PSR Tutorial Forum
Yamaha Keyboards (4 Boards) => The Next Yamaha Keyboard => Topic started by: metcam on August 07, 2019, 10:22:28 AM
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HI everybody!
"GENOS2 " probably will be lunched 2 years from now so probably 2021.
Please write here any your wish and idea,sugestions.
As we know Yamaha read this forum and They already inplement a lot of wishes and ideas in past.
BEST REGARDS and Thank you YAMAHA.
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TERCA
Yamaha added to NEW SX-900/700 a Sub scale which is only HALF job done to have 100% perfect and accured "Terca"
To have Perfect options to have Terca this whats ned to be done in NEXT update for SX-900/700 and Next GENOS2:
1. Note shift to all individuals tones +/-12 separate for R1,R2,R3
2.Tuning scale individual for R1,R2,R3 (SUB scale in new SX-900/700)
3.Base note-which we already have
4. Posability to memorized in Reg.Memory all
Something as this picture show:
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Thanks metcam. Great theme and even better suggestion for "terce". Adjusting tones using halftones is very similar to the HARMONY we already have in Genos. This way they could do their "own Harmony Duet" that is not in the factory settings.
I have a proposal related to the Playlist view. I have over 600 playlists and it is hard to make quick selections at a live performance. For example, when I am at number 105, I have to click many times to get to 420. Choosing a number from a list with a Data Dial circle is not precise enough and is not practical. I suggest the following solution. It would be great if the Playlists main screen on the right hand side has dialing. (picture) So we could instantly pick up the Playlist number we need. List edit (Add Record) can be in the drop-down menu because we use it when we're not in a live performance situation.
This is my small suggestion and suggestion for improvement. I believe other members of the forum will be involved with their suggestions. I am sure that Yamaha, as it has done so far, will upgrade the new models with options that customers need.
Best regards, ckobu
[attachment deleted by admin]
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I really hope they put "Make a hit song for me" button. ;D ;D
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The new Korg PA5X might be a very helpful and useful source of inspiration to make your Genos2 wish list. 🔔
But ... it might be possible the Genos2 will arrive earlier than the PA5X ... time will tell.
Babette
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I really hope they put "Make a hit song for me" button. ;D ;D
Good to introduce yourself and write "complete newbie in music scene" (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,50899.0.html). ;)
Everyone who has been following this forum for a long time knows that Yamaha is closely following everything written here. So it's funny when you say, "Make a hit song for me" button.
The Yamaha team has upgraded keyboards many times by reading suggestions from this forum. So thank you Yamaha. That's why we buy Yamaha, not Casio (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,51017.msg399049.html#msg399049). :P
Just a month ago, @valimates wanted to have a Tempo Reset function (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,50544.msg394973.html#msg394973). And the SX900 came with that feature. 8)
Some time ago @metcam requested the PORTAMENTO (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,33627.0.html) function. Miracles, Genos has just that function, it's just called MONO LEGATO. There are many examples of this, from the 76-key keyboard (Tyros5), touch screen or Joystick (Genos, SX).
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The Yamaha team has upgraded keyboards many times by reading suggestions from this forum. So thank you Yamaha. That's why we buy Yamaha, not Casio (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,51017.msg399049.html#msg399049). :P
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BINGO!!!
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Why on earth would a Korg PAX5 be mentioned on a Genos2 wish list. Have you got shares in Korg Babette.
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Hi Eileen :
Years ago Korg came with a touch screen and a joystick.
Even with a " tiltable " touch screen ...
In the past you NEVER liked arranger keyboards with touch screens. Remember ?
Apparently you changed your mind since Yamaha introduced their touch screen and their joystick ( instead of the
2 wheels ).🔔
It might be possible other Korg features will be installed ( like a " tiltable " touch screen e.g. ) in the next
Yamaha arrangers, why not ?
Take care, Babette
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STYLE CREATOR:
We need OCTAVE -2/+2 posability for all channels in style creator.
We have now OCTAVE trough High Key/Note Limit which is slow and complicated for many people.
Regards
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Years ago touch screens were very small and I did not like the idea of one on my Yamaha. But the genos screen is quite large and works very well so had to change my mind as I wanted all the rest of the goodies that comes with it. I don't think there would be an advantage to having it tilt though.
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Hi :
I should not be surprised the Yamaha touch screen will become tiltable in the near future. Never say never. We simply do not know ( yet ).
IMHO it might be useful if people want to play outside ?
Also another Korg feature ain't so bad : playing chords in intro's and endings. A nice feature, right ?
There is nothing better than the Yamaha Genos sound quality for the time being. Everybody does agree, I guess.
We recently have been told by a member called Qui, a Dutch Genos and PA4X owner and pro musician, the sound of the latest Korg styles has been improved a lot.
One expects their sound quality might be much better in the near future ( PA5X ? ) than ever before. Just speculation or true ? Time will tell.
I think nobody will deny Korg are very serious competitors but up to now they do not produce plug-and-play arrangers like Yamaha.
It seems Korg players need a lot of time before they know all ins and outs of their arranger.
On the other hand all their updates and new styles are always free of charge.
Best regards, Babette
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Babette, Eilen
Why do some topics completely lose their purpose?
It's simple, because the title of the topic does not read and follows its meaning. ;)
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Wish list Genos
- 8 Gb Flash mem ( öre more)
- Oled screen ( very high def)
- metal case finish, black
- on board voice editor
- new foot pedal like the Mfc10 and all the controls
- smaller design
- better I-pad integration, or android apps
- better build quality
HDMi output
YC61 sound engine
Full style editor
Automatic VH like that other top arranger :)
- better Rotary effect with decent overdrive programmable
- a decent replacement form YEM ( it’s terrible now)
Soryt 😎🎹👌🏻
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Hi Ckobu :
You are absolutely right. I fully agree.
Plse ask a moderator of this forum to remove my comments if you do not believe our main competitor might be a good source of inspiration to add some new features and/or improvements to the present Yamaha highend arranger.
Only a moderator can remove my comments.Not me, sorry.
Best wishes, Babette
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Competitor keyboards should have no part in discussing what we want to see on the next update.
Do not think Yamaha would want to hear about putting content on from them. We were asked what Yamaha additions we would like to see on the next flag ship. I would like to see Chord Looper and a little more memory.
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I want integrated DAW ("Yamaha does own Cubase) with ability to add unlimited vsts.
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MIDI & STYLE play at same time:
Right now we have: MIDI play and style play at same time , MIDI stop style continue play, MIDI start again automaticly style STOP.
We need: MIDI play and style play at same time,MIDI stop style continue play,Midi start again style ""CONTINUE"" play.
Thank you Yamaha.
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Years ago touch screens were very small and I did not like the idea of one on my Yamaha. But the genos screen is quite large and works very well so had to change my mind as I wanted all the rest of the goodies that comes with it. I don't think there would be an advantage to having it tilt though.
Hello Eileen
When yamaha launches the tiltable display you will agree and say it is good.
Enildo
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Competitor keyboards should have no part in discussing what we want to see on the next update.
Do not think Yamaha would want to hear about putting content on from them. We were asked what Yamaha additions we would like to see on the next flag ship. I would like to see Chord Looper and a little more memory.
I think it's okay to cite model enhancements from other companies. The Joystick, chord looper and touch screen were launched by korg and yamaha had to surrender to these features otherwise it would be left behind in time. The forum is for yamaha keyboard discussions, of course, but there's no harm in quoting here Roland, Cassio, Korg, Ketron, etc. If we are only within our world and have no extra references, the tendency is to be left behind. Other companies also make improvements based on what yamaha owns.
Enildo
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At the moment Enildo I am quite happy with the screen being fixed. Whether it tilts or not you would still need shading in bright sunlight as we did with the Tyros 5.
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Eileen, our problem is that we are always running after the icing on the cake.
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SONG POSITIONS BOOTONS:
Since Yamaha rise song to 3MB now we need more "SONG POSITIONS markers"
It would be nice if Yamaha make in GENOS2 a minimum 8 or even better 12 of SONG POSITIONS markers:
Something like this:
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Controling the balance between the volume of style/song and the parts played manually.
1) using the foot expression pedal
2) using a midi foot controller (with expression pedal)
3) using an on board fader
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Possibility to connect pdf files in addition to txt files
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Hello everyone,
Many members here are not concerned but for the future Genos, i would like the screen of Genos offers two keyboard modes QZERTY and AZERTY so the user French or Belgian will be able to choose between these two modes. Windows does it well.
This could even be proposed in a future update of the current Genos.
Thank you in advance to Mr. Yamaha.
Best regards
Jean-Pierre 33
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TERCA
Yamaha added to NEW SX-900/700 a Sub scale which is only HALF job done to have 100% perfect and accured "Terca"
To have Perfect options to have Terca this whats Ned to be done in NEXT update for SX-900/700 and Next GENOS2:
1. Note shift to all individuals tones +/-12 separate for R1,R2,R3
2.Tuning scale individual for R1,R2,R3 (SUB scale in new SX-900/700)
3.Base note-which we already have
4. Posability to memorized in Reg.Memory all
Something as this picture show:
A lot of my friend musicians agree with this topic that is key for GENOS2 or even GENOS1 with update or SX-900/700 to increase sale in Western Europe/Balkan and all around world …….
So really we expect Yamaha to go to next move... :)
Thanks Yamaha.
Best regards to all musicians from everywere.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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I would like better compatibility with the MPE midi standard to use ROLI RISE49 as a second keyboard, but directly in Yamaha midi, without the need of a computer.
I would look forward to more open system for new sounds, vst-s ex like SWAM-like editable sax, flute etc.
More simple ways to use other controllers, like breath controller to play Yamahas new, fully editable, built-in 5D instruments :-)
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Full onboard sound editing, as is currently done in YEM, but using a UI as per the montage/modx.
The structure is the same - 8 elements per voice/sound/part - it would relatively easy I reckon and be a strong feature.
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When there is no function selected and when we turn the Dial up wheel, nothing happens. It would be useful if we could select one function that would be the basis for Dial up. I would definitely choose Tempo because I use it most often. If you then manually select another function such as sound, rhythm or volume, Dial up will change that value.
I believe that this option would not be a problem to incorporate into an existing OS in Genos.
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Hello Everyone,
I've been following the discussion on the 'Tilt' screen and I think it is vital for people like myself who play at Senior Homes because the Home I play at regularly, use their large conservatory which means most of the time the sun is shining on the area allocated to my keyboard and although I liked the Genos (particularly the R-n-R styles) I only kept it two weeks before trading it in for another Tyros 5 with it's lovely CLEAR TO READ 'TILTING SCREEN' and I have no regrets at all. However if Yamaha can see their way clear to putting a screen as good as the Tyros 5 on the Genos in the future, then I could possibly be persuaded to do another trade-in. "Each to his own" as the saying goes.
Audrey Turner
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Hi,
just a suggestion but of importance: that the designers of the next Genos think of the blind men ! On the Tyros 5, there were buttons to access the functions but I can not imagine how a blind man can do with a touch screen!
Greetings and a good week end
Seagull29
PS/ and if possible, a REAL STYLE CREATOR !!!!!!
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Hi,
just a suggestion but of importance: that the designers of the next Genos think of the blind men ! On the Tyros 5, there were buttons to access the functions but I can not imagine how a blind man can do with a touch screen!
You need to check out Toril’s posts. She had the same concerns as she has only 5% vision. But after getting a good deal on a Genos, and giving it a try, she loves the touchscreen.
Actual experience is much better than conjecture
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I think this is a bug that Yamaha should fix. This is a problem when activating VH always shuts off the microphone DSP insert.
