way, I applaud Lee’s post about all the unused styles on the T5.  I have the T5, with little use for the majority of styles.  How about purchasing a board empty of styles and only pay your dealer for the needed/wanted styles that are offered as special packages?  Why couldn’t a manufacturer offer a price scale based on available/selected options?

Those styles onboard are just a base to cover a broad range of things..

However, if you want anything special, you need to do this trough user styles. This is the bread and butter of Tyros 5, a limitless number of user styles.

An empty shell witouth styles would not work in my opinion. You need something to fall back to and build uppon.  All the onboard styles are a collection of what Yamaha build over the last 2 decades.

What yamaha could do however is offer a huge new amount of style expansions, and let every buyer choose 3 of those packs to start personifying their arranger. And advertising this part of the New keyboard. 

Yes, most of the current styles are what pushes new customers with a different taste in music, away from areanger keyboards, young people dont want a walz and a polka in their instrumenst and espescialy not a mazurka. Yet every other demo only shows the kind of music the current generation of arranger players often uses.


But throwing all that away (keep in mind that they dont raise the price that much of the arranger since they have been payed by previous Tyros models development). Would definately make the instrument much less attractive for the majorrity of the current owners. Its a matter of marketing to sel people a customisable arranger which they can make ready for their own purposes.


And what the younger people want is tools to create their own styles, onboard tools..  so they can take the personification up another step.
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #59 on: July 24, 2017, 02:50:31 AM »
And what the younger people want is tools to create their own styles, onboard tools..  so they can take the personification up another step.

Not just younger people - I find T5's Style making complicated to the point of not bothering. This is something Yamaha really have to get to grips with. There has to be an easier, more intuitive way to offer Style making to users with little to no technical knowledge. This would involve some kind of arranger-to-PC software with a clean, easy-to-follow GUI unless Yamaha provide a much better on-board experience. I've struggled and wrestled with the T5's on board Style creation and so much of it still escapes me. The overwhelming sensation I get that one simple mistake and I could easily lose hours of progress is just not conducive to experimentation and discovery. With T5, getting anything done with the on-board computer is almost always a 'one step forward, three steps back' kind of thing.

SOLUTION: Take it all off the arranger and put it onto a PC with a much more friendly interface (one designed for those us us who are not intimately acquainted with all the technical nomenclature) and the promise of 'create your own styles!' might actually come true for the majority. It can't be that difficult to do. It just can't. It's such a major selling point I just don't understand why Yamaha have not set up a software team specifically tasked with producing a user-friendly software app to do just this.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 02:53:09 AM by CalUKGR »
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #60 on: July 24, 2017, 04:46:49 AM »
Hi Bachus,

Thank you for your Korg information. Very useful for my personal information.  :)

The comments and wishes of other members are very interesting.   
Maybe none of the Yamaha marketing managers will ever read these messages.
I feel very sorry whilst many ideas and suggestions are really good.

I remember some years ago one of Yahama's key managers was saying : " A Yamaha arranger keyboard should be found in every household."

As long as it is Yamaha's intention and policy to manufacture a high end keyboard for home users only, we have to accept people are looking for alternatives.

I agree Yamaha should think it over to build different versions of their high end arranger keyboard.
One version for the home player and one version for endusers who want more than " sit and play ".

As I said yesterday, the Genos is ready for distribution.

The Genos will be a " Yamaha " upgrade but will surely not meet all requests, I guess.   
The Genos might be a different arranger keyboard than all its predecessors.
This new product has been manufactured for the same target customer group as before.

I believe it will be hard to convince Yamaha to change their policy.
Apparently they  ( and most of their customers ) are very pleased with the success of the last 15 years.


Best wishes,
Jeff







 
 


« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 04:48:23 AM by Jeff Hollande »
XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #61 on: July 24, 2017, 04:52:09 AM »
I'm not suggesting Yamaha give us an empty box (no styles), and then have us choose those we most often use. I'm saying, let us delete those styles that waste valuable memory and let us download the styles from the Yamaha website that we need. Freeing up the memory can then be used to store our own creations, but with one condition: we need a decent DAW for creating songs and styles!!

I know the latter point has been mentioned a lot, and I fully agree that on-board sequencers are stuck in the dark ages. The recording part is super easy. It's editing the end product that is almost impossible. To do so, you must drill through endless menus trying to find that one note that is the wrong pitch and velocity - and that's after you navigate to the correct track. Drilling down through menus is the one thing computer users hate, with a passion. This task comes under the heading of "Usability." Document usability is a subject I teach at a Toronto technical writing school. As far as recording anything from a keyboard is concerned, there are far easier ways. Almost everyone owns a computing device of some sort that can be used for a suitable DAW.