I have described it in this thread,
https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,52379.0.html (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,52379.0.html)
and I will enclose a video showing it here.
https://youtu.be/wwWbcfvUITA (https://youtu.be/wwWbcfvUITA)
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Hi,
just a suggestion but of importance: that the designers of the next Genos think of the blind men ! ......
The Voice Guide feature for Genos may be for a great help.
Quote from the info:
When Voice Guide is active, the instrument gives audible information on the current display or operation being executed, allowing those who have visual impairments to enjoy playing and using the instrument. The following information can be heard when using the Voice Guide function.
- You can operate the instrument while hearing the information shown in the display.
- You can recognize the display called up, the function being executed, and the parameter value you’ve set.
- You can recognize the preset Voice names, preset Style names, preset Song names, and preset Registration Bank names, etc.
- You can recognize display messages.
- You can recognize the button names on the control panel.
https://europe.yamaha.com/files/download/software/8/1178118/genos_voice_guide_en_tu_b0_text.zip
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The arranger plays mechanical due to pattern based.
I imagine an improvement on this matter. It could be useful to play the style in which, for example, the bass part play, every bar, a little different, with a different pattern in the same tonality/chord. A kind of "round Robin" applied to the pattern and not to a velocity.
bets regards,
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Another improvement could be a sync style/midi/song at our choice.
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How about the euphonium from Montage? It's sweet for New Orleans-style jazz.
-- pj
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Just a month ago, @valimates wanted to have a Tempo Reset function (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,50544.msg394973.html#msg394973). And the SX900 came with that feature. 8)
Some time ago @metcam requested the PORTAMENTO (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,33627.0.html) function. Miracles, Genos has just that function, it's just called MONO LEGATO. There are many examples of this, from the 76-key keyboard (Tyros5), touch screen or Joystick (Genos, SX).
I suggested to Yamaha that the Live Control settings and the specific values of the Live Control parameters be saved in a registration.. Yamaha had to re-write the OS to do that... and that's what they did... and added a touch screen too (which many users wanted) Now it's possible for Yamaha to add new features with the new OS.
I also suggested here on the forum that the Multi Pads be added to the Mixing Console, and include all the parameters that are available for the style Parts and Song Parts. That's coming with the v2.0 update for Genos.
I think the old OS made it impossible for Yamaha to respond to many of our requests.
8)
Joe H
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How about the euphonium from Montage? It's sweet for New Orleans-style jazz. ...
Hi pj,
since a Euphonium is similar to a Baritone Horn:
Did you already try those Voices on Genos, for example "BaritoneHornLong", "BaritoneHorn Ten" (Tenuto) and maybe "BassTromboneTenuto" (all in Brass category) as well as "BaritoneHorn" in the Legacy Brass category?
(There is also a "BassTromboneTenuto" in EnsemblePart Brass category.)
Best regards,
Chris
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Since a Euphonium is similar to a Baritone Horn:
Did you already try those Voices on Genos, for example "BaritoneHornLong", "BaritoneHorn Ten" (Tenuto) and maybe "BassTromboneTenuto" (all in Brass category) as well as "BaritoneHorn" in the Legacy Brass category?
(There is also a "BassTromboneTenuto" in EnsemblePart Brass category.)
Hi Chris --
Yep, I tried those Genos voices. I have the MODX and Genos side-by-side. The Montage/MODX euphonium is pretty darned good! Other Genos players would surely benefit if Yamaha added it to Genos. Shucks, they already have the samples and the voice programming...
BTW, I gig with the MODX. Although it's got the euphonium, the Genos clarinets beat the MODX hands down. You can't always get what you want. :)
All the best -- pj
P.S. More about this at: http://sandsoftwaresound.net/just-like-starting-over/
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MIDI & STYLE play at same time:
Right now we have: MIDI play and style play at same time , MIDI stop style continue play, MIDI start again automaticly style STOP.
We need: MIDI play and style play at same time,MIDI stop style continue play,Midi start again style ""CONTINUE"" play.
Thank you Yamaha.
Song Syncro Start Off/On realy neded for all players who use MIDI songs and style together for play. At this moment on Genos and SX is almost perfect ,just need a little to complete that functions:
MIDI play and style play at same time,MIDI stop style continue play,Midi start again style ""CONTINUE"" play.
Here is video how to use MIDI + style .:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKMvv2Gz6ng&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR2QLA5bxFzJUG5p5LRl_GRA0GXPh8FP5SyMdPuJp6Gd0Ld9s0XCk0of5Zc
Regards
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Arpeggios are rich for EDM music.
I understand there's no meaning for Harmony feature. But I would like the arpeggio feature to be extended for the left voice to become a target for arpeggios (Assign = left).
Soundphase.
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I would like to have 6 or 8 multi pads instead of 4 of them.
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I would like to have 6 or 8 multi pads instead of 4 of them.
This subject has already been discussed here. What I understand is that the keyboard has 16 midis channels (between style tracks, voices, pads, etc) and each pad consumes one channel. 4 Pads = 4 Midi trails.
The solution would be to increase the number of midi channels from 16 to 24. Even this increase in channels would solve other problems with Midi as well.
Enildo
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AWM3 sound engine, with the same kind of algorithm than the one used for new drums on Genos 1, allowing the sound to be slightly different even if velocity and after touch parameters are identical.
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GENOS AUDIO RECORDING MONITOR OPTION
For a same song, when you do several takes of audio recording, it should be fine to have an option to keep the setting of the level of Input Monitor.
At present time, each time to hit REC, you have to set the level of Input monitoring. That is boring and not ergonomic at all.
For people do not wanting that, the option could be unticked.
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I miss the possibility to play the keyboard without unnecessarily tiring my eyes. The instrument should have a so-called Dark Mode, Dark Theme. Possibility of both the screen and the lights on the buttons dimmed out with fine-tuning until completely off. For example, this would allow me to play the piano in a darker room without tiring my eyes with LEDs. Currently I sometimes use a towel placed on the instrument. Of course, this mode should not be saved for the next time you turn it on, so as not to cause confusion.
In addition -
Please dont judge me if this already works, but I would like to know the easiest way to split the upper part as three separate instrument zones - and save it to the registration memory.
In addition, a couple of former wishes - easier integration with MPE midi to plug in direct Seabord Rise49
In addition, the ability to use various vst plugins, such as SWAM cellos and so on
Thank You ..
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If you would like a feature, that a competing Keyboard has (like Korg) I think it's ok to mention it. Especially if you can think of a enhancement to it. This let's let's Yamaha know, that former Korg users, might 'migrate' over to Yamaha.
For instance I had a Korg a while ago, with a decently large screen, and found it much more useful, then Yamaha's buttons. Yamaha needed to 'catch up with the Jones'
Another example is Yamaha's DAW - Cubase (they bought it up a while ago) uses a 'chord' track. Something which Apple in it's ultimate arrogance, refuses to think is helpful.
My wish is that Yamaha does what Apple did with Logic Pro. Make Yamaha arrangers, fit hand in glove with Cubase. AND GIVE GENOS owners a 'cross grade' price to upgrade to top of the Cubase line. That's one reason why Apple customers put up with the higher price. Anything Apple is going to work perfectly with anything else by Apple.
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Please dont judge me if this already works, but I would like to know the easiest way to split the upper part as three separate instrument zones - and save it to the registration memory.
This is done by setting the proper split points (Left, R1+R2, R3). To save in a registration, the Style group must be checked.
Cheers,
Fred
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I would really like to see the ability to edit the drum sounds on the Genos itself. If I'm in a recording session, and I need to tune, shorten the drums, it is much too awkward to pull out a computer, set up and go thru the ritual. Need to edit drums in the Genos.
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I would really like to see the ability to edit the drum sounds on the Genos itself. If I'm in a recording session, and I need to tune, shorten the drums, it is much too awkward to pull out a computer, set up and go thru the ritual. Need to edit drums in the Genos.
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? Have you tried the 'drum setup' feature in the Style Creator?
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hello, for those of us who travel by plane …. beside all of the above.... size matter …. I simply don't understand why we have that extra body (like a handle) on Genos. It could be cut right to the key's on each side. That my friends is a problem for me and others who have to travel by plane. Size and weight is a problem ( I am aware of the light case for Genos)
Someone has mention Korg products (Pa4... etc) for those who can see bigger picture and ideas ...it's like never wanted to try different food or go to school to learn more. I do believe Yamaha is company that wants to be recognized and have markets everywhere, that being said … reality is that it is not always the most practical product to chose. I just had to get that off of my chest. Thank you all and especially metcam [/b]for being the progressive.
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Someone deleted my post about this topic quite some time ago..
But here we go again...
All the features of the modx..which would allow you to create nultiple splits with multiple layers.. with multiple arps and even have FM sounds... and make the bosendorfer a standard sound.. also FM sounds.. basically, this would be the advanced option, normal mode would still be 123R and 1L
Normal key with, still dont get it why Yamaha keys are smaller then all other brands,..
The reface CS synth engine...
The Organ engines of the reface YC and the new YC61
The Piano VCM engine of the CP series
The launchpad feature of Ketron
Onboard sound edditing and creation, also on board package management..
An ipad app, for edditing styles and songs, including piano roll
Other features of the ipad app, host for AUv3 sounds, sheetmusic reader build and much much more,,..
Audio over USB feature
The DAW integration of the Montage..
More onboard memory for samples..
Even more dsp power.. atleast 2 effects/sounds
Improved vocal harmony..
Improved style engine supporting true audio tracks and guitars like ketron does..
Being able to add more then 8+1 tracks to a style
Advanced AI features that make the accompaniments more dynamic..
Being able to convert songs/midi files to styles(korg pa4x)
True orchestral styles.. with multiple violins and cellos’ and such
8 multipads, so you could have 2 banks loaded at the same time
Dsp power (effects) for the multipads
Being able to load and create arps... onboard .. with sepperate arps/track
An orchestral mode... which would work much like the ensembles... (multi division) you would have like 16 violins spreading over the played notes.. and 8 cello’s...
Being able to save OTS as sepperate iitems in a searchable database... so basically you would have all your OTS settings of all your styles archieved in one place... its what korg calls keyboard sets on pa4x
A 12” tiltable screen..
A modulation wheel and a touchstrip next to the joystick..
Being able to connect 2 expression pedals.. and a 3 part piano pedal..
Full onboard support for a lower manual.. including sepperate voices to assign to a lower manual..
Even better would be an optional lower manual and pedals to turn Genos is a true organ..
And the list goes on..
And even tough i truely enjoy my Genos..
There is so much room for improvement..
And yes, i realise yamaha cant implement all these..
But it gives them a list to pick from..
I also think we will not see a Genos before end 2022 maybe even 2023
5 or 6 years between instruments seems to become the standard..
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Just throwing you a crumb, Bachus - if you are missing the mod wheel, the modulation +/- can be assigned to one of the 6 knobs. Not quite the same as a wheel, but a little easier to use than the joystick + hold button.
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No need for a Genos 2, just update what we have. Much better for the environment, - and for the pocket book! :)
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... And the list goes on...
I doubt we will see many (if any) of those upgrades in a Yamaha arranger. What is probably possible with a firmware update is... expanded capabilities with Live Control, expanded options for the foot pedal (live control) more arpeggios and even an arp editor to create your own user arps. Sounds like you should buy a Yamaha synth like the Montage or MODX to go with your Genos.
We have talked about the hypothetical synth-arranger before. I'm satisfied with my FM, AN and VL plug-in synths, Motif Rack XS, Proteus 1000 upgraded to the 2.26 firmware with 16 live arpeggiators with User Arps (and software to edit and create new arps). The Peavey PC1600x hardware MIDI controller with 16 programmable faders is an awesome tool that enhances my sound modules capabilities with remote sysex control.
I've also purchased the Phat Analog, Magic Dance, Analog Xperience and Dreamscapes expansion packs from Easy Sounds. These packs give me some great synth Voices, drum kits, new styles and hundreds of new Multi Pads. Maybe one day I will upgrade to the sx900... that would be the icing on the cake (for me anyway)
;)
Joe H
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I doubt we will see many (if any) of those upgrades in a Yamaha arranger. What is probably possible with a firmware update is... expanded capabilities with Live Control, expanded options for the foot pedal (live control) more arpeggios and even an arp editor to create your own user arps. Sounds like you should buy a Yamaha synth like the Montage or MODX to go with your Genos.
We have talked about the hypothetical synth-arranger before. I'm satisfied with my FM, AN and VL plug-in synths, Motif Rack XS, Proteus 1000 upgraded to the 2.26 firmware with 16 live arpeggiators with User Arps (and software to edit and create new arps). The Peavey PC1600x hardware MIDI controller with 16 programmable faders is an awesome tool that enhances my sound modules capabilities with remote sysex control.
I've also purchased the Phat Analog, Magic Dance, Analog Xperience and Dreamscapes expansion packs from Easy Sounds. These packs give me some great synth Voices, drum kits, new styles and hundreds of new Multi Pads. Maybe one day I will upgrade to the sx900... that would be the icing on the cake (for me anyway)
;)
Joe H
Currently i get all my synth needs from my ipad..
To bad Yamaha does not invest in an app that allows the Genos to integrate with DAW or IPAD..
This could add so much to the Genos..
Where it comes to Genos firmware updates.
I agree with you
- more controlls..also for external instruments
- full access to all msb/lsb banks for external use with synth hardware
- an option to just add ban and program changes (midi out) instead of an internal sound (or both)
- more asignable functions
- more arps, including an editor, or atleast an option to load montage arps
- onboard editor and sound creation tools, access to edit and create sa sounds and open up the indepth features of the AWM2 engine
- savable OTS sets
- better access to dsp management
- making the bosendorfer samples available
- also adding the organs of the YC reface, as they are AWM based(farfisa/church/combo/japanese home, including an interface like the 3 current drawbar instrument)
- an expansion pack with synth sounds
Lots of room for improvements of the current genos firmware..
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My with all this stuff added when do you get time just to sit down and play the instrument and even record a song we can all enjoy.
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My with all this stuff added when do you get time just to sit down and play the instrument and even record a song we can all enjoy.
We all use our keyboard in a different way. I play all the time, but it's my original music. I don't play other peoples' music. I like lots of different sounds and the added expressiveness of being able to manipulate the sounds as well. It's a matter of whatever brings us pleasure.
"To each his own"
:)
Joe H
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My with all this stuff added when do you get time just to sit down and play the instrument and even record a song we can all enjoy.
Probably never..
I play only with my headset on..
For my own enjoyment, and stress relieve..
As soon as i need to play for others (which i tried many time sin the past)
I get extremely nervous..
So i decided its not worth the fuzz and a nervbreak to play for others or record myself
I play music as a stressreleive from the office, and not as something that causes me stress
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... full access to all msb/lsb banks for external use with synth hardware...
Yes, currently Yamaha arrangers only support the MSB/LSB used by the keyboard... including the MSB 063 for expansion Voices.
I bought a midi solutions "Event Processor" which allows you to remap the MSB to different MSB. I did this for my Analog plug-in card which uses the MSB 036. I created a "dummy pack" for 2 AN card Voice Banks. When I select the (dummy pack) Voices from my S970, the keyboard transmits MSB 063 and the Event Processor changes that to 036. It works great. I haven't tried it yet, but if you choose LSB for your dummy pack different than your regular expansion packs , then I think it is possible to remap both the MSB and LSB to match any external instrument. You can program the Event Processor to remap up to 16 MIDI messages for different external instruments. The programming is done in the Rich Text Format (RTF).
Event Processor for 16 MIDI events
http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm (http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm)
There is also the Event Processor Plus - processes 32 differnt MIDI events
http://www.midisolutions.com/prodepp.htm (http://www.midisolutions.com/prodepp.htm)
Joe H
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Yes, currently Yamaha arrangers only support the MSB/LSB used by the keyboard... including the MSB 063 for expansion Voices.
I bought a midi solutions "Event Processor" which allows you to remap the MSB to different MSB. I did this for my Analog plug-in card which uses the MSB 036. I created a "dummy pack" for 2 AN card Voice Banks. When I select the (dummy pack) Voices from my S970, the keyboard transmits MSB 063 and the Event Processor changes that to 036. It works great. I haven't tried it yet, but if you choose LSB for your dummy pack different than your regular expansion packs , then I think it is possible to remap both the MSB and LSB to match any external instrument. You can program the Event Processor to remap up to 16 MIDI messages for different external instruments. The programming is done in the Rich Text Format (RTF).
Event Processor for 16 MIDI events
http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm (http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm)
There is also the Event Processor Plus - processes 32 differnt MIDI events
http://www.midisolutions.com/prodepp.htm (http://www.midisolutions.com/prodepp.htm)
Joe H
Thanks, good tip looks like a usefull workaround..
On the ipad i am using camelot pro as a work around...
It works kind of like a middleman..
On the mac, mainstage kind of solved this for me..
But it would be nice if yamaha started opening up Genos a little more..
Its still build very much build around the stand alone mentality..
It misses quite a lot of things to be considered a true master controller.
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... It misses quite a lot of things to be considered a true master controller.
I agree completely. The Genos has great potential to be a master controller keyboard. Yamaha just has to take the next step. Slowly the buyers of arranger keyboards are changing and demanding more capabilities and features. When there is enough of us... Yamaha will respond to the market.
Joe H
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I agree completely. The Genos has great potential to be a master controller keyboard. Yamaha just has to take the next step. Slowly the buyers of arranger keyboards are changing and demanding more capabilities and features. When there is enough of us... Yamaha will respond to the market.
Joe H
Actually they have moving in that direction..
But sadly with the speed of an old snail..
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;D :)
Joe H
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Yamaha Genos V2.0.1 Bugs & Problems And some shortcomings
1. If you drop all the sliders down and restart the button you will see that all the parameters will be 100 except for Song A.
2. If you put two or three Insert effects in one voice and change a parameter to all effects and save it to the registration memory, you will see that it will save only the parameters from the last effect you have selected will reset to default Mode. That is, 40 as it originally was. This problem is valid from version 1.40 onwards. That is, the sound I saved before version 1.40 Everything works fine.
3. Does not store sounds in OTS with two or three Insert effects. That is, do I have to select a sound that does not have more than one effect to put it in OTS? I don't think that makes sense.
4. Drum Setup at Style Creator No more than 70 Drum Kits from Expansion. And what he brings out is in order. I have my own packages, I have purchased packages, and I have a lot of REX Files and I can't use them in Drum Setup. and it would be a good idea to put together a list search like the previous models. Imagine turning the washer until you find what you want.
5. I would like to create a style and use a mega voice bass to be able to write on a channel and Play and Slide Gliss And Noise which is in the upper octave after the C6 note. That is to say, if I write on one channel all that changing chord will change the top notes C6 And up While this should be a fix. As in the factory. The factory rhythms are so written while not allowing us to do so why?
6. We'd like to add us to Style Creator Different Signatures in any Variations. Or at least in Fills We can write at least 2 Measure.
7. To the style creator In the Assembly option We can copy Rhythm1-2 paste to any other bank of the same type and upside down.
8. Please add CASM Editor to Style Creator. Why not have the option of writing as factory rates are written?
9. The MP3 player from the first version to this day has problems. Example if I have say 100 songs in the stick from the 100 to 70 and they will appear in the Playlist And from those 70 again it will bug me in some songs.
10. We would like to add the Link Volume Level feature to the mixer. This would help us to mix the rhythms and songs quickly and correctly. That is, they happen to give me a rhythm that is written much louder than the factory rhythm; this would help to lower the sound quickly and efficiently.
11. In Scale Tune we would like Cent to go + -99. So that we can make sounds like Terca, for example. As it is now + -64 Except for the Arabic ladder it doesn't help us in anything.
12. Add to the MultiPad Creator, the Quantize option. As it would be great for Style Creator to add the export To MultiPad option to one of the channels.
13. We can set the Volume on each Pad separately in MultiPads. As is the case with Audio Link MultiPad. In MultiPads Change EQ parameters. The Insert effects feature. And the option in the settings can work as a start stop on the Pads. That is, the first push plays the Pad, the second push stops the Pad.
14. We'd like to voice in Legato Portamento in Poly Mode. This helps in the Reality of the violin. As an example of Oriental Strings.
And Fix Portamento Time In Crossfade Mode. That is when you have Portamento Time Indicator 0 There is a great Timing Between the two notes, While it should normally pass faster and sharply.
15. Make editing option among Insert effects. That is, if I have put in two or three effects in a sound and want to change parameters in one of the effects, I first have to close the effect and reopen it so that I can select it. Otherwise I can only tease out the last effect I have added to Echo. In a nutshell if I want to go back to the first effect I've added and edit a parameter I need to get Mixer, effects, Assign Part Settings, find the effect I want to edit, close it and reopen it so I can tease after the parameters)))
16. Add the option when in home mode We can set the washer where we want it. Example BPM tempo shift. Why do I press the tempo button first and then turn the washer?
Yamaha Expansion Manager
17. Add Element Copy Paste From Another Voice. That is, I have a sound ready and I want to get an Element And put it in another sound that I make to not load the samples again An One.
18. Why can't I edit Rom Sounds? Example to Change Note Range Ή to Change Velocity Range? That I could tease up to PSR 9000, Tyros1-2-4 Here's why I can't do these things?
19. And I would add Sample Edit, Loop Edit. Just examples I have some sounds that have not been set Right or Loops, How can I fix if I don't have the original samples In SF2 format or Wave, AIFF?))) In Motif and Montage Again there is good John Melas. Who will help us here?)))
Let's add at least export In SF2 format So we can do something.
20. I would like to add the Note Relase feature. That is, letting the note reproduce the sound. This exists in factory sounds because it doesn't exist in users?
21. We want to define the Elements The Art 1-2-3 buttons. Why Do I Have Three Useless Buttons When Using User Sounds?
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Yamaha Genos V2.0.1 Bugs & Problems And some shortcomings
1. If you drop all the sliders down and restart the button you will see that all the parameters will be 100 except for Song A.
2. If you put two or three Insert effects in one voice and change a parameter to all effects and save it to the registration memory, you will see that it will save only the parameters from the last effect you have selected will reset to default Mode. That is, 40 as it originally was. This problem is valid from version 1.40 onwards. That is, the sound I saved before version 1.40 Everything works fine.
3. Does not store sounds in OTS with two or three Insert effects. That is, do I have to select a sound that does not have more than one effect to put it in OTS? I don't think that makes sense.
4. Drum Setup at Style Creator No more than 70 Drum Kits from Expansion. And what he brings out is in order. I have my own packages, I have purchased packages, and I have a lot of REX Files and I can't use them in Drum Setup. and it would be a good idea to put together a list search like the previous models. Imagine turning the washer until you find what you want.
5. I would like to create a style and use a mega voice bass to be able to write on a channel and Play and Slide Gliss And Noise which is in the upper octave after the C6 note. That is to say, if I write on one channel all that changing chord will change the top notes C6 And up While this should be a fix. As in the factory. The factory rhythms are so written while not allowing us to do so why?