To be fair, I believe Yamaha created the portable arranger keyboard as a way for people to replace that big hunk of furniture in the living room. For example, a dual manual organ, Clavinova, and even a real piano. I sometimes wonder if they ever dreamed that the arranger keyboard would blossom into the current market usage. There are a lot of us who load our arrangers into the car, along with a small (and sometimes large) sound system, and go out playing for parties and other events. That's the market who especially need far more flexibility with styles.
Current Gear: Tyros 5, Nord Electro 5D, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compact speakers, 15 inch subwoofer designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44 sound interface.
 

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #62 on: July 24, 2017, 04:54:09 AM »
Quote
I believe it will be hard to convince Yamaha to change their policy.

Not if sales for the same old arranger, plummet :)! Good points, Jeff but all companies are profit driven. If people get fed up with the same old arranger, Yamaha will respond. I agree with earlier comments that the Genos will be a complete overhaul of the Tyros series. If not, Yamaha would call it the Tyros 6 :).
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 04:56:59 AM by Lee Batchelor »
Current Gear: Tyros 5, Nord Electro 5D, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compact speakers, 15 inch subwoofer designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44 sound interface.
 

Offline EileenL

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #63 on: July 24, 2017, 06:00:03 AM »
For myself and probably hundreds of other people I buy a keyboard that will give me everything I need to just sit and play it. I do all my recording in Midi. If it needs a tweak here and there I do this in the song creator and when happy with it I then record to WAV on the keyboard. I also tailor styles to my use and voices also.
   Everything I do is all done on the keyboard which I think a lot of people don't really get into. I would hate to do anything that meant linking up a computer to it. As for styles there are lots about and, Yamaha Music soft has styles for most countries and tastes. There are also companies that produce dedicated styles for certain songs. All in all I am quite happy with what Yamaha produce and look forward to the new one.

Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #64 on: July 24, 2017, 06:06:45 AM »
Thank you, Lee for your reply.

Potential Genos Sales Threats

01. Today many households have other financial priorities than buying a new arranger keyboard. Ask Mamma.  ;)
02. Many T5 home players are pleased with their keyboard as it is and do not want to upgrade soon.
03. The expected new Genos software structure ( if available ) might create fear. Potential buyers want to be sure their "old " software will be 100% usable.
04. The sales price will be higher.
05. It looks like the Genos will be completely new : new design, new speaker set, new stand, new sound and new software. No spontaneous purchase.
06. Attractive Tyros5 offers.
07. Korg PA4X.
08. The price value of second hand Tyros keyboards after the introduction of the Genos.


Jeff   
XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Offline Dnj

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #65 on: July 24, 2017, 06:37:02 AM »
1-  Lighter weight
2-  less real estate (smaller overall body design)
3-  a better quality VH on par with TC Helicon
4-  offer a case soft/hard option with kb
5-  much bigger tilt-up display then tyros or a tablet dock hookup/holder
6-  neutrik/xlr dual mic/instr inputs
7-  61/76/88 options
8-  color options black/red/silver
9-  quality keybed
10-much easier style creator
11-smf to style creator
12-indented carry handles on each side
13-second keyboard controller option hookup
14-No wall wart AC plug
15-beginner/advanced series DVD instruction included
16-onboard speakers
17-separate outputs for drums, /style parts etc,.
18-quality non wiggle sliders & knobs

and that's just for starters..... 8)

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #66 on: July 24, 2017, 06:37:11 AM »
08. The price value of second hand Tyros keyboards after the introduction of the Genos.


Jeff

How do you think that will go? I will probably look to be selling my Tyros 5 (bought brand new just a year ago and in perfect working order - never gigged, home use only (just me)). How likely I could ask £2000 for it (includes absolutely everything - Yamaha stand, speakers, 1GB expansion, various Style files and Sound expansions, plus complete purchase history and all original documentation and packaging, etc).

Just curious - is that kind of asking price realistic?
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 06:38:38 AM by CalUKGR »
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #67 on: July 24, 2017, 07:30:56 AM »
If you should sell it now, the price is OK.

Jeff
XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Offline Joe H

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #68 on: July 24, 2017, 08:05:21 AM »


1... There has to be an easier, more intuitive way to offer Style making to users with little to no technical knowledge.

2... (one designed for those us us who are not intimately acquainted with all the technical nomenclature) and the promise of 'create your own styles!' might actually come true for the majority. It can't be that difficult to do.

3... I just don't understand why Yamaha have not set up a software team specifically tasked with producing a user-friendly software app to do just this.