6. We'd like to add us to Style Creator Different Signatures in any Variations. Or at least in Fills We can write at least 2 Measure.
7. To the style creator In the Assembly option We can copy Rhythm1-2 paste to any other bank of the same type and upside down.
8. Please add CASM Editor to Style Creator. Why not have the option of writing as factory rates are written?
9. The MP3 player from the first version to this day has problems. Example if I have say 100 songs in the stick from the 100 to 70 and they will appear in the Playlist And from those 70 again it will bug me in some songs.
10. We would like to add the Link Volume Level feature to the mixer. This would help us to mix the rhythms and songs quickly and correctly. That is, they happen to give me a rhythm that is written much louder than the factory rhythm; this would help to lower the sound quickly and efficiently.
11. In Scale Tune we would like Cent to go + -99. So that we can make sounds like Terca, for example. As it is now + -64 Except for the Arabic ladder it doesn't help us in anything.
12. Add to the MultiPad Creator, the Quantize option. As it would be great for Style Creator to add the export To MultiPad option to one of the channels.
13. We can set the Volume on each Pad separately in MultiPads. As is the case with Audio Link MultiPad. In MultiPads Change EQ parameters. The Insert effects feature. And the option in the settings can work as a start stop on the Pads. That is, the first push plays the Pad, the second push stops the Pad.
14. We'd like to voice in Legato Portamento in Poly Mode. This helps in the Reality of the violin. As an example of Oriental Strings.
And Fix Portamento Time In Crossfade Mode. That is when you have Portamento Time Indicator 0 There is a great Timing Between the two notes, While it should normally pass faster and sharply.
15. Make editing option among Insert effects. That is, if I have put in two or three effects in a sound and want to change parameters in one of the effects, I first have to close the effect and reopen it so that I can select it. Otherwise I can only tease out the last effect I have added to Echo. In a nutshell if I want to go back to the first effect I've added and edit a parameter I need to get Mixer, effects, Assign Part Settings, find the effect I want to edit, close it and reopen it so I can tease after the parameters)))
16. Add the option when in home mode We can set the washer where we want it. Example BPM tempo shift. Why do I press the tempo button first and then turn the washer?
Yamaha Expansion Manager
17. Add Element Copy Paste From Another Voice. That is, I have a sound ready and I want to get an Element And put it in another sound that I make to not load the samples again An One.
18. Why can't I edit Rom Sounds? Example to Change Note Range Ή to Change Velocity Range? That I could tease up to PSR 9000, Tyros1-2-4 Here's why I can't do these things?
19. And I would add Sample Edit, Loop Edit. Just examples I have some sounds that have not been set Right or Loops, How can I fix if I don't have the original samples In SF2 format or Wave, AIFF?))) In Motif and Montage Again there is good John Melas. Who will help us here?)))
Let's add at least export In SF2 format So we can do something.
20. I would like to add the Note Relase feature. That is, letting the note reproduce the sound. This exists in factory sounds because it doesn't exist in users?
21. We want to define the Elements The Art 1-2-3 buttons. Why Do I Have Three Useless Buttons When Using User Sounds?
May i ask, whats the reason you want to keep Yem? And not put all those features inside the Genos?
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May i ask, whats the reason you want to keep Yem? And not put all those features inside the Genos?
There is no reason. The only reason they can leave YEM simply as an additional program to create sounds without Genos itself. Using any MIDI keyboard. What I wrote can be added and corrected with one version update.
If you notice there are several errors that are present in version 1.40
I wrote to them several times but they never
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One of the things I would really like is a well written manual. All to often I have to revert to forums and youtube. That wouldn't necessarily stop other people writing books :)
Just my 2 pence worth
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Hello all Genosphils,
My Genos is my first arranger keyboard.
So , I was wondering if each Genos owner was ready, probably in 2021, to buy a Genos2 keyboard and to shell out 4000 or 4500 bucks ?
I hope we can also consider an update, to move to software version 3.0 ? Many features requests can be implemented in the present Genos, but some requests need to redesign the user interface keyboard, adding here some new switches, or reducing the size of the keyboard, etc...
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No, I have had my Genos in just 4 months, so I can't see myself buying another one in a year! Instead I have kept my Tyros5, and I have an S975 too. If I buy a new keyboard now, it will be another PSR. Am tempted to get the XS900, but I have just two hands anyway, so I have to be satisfied with what I have now :)
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Hello all Genosphils,
My Genos is my first arranger keyboard.
So , I was wondering if each Genos owner was ready, probably in 2021, to buy a Genos2 keyboard and to shell out 4000 or 4500 bucks ?
I hope we can also consider an update, to move to software version 3.0 ? Many features requests can be implemented in the present Genos, but some requests need to redesign the user interface keyboard, adding here some new switches, or reducing the size of the keyboard, etc...
Once you have a Genos, you will learn that a Genos 2 will cost you like half
Because of good trade in prices..
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Once you have a Genos, you will learn that a Genos 2 will cost you like half
Because of good trade in prices..
Not so sure to get a new Genos 2 in 2021 at 2500$ or 3000$ ! Yamaha will need to consider this fact.
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I agree with Bacchus. It will be easy to sell our Genos at a good price when Genos 2 will appear. If a Genos 2 is 4200 and you sell Genos at 2400, your Genos 2 will cost you 1800... for around 4 years so, 37.5 by month, 1.25 by day...
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Hi
I´m new in this forum but a long time yamaha user.
There´s a feature that I always wanted in this kind of keyboard and never saw.
The style creator is a good tool for expand your presetations,but it could more automated and fast:
1) it can have a RANDOM button that takes parts of other styles and mount them in the one you are working. Maybe you could put some parameters , like choosing 5/10/20 styles from where the AI will pick the parts. Even from style in the USB drive.
2) I can see many parameters that you can program the AI to choose the parts.
3) The AI algorhytms like K.A.R.M.A software that it´s uses in some high end yamaha keyboard could be used to create new styles. Once you like, after testing it, you save and uses in your presentation.
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My experience in building styles is to use Style Creator Assembly. I have to try different style Parts to hear how they will blend with the other style Parts and often changing the Voices and other parameters of the mix. Software with a RANDOM feature is highly unlikely to produce good final results. Dumb software will never achieve the creativity of the human mind or spirit. You would still have to do a lot of MAJOR editing of the style to get it to sound good.
The best you can hope for is the Style Factory software which has a built-in data base of thousands style Parts and you can add you own, and still requires the process of editing for good final results.
http://www.emc-musicsoftware.de/eng-shop/eng-dscstf.htm#Top (http://www.emc-musicsoftware.de/eng-shop/eng-dscstf.htm#Top)
Joe H
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Genos2 Wish List.
I am a novis player with a Genos having owned a Tyros 5. Please, Please bring back the tilting screen!
If it’s not reflecting the ceiling light it reflects daylight coming through the window. No problem for a Tyros 5 as you just angled the screen, no problem.
Regards Mike (Sheffield)
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Amen to that, Mike! The screen of the Genos is actually tilting a little towards the player, but not enough. I want bigger fonts on style names as well!
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Since I'm on the market for "Genos 2" and I'm sure that even a "Genos 2" without all the suggested additions will be a huge update from my current set up, to be honest I don't have something to ask for.
The only one I have to ask is to get it in the market ASAP !!!
But it looks that after the COVID-19 shutdown even the most optimistic expectations for a release on Nov-Dec 2020 are now impossible to hit...
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Since I'm on the market for "Genos 2" and I'm sure that even a "Genos 2" without all the suggested additions will be a huge update from my current set up, to be honest I don't have something to ask for.
The only one I have to ask is to get it in the market ASAP !!!
But it looks that after the COVID-19 shutdown even the most optimistic expectations for a release on Nov-Dec 2020 are now impossible to hit...
Here's my prognostication. There won't be a Genos 2 before 2022.
Cheers,
Fred
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Here's my prognostication. There won't be a Genos 2 before 2022.
Cheers,
Fred
+1 l think the fact Yamaha released the new version 2 update hints it will be a while before they're ready to release a new model. l think the hit everyone is taking financially due to Covid will have a big bearing on a future release too.
Kind regards,
Russ
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I wonder where (the shareholders of) Yamaha should make their money from?
Yamaha will not get rich from an free update / upgrade.
Marketing-wise I guess that about autumn of this year Yamaha will have to announce something new (on their usual mystic way ;)) to put a new line on the market in spring 2021. The Yamaha Music division must generate income in order to survive. For sure, starting at 2017, The Genos (1) has had its longest time now . ;)
Besides: it is not that difficult (it is not a Spacex ;)). Many forummers have already indicated what can be improved about the current Genos. Technically not that complicated to upgrade the firmware/software. Just rearrange some buttons, put a larger tiltable display on it and there is the Genos 2. Done ;D ...
(I will wait for the PSR-SX1000 end 2021)
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The prices will go up. How many of us will afford a Genos 2?.
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Worldwide: lets say10.000 x 7000 = $70.000.000,- , not bad at all ;)
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I would like to see in the new Genos a piano roll editor in Song Creator and Style Creator mode, this would be very useful.
It would also be good to have the possibility of direct sampling with all its editing parameters, without the need to resort to external software.
And last but not least. Include the possibility of a 16-track Audio sequencer with all waveform editing parameters included.
Regards. Hans
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I would like to see in the new Genos a piano roll editor in Song Creator and Style Creator mode, this would be very useful.
It would also be good to have the possibility of direct sampling with all its editing parameters, without the need to resort to external software.
And last but not least. Include the possibility of a 16-track Audio sequencer with all waveform editing parameters included.
Regards. Hans
It sounds like you looking for a hardware DAW. Maybe one day we will see that offered. I think as more people are using DAWs, they would like to see all those features on-board in a keyboard. Many of those features are available in synth keyboards already, but I suspect it be awhile before we see them ported over to the arranger keyboard
;)
Joe H
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I don't think we will see Genos 2 for some time.
I think that most people that buy these keyboards just want to play them as they are, as for live playing they have everything you would want. During the Corvid lock down we have seen so many lovely concerts given on Genos which has proved to many just how good this keyboard is without any additions.
I personally would hate to see DAW''s being added and would not want to pay the extra price involved
for a lot of fancy things being added that a lot would never use. In fact I don't think a lot of people use what is on the present Genos.
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EileenL,
Hopefully, if a hardware DAW is released it will be a separate model from Genos. I agree that the arranger as it is now is quite adequate in its features. We have plenty of computer software thanks to the programmers here to do major editing of our files on a big monitor screen.
Joe H
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Hi everybody,
Hope you are all well in these tricky times.
Personally I'm enjoying the extra time to play and musically explore. My thoughts though go out to anybody who has been impacted by the virus.
It's true that we may not see a new Genos for a while and while we wait we should all enjoy playing the instruments we have now.
Having said that.... the lockdown has given me time to put together my thoughts and suggestions on the next Genos!
My guess is that any Genos 2 changes will be incremental rather than ground breaking but these changes do add up over time and can make quite a difference in the long run. In addition, new features may be introduced either from Yamaha’s own creations or in response to other manufacturers developments.
Here's my input for what its worth
Sounds
Always the most important factor. Genos was major step up in sound quality from the Tyros 5 and as technology improves, I expect even richer, fuller sounds with even more DSP power.
Operations
• 12” tiltable High Definition screen
• More onboard memory
Resources
These are available from online or expansion packs but I would expect any new Genos to include extra resources as well.
Styles
Guess another 50 styles based on previous upgrades
Voices
The PRS970>Tyros>Genos upgrades introduced a c30% increase in voices so maybe a 20% increase this time to 2000 voices. For comparison the Korg PA4X has 1900.
Multi Pads
• 6 Multi Pads
• Each pad to have on/off “one press” capability (rather than two presses or work arounds)
Playlist
• Larger playlist say 2700 songs
New Functions
• Ability to convert midi files to styles
The Korg PA4X has this and it looks easy to use.
Results probably vary depending on the quality of the midi file but it would be an amazing feature to introduce on a new Genos.
• Onboard sound editing, as with the montage/modx.
The ability to use layered sounds to create a voice via the Genos rather than offline especially appeals to me.
• Single menu option to change overall sound mode.
There are different demands for live playing and recording so the ability to change the overall sound might be good.E.g. For live playing (punchier) or studio recording (cleaner). Genos can obviously change sounds via Master EQ and Compression but a single menu option to do this would be interesting.
Construction
• New sleek black metallic look. I liked the Tyros 5 ‘metallic’ look and feel a similar look in black would enhance the Genos appearance.
• Non fade operating buttons. Some players are having button fade issues so maybe have new buttons with printing on the inside rather like the Tyros 5 glass type buttons.
That's it!
Hope it adds to the topic.
Kelvin
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Song Syncro Start Off/On realy neded for all players who use MIDI songs and style together for play. At this moment on Genos and SX is almost perfect ,just need a little to complete that functions:
MIDI play and style play at same time,MIDI stop style continue play,Midi start again style ""CONTINUE"" play.
Here is video how to use MIDI + style .:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKMvv2Gz6ng&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR2QLA5bxFzJUG5p5LRl_GRA0GXPh8FP5SyMdPuJp6Gd0Ld9s0XCk0of5Zc
Regards
Also Is going to be very useful :MIDI DRUM EDITOR so we have same as on style drum editor.
Regards
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My wish is a simple one and that is that Yamaha completely do a new set of styles for every genre. I know it is painstaking work but on each successive model the styles are basically the same with tweaks and the odd new ones which I'm sure folks like me eagerly await. This is Yamaha's strong point their styles are so good but if you go back even as far as the PSR3000 the styles are all still the same...obviously there have been additions but what I'm trying to say is re write the whole lot! Technology keeps improving, Revo drums, fantastic strings , voices etc but a whole new style set would again put Yamaha way out in front.
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Yes I do agree with having fresh styles but you then will always have people saying "Where are my Favorite ones" so I think a healthy mix would be better for some. It would be great if we could purchase a keyboard that had all the style spaces empty and we could build up our own set of on board ones though.
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It would be great if we could purchase a keyboard that had all the style spaces empty and we could build up our own set of on board ones though.
Isn't that what the User drive is for though? :)
I'm not sure that new AWM voices are needed. I mean how many accordions can one man actually use. I'm much prefer to see the FM-X engine from MODX brought in, even in a cut down version.
And l do think it was a mistake to lose the tilting screen, though I guess it kept the cost lower. Fewer moving parts.
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... I'm much prefer to see the FM-X engine from MODX brought in, even in a cut down version...
Actually, an analog synth engine would be better than the FM. I have both a FM and Analog plug-in card in my MU128. The analog is so much better sounding (warm) over the tinny, flat sounding sounding FM. The only thing I like about the FM is the EPs and bell sounds, which is what FM is famous for.
I believe the PSR 9000 Pro had room for 1 plug-in card. Maybe that's the way to go, or even offer soft synth versions we can buy. I would buy the 3 synth engines I have in my MU128... the VL, FM and Analog. And add a Breath Controller jack so we could play those Virtual Acoustic saxes, flutes and other wind instruments with the correct articulations only accomplished using a Breath Controller.
Joe H
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Eileen, that is a great idea! To be able to delete onboard styles that we never use and put in new ones!
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Eileen, that is a great idea! To be able to delete onboard styles that we never use and put in new ones!
Won’t ever happen.
User memory is where user styles go.
Cheers,
Fred
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I know that Fred😀 But it would be great.
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In fact Yamaha talked about this at one time. All the slots on categories would be empty and you would be given the styles to load in as you wanted them. If you did not ever use certain styles then you would just wait until other styles came along that you did use. These could be locked into the presets like you can do on Korg. With those keyboards you could tweak up the preset ones and then save them back into preset.
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Eileen, that is a great idea! To be able to delete onboard styles that we never use and put in new ones!
But we can do that allredy, in a way. Styles does not take up much space, and can be left ignored if you don`t use them, then you can put inn new style in user at your leisure. And more, if we decides to sell, the original styles should be intact.
Just my two cents ;D
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But we can do that allredy, in a way. Styles does not take up much space, and can be left ignored if you don`t use them, then you can put inn new style in user at your leisure. And more, if we decides to sell, the original styles should be intact.
Just my two cents ;D
We all know that we can put styles in the User drive (and they'd be in alphabetical order!). The discussion is changing the preset styles.
Actually, I'd be happy if preset styles were in alphabetical order, which is something we know Yamaha could do. Would make them much easier to find.
Cheers.
Fred
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SONG POSITIONS BOOTONS:
Since Yamaha rise song to 3MB now we need more "SONG POSITIONS markers"
It would be nice if Yamaha make in GENOS2 a minimum 8 or even better 12 of SONG POSITIONS markers:
Something like this:
SONG POSITIONS BOOTONS: possibility to call positions trough registrations will be very useful in next update.
regards
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SONG POSITIONS BOOTONS: possibility to call positions trough registrations will be very useful in next update.
regards
PART (VOICE/DRUM KIT) and VOLUME change for each MIDI Chanel possibility to memorize (REGISTRATIONS MEMORY) and call when need. Same as style parts! This will be a very helpful!
Thank you Yamaha
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Hello,
something else to add to the list:
it would be easier if one could too
operate the midi-player via the physical buttons
at the kbd. while working in the section "Midi Multi Recording".
Eg. : when you want to insert a different drum kit into a midi
and you can listen to the many options while playing the midi
(via mixing) one has to switch back each time at the end of the midi
to the start screen to play the midi again.
The same when you want to pause eg. during tracking on
the score screen, ....
Another:
the "Song Position markers" to be set in a midi file
in Tyros are operated by means of physical buttons on the kbd.
Very useful for learning difficult passages
via the midi score screen.
These buttons are no longer present in Genos.
However, the "markers" can be controlled via the "Song" screen,
but then one has to switch between "song" and "score" screen each time.
Not convenient.
Either back fitted with physical buttons,
or provide this "Markers" function in the "score" screen.
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Style Creator has Drum Setup, is excellently made and easy to handle.
The same should be done to edit the SONG.
Now we can only do this with the help of XGWorks and computers. :(
https://youtu.be/dmNPgXeirVA?t=27 (https://youtu.be/dmNPgXeirVA?t=27)
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Style Creator has Drum Edit, is excellently made and easy to handle.
...
https://youtu.be/dmNPgXeirVA?t=27 (https://youtu.be/dmNPgXeirVA?t=27)
Yes @ckobu, indeed, but there are some problems with Drum Setup,
- not every time will be saved in registrations (or it could be registrations bug)
- limitation about how many Drum Kits will be visible in Drum Setup. (I really don't understand why this limitation)
- sometime it crashes with a code for developers
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That's right, I noticed the mistakes you mention and I hope so that the Yamaha team will correct them.
When I praised Drum Setup, I was thinking of the concept of how it was done.
Especially since until PSR S770 / 970 this did not exist at all. The top model Tyros5 does not have it. :(
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I think it's time for a FIFTH main button to the keyboard. So many times I could use a fifth main for improving my arrangements. I know I could expand by using a registration and have on a few songs.
And perhaps with my next purchase when I have to go to using Registrations instead of the Music Finder this issue won't matter.
And I will be purchasing the the lighter SX series rather than a Genos.
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Redesign the playlist feature so it will list ALL SINGLE registration songs separately of all folders, Styles, Mp3's, Smf, etc,
all in a single alphabetical list to scroll thru ...
Add a 2" Larger all around TILT UP Display touch screen
ReDesign the overall size of the unit to make it a slimmer and smaller footprint.
REPLACE the VH2 vocal harmonizer and incorporate the TC Helicon VH in Genos..
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REPLACE the VH2 vocal harmonizer and incorporate the TC Helicon VH in Genos..
And Yamaha can increase the price for that GEM addition. ;)
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Yes, I would agree with the suggestion to drop the size and slim-up the Genos. As a senior, who totes his own gear, the size and weight of the Genos is what held me back. That’s why I opted for the SX 900.
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Redesign the playlist feature so it will list ALL SINGLE registration songs separately of all folders, Styles, Mp3's, Smf, etc,
all in a single alphabetical list to scroll thru ...
Playlist is good as it is right now. What is wrong now? Playlist is a shortcut to registration bank, which allows you to activate quickly and to auto-load some of screens, like Lyrics, Score, Text. It is the best way as it is right now. If you compare it with Korg's SongBook, these two are quite similar, making an analogy, SongBook store A REGISTRATION, Playlist store a Registration Bank. So it is powerful than Songbook!
Add a 2" Larger all around TILT UP Display touch screen
I agree (but only with tilt, Larger = is enough. Let's not make from our keyboards some television)!
ReDesign the overall size of the unit to make it a slimmer and smaller footprint.
That's why Yamaha built SX900/700, to have approximately the same functions as Genos, but to be smaller. For me, it's enough. (For Yamaha, too :) )
REPLACE the VH2 vocal harmonizer and incorporate the TC Helicon VH in Genos..
You will never see that, because Korg use TC Helicon. You will never see the same harmonizer on two brands. There are some contracts/agreements made, so ... :)
Regards,
Vali
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And Yamaha can increase the price for that GEM addition. ;)
Drake the vocal tracking and directional dropouts on the VH2 is horrendous compared to Tc helicon.
If Yamaha cared about vocals they could improve is drastically for pro singers. This is why so many use an external TC VH unit with their Yamaha arrangers. Take Care
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Drake the vocal tracking and directional dropouts on the VH2 is horrendous compared to TC Helicon.
If Yamaha cared about vocals they could improve is drastically for pro singers. This is why so many use an external TC VH unit with their Yamaha arrangers. Take Care
I didn't know this about the VH2 in the Genos. Of course, I have never used the built-in VH2 once.
I've owned the Voicelive Rack since 2012 and haven't really used it probably as much as I should. ;)
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I want a 61 note, in silver😀
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Hi all,
Here is another feature that could be easily implemented in the next software update : Direct access to the end of the list.
In the Genos Style Creator/Edit List, when we have to edit an element at the end of the list ,we have to scoll the whole list to access it.
So, It would be smart to add an icon- for example a vertical arrow - to access directly the bottom of the list.
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... To bad Yamaha does not invest in an app that allows the Genos to integrate with DAW...
This could add so much to the Genos..
Lots of room for improvements of the current genos firmware..
The improvements I give priority to :
- more controls... for external instruments
- more assignable functions
- more arps, including an editor, or at least an option to load montage arps
- savable OTS sets
- better access to dsp management
- an expansion pack with synth sounds
BTW... the Easy Sounds Analog Xperience expansion pack has some very good synth sounds, you should check it out.
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I agree with you Toril S. Silver and 61 keys on the Genos 2, and I will buy it...
Take care from Jan - Eve.
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BTW... the Easy Sounds Analog Xperience expansion pack has some very good synth sounds, you should check it out.
Agree Joe - I have this one and am very fond of it
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I apologise if this has already been mentioned, but as a totally blind player of Genos, I would like the voice controls to be completely accessible, not only half way there. I would like to hear everything that appears on the display spoken out to me, not just some of the things. This makes the Genos difficult for me to use at the moment.