1. There IS an easy way now, just use Style Creator Assembly, it doesn't get any easier than that, and yet it still takes a lot of work to polish up the final new style. 

2. I have been told by someone at Yamaha that they have considered it a several occasions over the years, but as has been noted many times, it appears that Yamaha has chosen to not give us the software in order to force us to pay $9.00 USD for a single style. for sure there is enormous costs in producing a style.

3. To create a style from scratch requires a lot of different skills... typically beyond the average home player or even the pro musician.  If Yamaha ever does release  style Creator software it should incorporate a database of about 40,000 drum loops and phrases organized by categories of different music genre that we can be assembled into a custom style.

Joe H

« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 08:07:58 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #69 on: July 24, 2017, 08:26:08 AM »
Quote

3. To create a style from scratch requires a lot of different skills... typically beyond the average home player or even the pro musician.  If Yamaha ever does release  style Creator software it should incorporate a database of about 40,000 drum loops and phrases organized by categories of different music genre that we can be assembled into a custom style.

Joe H

Actually this is how most people work in DAW's ..

They copy loops and phrases. As its to hard for most people to create all tracks froms cratch..

Having such a database is probably the only way to do this...

But then when you look at the Tyros 5 there is 600 styles x ( 4 var + 4 fill + 3 intro + 3 ending) there is allready like 7000 loops and phrases.  Thats a good number to start with.
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #70 on: July 24, 2017, 12:57:25 PM »
Actually this is how most people work in DAW's ..

They copy loops and phrases. As its to hard for most people to create all tracks froms cratch..

Having such a database is probably the only way to do this...

But then when you look at the Tyros 5 there is 600 styles x ( 4 var + 4 fill + 3 intro + 3 ending) there is allready like 7000 loops and phrases.  Thats a good number to start with.

^This is spot-on. All it needs is a good software app to bring it all together in a user-friendly way and suddenly creating loops is as easy as drag-n-drop. I mean, I was creating sequences with audio loops decades ago with eJay software (remember that?), and these days you can use MIDI or REX loops in just about any DAW. This doesn't have to be difficult - it just needs a professional structure designed with a non-technical end-user in mind.

Style Creator Assembly seemed like a good idea until I tried it - none of it makes any sense to me and it's all unintuitive to me. :-[ I need 'EASY-TO-USE'. I can do easy. ;)
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Offline Joe H

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #71 on: July 24, 2017, 01:19:30 PM »
I have made a request to Thomas at midisoft to add "Import MIDI Loop" to his StyleMagic software.  I told him that it would revolutionize style making.  I suggested that in the Channels Manager screen... if we could Import a loop directly to ANY style Part of ANY style Section this would make creating styles a breeze.

If anyone cares to send him an email requesting this function please do so.    http://www.midisoft.pl/en/  there is a contact page on his website.  He is currently working on a more modern looking interface for the program.  Updating the program to include Import MIDI Loop would make it a killer program.

Michael Bedeem's MixMaster has the capability of creating MIDI loops from Multi Pads and style parts... and I believe this can be done with a batch process also.  Meaning we could generate large numbers of MIDI loops in a hurry completely compatible with our arranger style format.

8)

Joe H
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 01:23:14 PM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #72 on: July 24, 2017, 02:47:36 PM »
That's really exciting, Joe! Thanks for the info...
Current Gear: Tyros 5, Nord Electro 5D, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compact speakers, 15 inch subwoofer designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44 sound interface.
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #73 on: July 25, 2017, 12:20:53 PM »
I have made a request to Thomas at midisoft to add "Import MIDI Loop" to his StyleMagic software.  I told him that it would revolutionize style making.  I suggested that in the Channels Manager screen... if we could Import a loop directly to ANY style Part of ANY style Section this would make creating styles a breeze.

If anyone cares to send him an email requesting this function please do so.    http://www.midisoft.pl/en/  there is a contact page on his website.  He is currently working on a more modern looking interface for the program.  Updating the program to include Import MIDI Loop would make it a killer program.

Michael Bedeem's MixMaster has the capability of creating MIDI loops from Multi Pads and style parts... and I believe this can be done with a batch process also.  Meaning we could generate large numbers of MIDI loops in a hurry completely compatible with our arranger style format.

8)

Joe H

Joe you need to check out the latest of Ketron, the SD9 pro.  It has a launchpad feature, which exactly does what you want...

http://www.ketron.it/images/ketron/manualiPdf/Tutorial%20SD9%20inglese_web.pdf

Also check out the style modeling feature... it has the database as we discussed earlier.. with all those tracks..  i hope Yamaha took a look at this..
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Offline Joe H

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #74 on: July 25, 2017, 12:32:42 PM »
Bachus,

Well maybe those 7000 arps from the Motif XF will be in the next arranger.  In Style Creator Assembly we are is basically doing that same thing and copying all Mixing Console settings along with the loop... which is sometimes good and sometimes not so good.