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Hi
I would like to see a 12 inch screen that can pop up and proper score reading which you can import instead of bouncing balls. :)
Better DSP management like Joe states and all his other likes
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The improvements I give priority to :
- more controls... for external instruments
- more assignable functions
- more arps, including an editor, or at least an option to load montage arps
- savable OTS sets
- better access to dsp management
- an expansion pack with synth sounds
BTW... the Easy Sounds Analog Xperience expansion pack has some very good synth sounds, you should check it out.
Hi Joe
If you have a computer invest in Sample robot. Sky is the limit for synth sounds as you can sample any vst.
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I want a 61 note, in silver😀
Toril has acid fingers!!
I like black shiny things!!!! ;D
John likes sparkles!! :)
All the best
John
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I am really an alian, hence the acid fingers😀😀😀
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I don't know if it is already said, but I would like to have more channels for style creation (16 channels will be nice) and more insertion effects dedicated for styles. Now with midi 2.0 I think this could be possible. Creation of custom drums with Round-robin feature (just like Revo drums) is another thing I really wish. Custom art2 voices would be great too.
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and more insertion effects dedicated for styles.
You know that Genos has 8 DSP available for the style - one for each channel? A big improvement from T5 which had 3 DSP for the style.
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I would like the ability to set pitch up and down values independent of each other. Example pitch up 2, pitch down 8..
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Select ALL in Stepedit
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The file system meeds some improvement. I want folders to be highlighted, and better contrasts on the screen would be nice.
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I just got a new Genos, so I would like to comment on the next following model -
The direct access button sits in the total wrong place on the Genos. Right next to the stop button on the main button bar. I constantly stumble upon it (besides, it's dark in color) and then there's another question mark dialog window as well. It could be next to the window, on the left or right, but not next to the stop button in the main button bar.
What I liked is that the brightness of the screen and buttons can be somewhat reduced. There is also a screen lock, which, for example, simply darkens the general light background when I playing just the piano. However, the little buttonscreen and six bright white buttons will remain lit. After all, a software change would allow the lights to dimmer less or up to make a complete blackout until the timer or user turns the keyboard off,
The main screen is very colorful and bright for my eyes. It might be possible to set it to less bright, black and white if desired. to be more comfortable in a dark room. I using some other menus, like mixer etc, screen pictures are just little darker. (What is also good – dark menu – not in my s750.)
Well, before the keyboard arriving was I a little scared how I can adapt to the new keybed and the new "Windows", but just a few days after arrival I find that I adapted very quickly and this instrument is the best for me. I especially like these pianos and electric pianos.
Keybed seems best for me. The following models should definitely be no shorter than 76 keys. However, why not also a superarranger with 88 keys.
Genos and controller Roli Rise49 are currently working together through a computer. The next Genos model could include better compatibility and interoperability for Roli, why not some pre-configured user programs, etc.
Maybe I'm also a little sorry that I was able to buy Genos just now and not years ago. I had electricity at home all these years :-)
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I want them to put the Real Time Parts on their on 16 midi channels and let you choose 16 sounds freely assignable to Upper, Lower, Bass and Solo. So 48 midi channels instead of 32.
There should be some bass sounds specifically suited for bass pedal playing.
A 3 part, Upper, Lower, Bass, modulated Organ with it's own polyphony. At the same level as VB3_II is good enough, with chorus/vibrato, key click etc, and a rotary similar to Ventilator. While they at it they should also modulate pipe organ flute (similar to whats in the Roland Atelier) sound and Wersi sound.
They should decrease the hight somewhat to the keys and make a separate midi keyboard, to sell as addon as lower keyboard, that gives the same distanse (in height) between upper and lower keys as their Electones.
Add the FM from Montage with it's own polyphony.
Change the 128+128 stereo poly to 256 stereo poly.
Add USB audio.
A button to turn of accompaniment just keeping the drums go.
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... A button to turn of accompaniment just keeping the drums go.
Hi Togge,
you can already do this: Simply toggle the ACMP button off and on again so that only the drums play. When you play the next chord with the left hand, you will have full accompaniment again.
Best regards,
Chris
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the following are essential to use the Genos 2 as a real arranger keyboard stand-alone and with option to mix and master audio tracks in a software sequencer
* 24bit USB audio interface at least for stereo, ideally for all 16 stereo song channels; have to add audio interface currently since SPDIF and internal export format are only 16bit
* proper song editor with remove events, copy bars (within a track and between tracks), and delete bars; currently need to select events in step edit mode which is ridiculous since the style editor has some of these features; none of this would break backwards compatibility with older keyboards
* proper master compressor / limiter /gate that can replace external hardware like (see Behringer Composer Pro-XL MDX2600); also ideally a second single channel side chain compressor for bass vs. kick drum
* save drum setups in style editor so that they can re reused in songs; or offer drum setup editor in song mode as well; you can copy the events from style to songs via XGWorks so it is technically doable but way to complicated as a workaround
* use physical play, pause buttons etc. in song edit mode so that you can work in the mixer etc.
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Hi Togge,
you can already do this: Simply toggle the ACMP button off and on again so that only the drums play. When you play the next chord with the left hand, you will have full accompaniment again.
Best regards,
Chris
That is not correct. The accompaniment should be off untill it's manually turned on again.
There are complaints on Youtube that Yamaha doesn't have this basic and very important arranger featrure.
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Sync stop and sync start will do that. In fingered mode you can also press 3 adjacant keys to stop.
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That is not correct. The accompaniment should be off untill it's manually turned on again.
There are complaints on Youtube that Yamaha doesn't have this basic and very important arranger featrure.
Those who complain that it doesn’t exist know Yamaha badly. And maybe they favor Ketron. ;)
https://youtu.be/kA5EfF4_7x0 (https://youtu.be/kA5EfF4_7x0)
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Those who complain that it doesn’t exist know Yamaha badly. And maybe they favor Ketron. ;)
https://youtu.be/kA5EfF4_7x0 (https://youtu.be/kA5EfF4_7x0)
:D
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Just a small one.
It is SO annoying that when I open the style creator, it defaults to wanting to record Rhythm 2. I don't know how many times I've accidentally recorded something when I just wanted to listen to the style first.
Yeah I know it's my own fault but it seems silly to default to arming one of the parts for recording. it would be nice if no channels were armed by default.
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It defaults to RHY because this is the only track you can add to without having to delete the original track first.
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It defaults to RHY because this is the only track you can add to without having to delete the original track first.
That's true, but I object to the assumption (by Yahama) that I am therefore most likely to want to change that part. It's not helpful (to me) to have it pre-armed.
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To be honest, the Genos is a far better keyboard than I will ever be a player. I think it’s good enough to last me the rest of my life. I’m 74 years young.😀
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After 3 years I hope that this year the successor wil come , with al the improvements I mentioned before.
Please Yamaha surprise us 8)
Soneg :)
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To be honest, the Genos is a far better keyboard than I will ever be a player. I think it’s good enough to last me the rest of my life. I’m 74 years young.😀
I agree!
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Ability to Quantize Chord Looper.
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Why would you want to quantize Chord Looper as it is the same as playing chords with a style. You would not quantize that would you.
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Why would you want to quantize Chord Looper as it is the same as playing chords with a style. You would not quantize that would you.
Hi Eileen,
please see also the following thread in this context:
>>> https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,58133.msg450596.html#msg450596
Best regards,
Chris
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If you need a slower tempo to make sure your chords are accurate then select a slower style when recording the chord section in the looper. As you know the chord looper only records the position of you fingers. It dose not record voice style or speed. When you have completed your chord input then select the right style and play away adding your intro's and drum fills as you normally would.
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I hope for multipad buttons with dual funktion..on and off to each of them.
Ingar
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Agreed!
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Agreed!
Korg has that possibility, very comfortable.
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I did not think Korg used Multi Pads.
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Almost 150.000 view.
All this wishes will create a real Genos 2 arranger, no one ask for sound except maybe pianos. Sadly ,long way to see this.
For the K-ompetitors a better sound board and the game is over.
And yes, they have Multi Pads.
Regards!
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I don't have a Genos anymore but would happily buy a Genos 2 if they include the following:
A 61 key option
An integrated USB Audio interface
Better DAW integration similar to the MODX connect VST plug-in where all settings that are made on the Genos will be saved and transferred to the DAW.
/Jugge
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Jugge, you sold your Genos? Sad to hear that!
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Jugge, you sold your Genos? Sad to hear that!
Yes, sad but true. I needed something smaller and got a MODX6. It's a great keyboard and I especially like the integration with Cubase, but I do miss the sounds of the Genos and the inspiration I got when playing along with the styles.
Genos have the best "real instrument" sounds I ever heard from a keyboard, so I really hope they will offer a 61 keys version on the next version. I'll be one of the first to pre-order one ;D
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Yes, sad but true. I needed something smaller and got a MODX6. It's a great keyboard and I especially like the integration with Cubase, but I do miss the sounds of the Genos and the inspiration I got when playing along with the styles.
Genos have the best "real instrument" sounds I ever heard from a keyboard, so I really hope they will offer a 61 keys version on the next version. I'll be one of the first to pre-order one
I don’t think you’ll get your wish, Jugge.
From what I can see, Yamaha have settled on:
Clavinova is 88 keys
Genos is 76 keys
PSR is 61 keys
Hopefully, there’ll be a PSR that meets your standards.
Cheers,
Fred
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The SX900 is a very nice keyboard and has a lot of Genos in it.
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Eileen,
I fully agree with your statement.
The SX900 is a superb keyboard.
I am very happy with my SX900.
Regards, Jeff Hollande
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Yamaha to make a style maker program that is not rocket science for the many.
EMC Styleworks got pretty close, but went buggo as soon as win 10 came along.
If you can get programs like Cubasis and Cubase 11, surely an easy program for Yamaha style making that does not take hours to make would make sense
People raved about Yamaha XG, so incorporate some of that in Cubase or make a dedicated soft sequencer and sound designer for Yamaha owners
Would all be nice
atb
John
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Quantize Chord Loops.
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Hi,
just a suggestion but of importance: that the designers of the next Genos think of the blind men ! On the Tyros 5, there were buttons to access the functions but I can not imagine how a blind man can do with a touch screen!
Greetings and a good week end
Seagull29
PS/ and if possible, a REAL STYLE CREATOR !!!!!!
It's the same here. I am blind, so I can't use the touch screen on the Genos. Luckily, the PSR-SX600 doesn't have a touch screen, so I don't think the Genos 2 should have one.
Another suggestion: On the Genos, right now, I don't think you can record audio directly to a USB flash drive, or have the sounds of the keyboard play on the computer. I'm not sure if this is the case or not, but if not, a built-in audio interface to record keyboard sounds is a great idea for the future.
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Guys, the Genos and SX keyboards have VoiceGuide, so yes, they can be used by blind men - and women😀 It is not optimal, but Yamaha will develope it further. There are several blind or low vision people here, me included.
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Hi everybody,
My suggestions Genos 2.
Operations
• 12” tiltable High Definition screen
• More onboard memory
Multi Pads
• 6 Multi Pads
• Each pad to have on/off “one press” capability (rather than two presses or work arounds)
New Functions
• Ability to convert midi files to styles
Construction
• New sleek black metallic look.
• Non fade operating buttons.
• Do not discolor the area around the buttons
Output
• external screen display - JPG, PDF, BMP - Ex .: printed sheet music.
Midi player
• double sequencer
Drum set
• multiple REVO drums - e.g., Standard, Dance, Folk, Live,
Slide potentiometers
• self-adjusting motor knobs
Thanks
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Has anyone any idea when the new Genos will be available?
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Has anyone any idea when the new Genos will be available?
A couple of years is my bet.
Cheers,
Fred
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A couple of years is my bet.
If ever. 🤔
We, the older arrangerplayers is about to be a rare population. So much happening in the electronic music world nowadays, and the next step is probably something that really aim at the young ones. It's about business. Most likely, it's not autoarranger keyboards.....
Btw,
it make me happy to see that more and more youngsters tend to learn play Classic different instruments, such as piano, guitar, violin, brass etc. 🎵🎹🎵
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Hi Community, I’m a hobbyist player and a proud Genos owner. I’m not a musician (not making money out of music) but have a software development background. I usually read this forum and learn from it and hopefully got to the point when I can also contribute.
After owning Genos for about two years I’ve got mixed feelings about this keyboard. On one hand - I like a lot its sounds and the plethora of styles provided by the community, on the other hand, I see that in some places it’s rather an “unfinished” product, or at least there is room for improvement in many areas.
Since I do believe Yamaha reads this respected forum, hopefully, they’ll also come across this post and will take into consideration the items I’ll raise here :)
I also won’t talk about things that are obviously bugs and should be fixed, only RFE (requests for enhancements). I also won’t mention here the obviously “big things” (those requiring a really big investment and a significant development effort), and will rather concentrate on relatively small (well some are not that small) purely software updates that "conceptually" probably can be done even in firmware upgrades (of course I don’t know how its implemented under the hood so I can’t say for sure, it’s just my feeling)
Also some disclaimers:
English is not my native language, so I apologize in advance if I’ve made my points not clear enough. I’ll be happy to monitor this thread and explain myself better if needed
I also realize that some of these points might have been raised already by other users.
Anyway, I came up with 30 items for Yamaha :)
So here I go:
I’ll start with a style creator. This feature alone can be improved a lot even with software updates I believe
- Event editor - solo mode. When I edit, say drums I can certainly choose “solo” and turn off (mute) other channels to see how it sounds, however when I enter the event editor - for some reason, this solo-mode gets “canceled” and all the tracks start playing - I think this is wrong and we should (preferably from the step editor window itself) be able to switch on the “solo mode” for the instrument that is being edited right now
- Event editor - Filtering by note range/mask. Step editor has a filtering ability - we can show/hide controllers, notes, etc. However what if I want to see only certain notes. Example. I have a Drums track that goes like C, F#, F#, F# | C F# F# F# (two bars). Now I would like to see only a note “F#” because I want to change, say its length across the whole variation. I could “Filter by note range” and then use the multi-select feature to achieve what I want. Of course, in this case, I could go manually one by one over six notes, but in more sophisticated cases it way less convenient
- Event editor - more convenient editing of specific notes. Now to me, this is kind of confusing. Yahama has introduced the touch screen, which is great for most people I believe, so why not utilize its power? For example: if I navigate to a certain note/note parameter (a cell in the grid is a technical term for this I think), why I have to consequently press those “on-screen” arrows - I kind of cursor-based navigation implementation from the previous “non-touch” era? Why not simply touching the required field and move the ”focus” there right away?
- Event Editor - inputting the data in a more convenient manner. This is a “continuation” from the previous user story. Let’s say I want to change the length of a certain note. So I navigated to the relevant cell. But now I’m stuck with the wheel / or by pressing hardware buttons. In previous models, we had +10/-10 change rate, but I haven’t found any way of doing this in the Genos. Ok, maybe I’ve missed something here, but in addition to this, why not provide an ability to enter the desired number right away (a simple widget with numbers and “Enter”). IMO Yamaha could support both ways of modification (also to keep pleased the users that came from the previous models and to take advantage of the new methods)
- Event editor - Multi-Select function - introduce absolute/relative modes to edit different parameters at once. Here is an example of what I mean. If I have, say 8 notes, all with velocity 50 and I want to set them to, say, 70 - I can use a multi-selection mode to do so. However, what if out of these 8 notes, the recorded velocities are, say, 50,45,50,45,... If my goal is to “select” them all in a multi-selection mode and assign them the value of 70, I can’t really achieve that easily. If multi-selection could work in “absolute” mode - it could be way easier to work with it.
- Allow a “staff view” in the style editor. Sometimes it’s way easier to see the staff representation than the list of events like in the event editor. Since there is already an implemented module for “rendering” the midi sequence as a staff - it could be great to see it integrated into the style creator as well.
- Style creator overall. Utilize A-F buttons. I understand the idea of making fewer hardware buttons due to the touchscreen - Great. But currently, even existing buttons A-F that could be extremely convenient - they just don’t work when we enter the style creator. I’ve assigned the button F to turn off touch sensitivity because sometimes in the style creation mode I’ve found it easier to enter all the notes with the same velocity, but I have to “remember” to do that before I enter the style creator. Another example - on Genos there is no dedicated “Mixer” button, so I’ve assigned “A” button to call up the mixer. However, it doesn’t work (direct access + variation is another way to call it) but it’s all about usability. I understand that some of the functions that the user has assigned might not be applicable in the style creation mode, however, how about make this mapping dynamic, namely introduce an ability to assign functions that are applicable in the style creator to A-F buttons so that they’ll keep working.
- Style Creator - quantization during the recording. When we start to record it could be great to add a quantization facility so that the recorded notes would be quantized
- Auditioning of different chords within the style creator. Currently, if we want to listen to how the recorded part sounds when I play different chords - I have to exit the style creator first, If I would like to change something there, I’ll enter the style creator again. So entering-exiting the style creator, while I’m in the edition, sounds conceptually wrong, I believe all the auditions should be in place. One way to achieve that is merely providing an “audition” button (on screen, or if item 7 was implemented mapping to the A-F button).
- Style creator support for “Mix-in” track. Sometimes I would like to record Kick on one track (Rhythm 2) and snare on Track 1 (to keep it simple for the sake of example). So I edit both and now would like to merge them onto one track. The “reverse” operation of extracting certain parts (note filter) to a different track could be also useful.
- More "overall track manipulation functions" in style creator mode: stuff like provide crescendo on bars 1-2 of the recorded part.
- Introduce the concept of a clipboard for midi events. Now this feature alone could be way more powerful than the existing copy bars. It’s more global than the style creator module, but I still think I can list it there. We could say, enter the multi-pad editor or even open up a midi right on the instrument, then copy midi events into the global clipboard and paste it in the style creation mode. The same could work the other way around - so that we could create a multi-pad part out of the style track
- Add an ability to create custom arpeggio - I know many users have requested it.
- If the previous item is implemented - a style creator / multi-pad creator could be used to implement “create a track from arpeggio”. An ability to create style / multi-pad tracks from an existing arpeggio is still welcome and has its own merits, but why not taking a step further?
- Add CASM editor in the style creator. The situation where there are some third-party solutions for the operations that power users do anyway is kind of crazy considering the price of the keyboard. I know many people have requested it, so I’ll just add up my vote :)
- The previous feature (CASM editor) could come with an ability to assign channels 1-8 to some parts and it could be reflected in the UI of the style creator as well.
- Guitar mode improvement. The decision to assign notes D,E,F,G,A,B to mimic guitar strings leads to the (I can’t find the right word in English) - probably maybe “cacophony” in the sound of the recorded guitar part. Of course, we can get accustomed to it, but it’s confusing at least... Ideally, the guitar mode like it exists in “KO**” competitor brand could be a step in the right direction, but the current implementation doesn’t really help much IMHO.
- Better implementation of multi pads creation module. Basically, as I see it the same editing (including quantization, partial copying of certain bars, etc) that are available (or could be available ;) ) in the style creator mode could be also applicable in the multi-pad editor.
- Song sequencer - probably is also subject to the integration of the same features like I’ve described above. I personally don’t use it much because it’s too limited in functionality. I see it equal in editing capabilities to the style creator.
- Live performance improvement. Manual bass is one such feature: All the tracks of the style being played remain the same, but the bass goes to “manual mode”, the left part could be automatically switched to the “voice” of that bass (with optionally assigned effects and everything) and let the performer play the bass part by itself. Again could be done as a dedicated button in future models or at least provide an ability to assign to one of the existing buttons (like was done with the “Fade” function)
- Multipad better operability. Ok, it might be subjective, but stopping the multi-pad by pressing “stop” and the multi-pad button itself while holding the “stop” button, during the live play is really hard.
As an alternative why not simply:
- Single click - start the multi-pad
- Click it again - turn it off
- Double click - sync mode
- Stop button - stop all the multi-pads that are being currently played.
- Improve the UI of multi-effects assigned to the same part. Since it is technically possible to assign more than one effect to the part, it should be reflected in UI. Currently, the UI is rather limited as it is able to show only one effect. Now If it’s musically unreasonable (I personally don’t have a use case for it, but I’m not a pro player as I said) - then do not allow multi-effects assigned to the same voice part…
- Search Improvement. Currently, we have the ability to search “overall” (I the index file I assume). And the results are 10 first pages of entries - whatever it is, styles, voices, whatever. However how about letting the users specify the place where to search (in a specific folder, user memory, USB drive, in expansions, etc)?
- Search improvement - clean up / rebuild the index. Ok, this is a kind of advanced feature and I realize that the synthesizer has a background process that rebuilds the index of the found items however in cases we change connect/disconnect the USB or changing it we could have an option to clean up the cache to avoid showing stale results.
- Navigation - sorting support. Currently, the found items are sorted by name, but maybe we could sort by modification date, Icon, or preset first than items found in user, and then found in expansion memory…
- Navigation - unified categorization between Present styles as User styles / Expansion styles. Similar to the Icons - we could be able to name (or specify internally in the style) the category/genre of the style so that the tabs-per-genre will be accessible also for user styles or expansion. The same is applicable to the voices of course
- Give access to all the icons that are supported in the synthesizer anyway.
- The Capital Letter in the keyboard issue - I’m sure many users have complained about that - to put it simply: when we enter the first capital letter the second letter should be regular automatically - all the phones/tablets work this way, so probably the synthesizer also should catch up :)
- Allow seeing/editing parts of the preset style. The current situation is that the users try to “unlock” the style to allow its editing anyways, so probably Yamaha could consider changing its policy when it comes to the preset styles. So I can understand that idea of protecting the preset styles from rewriting - ok, but why not let the user copy the style to the user area or USB and allow the editing/style assembly function from the preset styles - this is something that I think could be improved.
- More clear flow of saving the “registration memory” bank - currently it’s rather confusing and It took me some time to understand how to use it. One suggestion is “Init new registration memory bank” (a clear one). Then button “save as” - and that’s it.
Faithfully yours,
Mark
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Genos 2 ★ Genos ver.3.0 ★ 20 Wish list for new features at Yamaha Genos by Casper
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAWWso-kwC4
Best regards!
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After owning Genos for about two years I’ve got mixed feelings about this keyboard. On one hand - I like a lot its sounds and the plethora of styles provided by the community, on the other hand, I see that in some places it’s rather an “unfinished” product, or at least there is a place for improvement in many areas.
Since I do believe Yamaha reads this respected forum, hopefully, they’ll also come across this post and will take into consideration the items I’ll raise here :)
Hello Mark!
It will never be fully finished!
Congratulations on the points raised, I agree with everything you mentioned here.
Enildo
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Dear community,
I'll try to continue with the list of possible improvements of the instrument in the areas I've encountered.
Since I'm not a professional musician I don't really spend too much time with the instrument (I wish I had more time for it ;) )
I'm probably using around 40-50% of what this machine has inside (or maybe even less),
so I can talk only about the features I actually use.