We just need some new content.  Wouldn't it be nice if Yamaha gave us or even sold a database of drum loops and phrases for Style Creator  Assembly.  I have been making them myself and am currently converting the 600 Multi Pads I bought from Easy Sounds into "Style Phrases" that can be used in Style Creator Assembly

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #75 on: July 25, 2017, 01:51:37 PM »
Bachus,

Well maybe those 7000 arps from the Motif XF will be in the next arranger.  In Style Creator Assembly we are is basically doing that same thing and copying all Mixing Console settings along with the loop... which is sometimes good and sometimes not so good.

We just need some new content.  Wouldn't it be nice if Yamaha gave us or even sold a database of drum loops and phrases for Style Creator  Assembly.  I have been making them myself and am currently converting the 600 Multi Pads I bought from Easy Sounds into "Style Phrases" that can be used in Style Creator Assembly

Joe H
having those arps would be a blessing


The Ketron interface is so much more intuitive then the style creator assembly...  thats what makes it feel like a totally different ..  so easy to sample all those style parts...
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net
 

Offline Marcus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #76 on: July 26, 2017, 03:45:34 AM »
Bachus,

Well maybe those 7000 arps from the Motif XF will be in the next arranger.  In Style Creator Assembly we are is basically doing that same thing and copying all Mixing Console settings along with the loop... which is sometimes good and sometimes not so good.

We just need some new content.  Wouldn't it be nice if Yamaha gave us or even sold a database of drum loops and phrases for Style Creator  Assembly.  I have been making them myself and am currently converting the 600 Multi Pads I bought from Easy Sounds into "Style Phrases" that can be used in Style Creator Assembly

Joe H
I usually view it the other way around, finding suitable style parts to convert to multipads. Why work multipads back into style parts? There are literally hundreds of thousands of Yamaha styles and multipads that can be used in Style Creator and Assembly, plus tons of MIDI phrases/drum loops that are compatible with Yamaha styles. Most of my arranging and custom styles are made (modified) within the Tyros 5 Style Creator. No lack of Yamaha resources. No need to touch or consider Korg or Ketron with the power Yamaha has.

The Tyros 5 DSPs are outstanding. You can rework a Yamaha style with amazing results within style creator, re-voicing and adding DSP effects. Real Reverb in the Reverb block or other DSP1 effects. Most Tyros 5 users don't realize, but you can rework a style in Style Creator and made dynamic changes (on-the-fly) while the style part/loop plays (and heard), adding sweeping pan effects dynamically changing/adjusting a DSP1 part or even the Reverb part while each style part plays and is reworked.

Recent Yamaha Premium Style programming is outstanding. Sometimes I may purchase a style just for a single style part that I can reassemble into a custom style. The TOTL Tyros 5 gives me the tools and variety of styles to rework or optimize a style, multipad, or MIDI file to suit my purposes. Would love to tinker with any new innovations or features on the upcoming Genos, or rework previous Tyros 5 content to any of the upgraded voices, drum kits or DSPs.

Regards, Marcus   
« Last Edit: July 26, 2017, 03:46:50 AM by Marcus »
 

Offline Stijn

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #77 on: July 26, 2017, 04:11:42 AM »
I usually view it the other way around, finding suitable style parts to convert to multipads. Why work multipads back into style parts? There are literally hundreds of thousands of Yamaha styles and multipads that can be used in Style Creator and Assembly, plus tons of MIDI phrases/drum loops that are compatible with Yamaha styles. Most of my arranging and custom styles are made (modified) within the Tyros 5 Style Creator. No lack of Yamaha resources. No need to touch or consider Korg or Ketron with the power Yamaha has.

The Tyros 5 DSPs are outstanding. You can rework a Yamaha style with amazing results within style creator, re-voicing and adding DSP effects. Real Reverb in the Reverb block or other DSP1 effects. Most Tyros 5 users don't realize, but you can rework a style in Style Creator and made dynamic changes (on-the-fly) while the style part/loop plays (and heard), adding sweeping pan effects dynamically changing/adjusting a DSP1 part or even the Reverb part while each style part plays and is reworked.

Recent Yamaha Premium Style programming is outstanding. Sometimes I may purchase a style just for a single style part that I can reassemble into a custom style. The TOTL Tyros 5 gives me the tools and variety of styles to rework or optimize a style, multipad, or MIDI file to suit my purposes. Would love to tinker with any new innovations or features on the upcoming Genos, or rework previous Tyros 5 content to any of the upgraded voices, drum kits or DSPs.

Regards, Marcus   

Hear, hear!
One good thing about music; when it hits you, you feel no pain.
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #78 on: July 26, 2017, 04:50:38 AM »
Hear, hear!

I'm gonna jump in and say I find this discussion about remixing styles/multipads, etc fascinating - and I just want to know more. Why do I struggle to understand how this all works? I'm really not half as astute with this stuff as I like to think and it's frankly embarrassing. I know the potential is there in my T5 - because I read stuff like this - but I have such a lot of difficulty unlocking that potential and finding any coherent way into exploiting it.

Has anyone written a 'Style Assembly For Dummies' type guide? I really want to knuckle down and get to grips with it. It just seems like I have this amazing, wonderful Tyros 5 and I'm a bit a fraud as I just don't even know the first thing about how to discover how to get so much more from it. I find Yamaha's own manuals opaque to the point of incomprehension...

I guess what I'm after is an step-by-step 'Create or remix Styles on the T5' example guide or tutorial. If anyone knows of such a thing or feels moved to write one in plain, non technical English I would be extremely grateful. I can follow a process (if it's well-explained and logical) and I can memorise that and then hopefully build upon it.
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Online Jeff Hollande

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #79 on: July 26, 2017, 05:41:22 AM »
Maybe progs made by Michael B and Joergen S could be helpful, Cal ?

Jeff

XGW - SONAR PLATINUM - CUBASE 8 WIN - MIXCRAFT8
 

Offline pjd

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #80 on: July 26, 2017, 06:08:40 AM »
Hello Cal --

I've attached a rather old style assembly tutorial by Heratch Touresian. (Is Heratch still with Yamaha, I wonder?)

I remember seeing a You Tube video or two about style assembly. Perhaps someone has the links?

All the best -- pj

Music technology blog: http://sandsoftwaresound.net/

Offline Joe H

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #81 on: July 26, 2017, 07:49:38 AM »
This information is also in the PSR Tutorial lessons.

http://psrtutorial.com/lessons/tune/newStyle/index.html

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline Joe H

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #82 on: July 26, 2017, 07:56:46 AM »
Marcus,

You wrote:  I usually view it the other way around, finding suitable style parts to convert to multipads. Why work multipads back into style parts?


The Multi Pads I referred to are new Dance Pads.  They have never been style Parts.  Converting the MPs to style parts gives me better access to all editing capabilities right on the keyboard... though I could do it in software, some things are easier done on the keyboard.

I also convert MIDI loops, S970 and Motif Arps to style parts for the same reason.

Joe H
« Last Edit: July 26, 2017, 08:02:09 AM by Joe H »
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline CalUKGR

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #83 on: July 26, 2017, 08:35:13 AM »
Hello Cal --

I've attached a rather old style assembly tutorial by Heratch Touresian. (Is Heratch still with Yamaha, I wonder?)

I remember seeing a You Tube video or two about style assembly. Perhaps someone has the links?

All the best -- pj

Music technology blog: http://sandsoftwaresound.net/

Thank you so much!
Yamaha Tyros 5 | Roland A-800 Pro | Cubase 9 Elements | Spectrasonics: Omnisphere, Keyscape & Stylus RMX | Arturia Spark 2 | Yamaha APX 700II 12-String Acoustic-Electric Guitar
 

Online jwyvern

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #84 on: July 26, 2017, 09:46:56 AM »
There's also a simple procedure given in the T5 reference manual page 37.
I don't use assembly sufficiently frequently so always forget the detail by the time I need it again, and that ref. Manual paragraph gets me back on track.
John





 

Online Bachus

Re: what are your wishes and expextations for Genos?
« Reply #85 on: July 27, 2017, 02:43:46 AM »
Marcus,

You wrote:  I usually view it the other way around, finding suitable style parts to convert to multipads. Why work multipads back into style parts?


The Multi Pads I referred to are new Dance Pads.  They have never been style Parts.  Converting the MPs to style parts gives me better access to all editing capabilities right on the keyboard... though I could do it in software, some things are easier done on the keyboard.

I also convert MIDI loops, S970 and Motif Arps to style parts for the same reason.

Joe H
i agree with you Joe..  things like this work both ways..

To me most of the time, the pads are equall to 4 extra switchable style tracks.
Life is like a box of chocolats, you never know what you are gonna get, so enjoy them all.  I am wayting for the next box of chocolate the Yamaha Genos.

Admin of : www.keyszone.boards.net