Don't get me wrong, I do think that Genos is great (after all I've preferred it over other brands) and really like the product
so I'm sharing this list of possible improvements because sharing stuff like this can only benefit if Yamaha's representatives will
come over this list and will borrow some ideas from here.
I know that in the world of software development companies that stand behind the product maintain "official" bug tracking systems where the users can
submit found bugs, suggest/ask for enhancements, then people vote for the most "important" fixes/features they're interested in,
there are discussions around the features, the representatives of the company that actually develops the product provide feedback, participate in
these discussions - an entirely different reality.
I might be too "spoiled" and apparently, this is not what's happening in the world of keyboards (and I can only dream about this come true)
And I see that this place is probably the only way to share my thoughts as a regular user.
So again, I'll suggest possible improvements some of them can probably be done in the update,
others will require re-considering the style format
but nothing really ground-breaking - everything can be done at the level of the synthesizer itself I hope.
I also didn't really mention integration with the PC (including DAW and expansions)
because IMHO it's really a more professional thing
and I feel that I'm not really qualified enough to talk about these aspects of the instrument.
I might be missing some points - in this case, I would love to know that the items I'm talking about are really a non-issue and
there are easy solutions for that.
Anyways, here is a list of 15 additional suggestions.
- Humanization in style creator
Sometimes when we use a "step record" function the outcome sounds too robotic.
It could be great if there was a "humanization" - something that can be applied only on one track
and randomly change the time of the note and the note length.
This could be implemented as a 'screen' in the style creator
with a parameter of max offset length (the more allowed offset is
the more skew from the original fully quantized part)
- Style Creator Guitar mode -
Since it's known that the part can be divided into up to 3 zones and for each of the zones we can assign NTR/NTT, RTR parameters
It could be great to make this expressed in the style creator. Otherwise its kind of tricky to use various noises available in guitars
- Ostinato support
This is an interesting use case and I imagine the implementation might be somewhat "advanced".
Sometimes the melodic parts can remain the same despite the chord change.
One "straightforward" example from the modern music
is Dua Lipa's Physical song where right from the beginning there is a "synthesizer" part
that doesn't change whereas the chords progression goes like Am, F, C, G
(well it changes slightly for the G part, but you know what I mean).
I could use Root Fixed/Bypass probably to write it "as is" but this would mean
that the part is "coupled to":
- Chord progression (with other chords it probably will sound weird)
- A particular scale
At this point, I might be missing something
but I've tried to make it and couldn't find a good way to do so (If it's possible with the current style creator - please
let me know and I'll remove this item).
Now the purpose as I see it is to make this part at least playable in different scales, and since it's supposed to be a "song style"
probably it's kind of ok to make it bound to the particular chord progression.
So the implementation of this feature would get as an input the "Ostinato" part and the desired chord progression
and would "transform" the Root Fixed/Bypass NTR/NTT to something that doesn't depend on the scale.
Something like DJ styles but for one particular part.
An alternative is specifying right at the beginning of the part that this is how it's "meant to be played" when the first chord of the variation is Am. Then if the player will choose to play the variation in a different scale, the style engine would read this "label" calculate the difference and transpose all the notes in accordance with this kind of shift.
- Style creator - save custom drum kits.
This feature can be a really good addition to the idea of creating custom drum kit sets.
Ok, I'm an amateur, but I assume that people who usually create the styles of the same genre have their preferred sound of kicks,
snares, toms, etc. So giving an ability to save the custom drum kit that they prepare once would be really nice.
I know it's possible to make an expansion sound of a drum kit, but I'm talking about the custom voices that can be done
in the instrument itself.
- Style creator - trigger parts by velocity threshold
The feature is simple:
If I play forte in the left hand, the style engine could turn on some additional parts. Maybe tutti or additional hi-hat if Yamaha will
take it to another level and will allow this feature on drum kit per specific note and not just per the whole variation.
Probably people will have to get used to it, but in some situations, it can be handy
- Style creator
Style assembly - copy at the level of bars and not the whole parts.
Allow copying say bars 3,4 from somewhere into the current style
Also, allow specifying target bars to copy to. Like "I would like to copy into bars 1-2 of the current variation that in general
has a length of 4 bars"
- Style creator copy/clear bars for all tracks at once.
Here is an example that illustrates this use case.
Let's say I have a variation of 8 bars, and I decide to shorten the variation by preserving bars 5-8 and erasing bars 1-4 altogether.
So currently I have to do something like this:
- Clear Bars 1 - 4 for each track
- Copy Bars 5 - 8 --> 1 - 4 for each track
- Shorten the variation length
Now this "for each track" thing is kind of annoying and allowing to make this kind of operations on the whole variation
at once could make our lives a little bit better
- Style creator - introduce chord variations in the style.
I know that pretty much all competitor platforms allowed this modification. In "KO**" I know such a feature exists for ages and
it allows 6 chord variations right as a part of the style. In Yamaha, it's also kind of possible by using channels 1-8 but
in this case, the synthesizer doesn't allow any control on this. And since many professional styles (those done by Yamaha themselves)
utilize this capability, we also would like to take advantage of this technique.
Well, many people will say that style format is something that can't be easily changed -
I understand that, but on the other hand
SFF2 (AFAIK the last modification in style format) was introduced in Tyros 3 release in 2008 and now we're in 2021 -
so maybe its time to move forward :)
- Style Creator - track transpose (octave shift).
Imagine that we record a track with different notes, usually in one octave
C0, C0, E0, E0, G0 G0, A0, A0
Now When I hear the track with this function I could move all the notes at once one octave up/down.
For example, I could "apply" the function and the whole part would look like
C1, C1, E1, E1, G1 G1, A1, A1
Currently, I have to do it one-by-one for each note in the Step Edit window
- Mixing - track transpose (octave shift)
Just like the previous item but allowing it outside style creator, in the mixer.
I know that we can shift octaves for right-hand parts,
why not allow that for style parts (excluding drums/percussions of course)
- Mixing - allow access to mixing individual keys in drum kits right from the mixer without the need to enter the style creator
I think this feature can be handy for 3 different reasons
1. Can be convenient during the live play sessions
2. When We create a style and audition it - we have to do it outside the style creator, only because it's more convenient.
I watched a great tutorial by Manoj on youtube where he suggests auditioning within style creator, and I realize that
its the best we can do now, but then again, I assume that most of the people who create styles really know how to play
different types of chord, and just pressing the right notes to audition the chord would be much easier for them.
3. Conceptually it can be viewed as a part of a mixing process.
- Better visibility of multi-pads.
To put it simply - How can I see which sound is used when the particular multi-pad bank is selected?
- An ability to easily assign an effect to the multi-pad. I know that we could utilize a variation effect for multi-pads.
But since Genos has enough processing power to handle 28 insert effects simultaneously, it could be great if
one of those insert effects could be assigned to multi-pads right through the mixer.
- Favorites - introduce folders
This one is really small but convenient.
The "favorites" feature introduced in Genos and SX700/900 series AFAIK is really nice - I use it a lot when I want to create a style and
I pick voices that might be a good fit for different tracks, then I chose one inside the style creator.
Now, if we have more than one project to work on simultaneously, it could be great to allow custom folders in Favourites view.
Pretty much like it was done in all the browsers. In other words, the structure of favorites can be hierarchical rather than flat.
- Allow simple and fast access to the USB flash memory from both PC and Genos.
Currently, in order to copy from the PC to the keyboard I'm aware of the following ways:
- Use Yamaha Downloader software - well this one is pretty outdated and its UI is really awkward + is so slow
- Use USB Storage Mode - this mode, in general, is great but it requires turning on / off the instrument
so it's not really useful if I want to copy back and forth files during the work
- Unplug the USB from the synthesizer and plug it into a PC, copy my stuff, then put it back into the synthesizer.
This works of course, but I think (and hope) Yamaha can do better than the manual solution :)
- Somewhat creative solution: Use a USB hub that allows access to the same USB drive from 2 computers. Pretty much like a KVM switch -
with one click of the button PC gets the access to USB, then when we press it again - Genos gains access, etc.
Like This item for example (https://www.ebay.com/i/203047836203 (https://www.ebay.com/i/203047836203)) (Disclaimer - I'm not affiliated with this company or something,
I've just bought this device and it works for me, probably there are other similar products that will also do the job just fine)
I might be missing something, but AFAIK, there is no way to grant access to a USB device plugged into Genos from PC so that
PC will "recognize" Genos without a need to restart the instrument in "USB storage mode".
Thanks and regards,
Mark
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I did not think Korg used Multi Pads.
I just checked the flagship Korg Pa4x. I'd never even thought about it, but yes, there *are* 4 buttons called "Pads"; works quite well too... of the 4 simultaneous, you can swap which ones you want by tapping on the touchscreen. On Yamaha of course, you can run 4 different ones from 4 different MP patterns, but there's no visual confirmation of what you're playing.
Being able to see on screen that MP1 is a bassline, MP2 is a latin drum loop, MP3 is a piano arpeggiator and MP4 is a guitar strummer *is* a feature I'd definitely want to see on future Yamahas (currently you can only see the last selected Yamaha MP set, not necessarily what the other 3 multipads are playing). I will bring this up next time I talk to them,
Mark
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Hi
Another big handy thing would be to load as many sounds on USB and load what you want to use on to the Genos 3.
This in other words,able to load your own samples which can be megabyte hungry one at a time without having to make a base file and import packs quick install incrementally.
Just would be nice just to import Sf2 sound files separately without having to reformat.
A better Yem would be nice to. Looks like a ZX Spectrum program :D :D :D
Also a pro score reader
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I wish Genos2 could be 61 keys, but don't think that will happen. It would then be much more convenient to take out on gigs!
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I fully agree with Toril.🤓
Yamaha has to produce a Genos2 61 and a Genos2 76.
Regards, JH
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I fully agree with Toril.🤓
Yamaha has to produce a Genos2 61 and a Genos2 76.
Regards, JH
Won’t happen. Clavinova is 88 keys, Genos 76, PSR 61.
Cheers,
Fred
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SX series is the 61 note version.
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I feel sorry Yamaha will never produce a 61 keys Genos version.
I am living in a small apartment, no room for a 76 k keyboard though.
It is what it is.
I have to accept it.
Best regards, JH
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I am completely happy with the size of the Genos. It is only 94 mm wider than Tyros5-61 (but 113 mm less than Tyros5-76!).
I don't think Yamaha will produce a Genos successor in two different versions (like the Tyros5).
Best regards,
Chris
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I have them both, and you are right chris, the Genos is lighter than the T5-61. I am happy with it, but the people driving me to gigs all have small cars, so I tend to end up taking my PSR 975!!
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After the 9000Pro everybody believed Yamaha should stop
the production of a 76 k high end arranger keyboard for ever.
The Tyros 1, 2, 3 and 4 were all 61 k versions.
Then the Tyros5 came in two versions : 61 and 76 keys.
Nowadays we all seem to accept there will never be
another 61 k Genos version.
Time will tell but I am still hopeful though.
Wishful thinking, I guess ? 😀
Best wishes, JH
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Hi
the more keys the better
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............
Wishful thinking, I guess ? 😀
I think so, and it's also wise of Yamaha to keep it that way.
They probably trying to make a difference between the 'pro' and home market.
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I wish Genos2 could be 61 keys, but don't think that will happen. It would then be much more convenient to take out on gigs!
+1
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📝
Some time ago, I did mention in one or more threads here at the forum a wish for a 'new' feature in next update or model.
I also wrote a mail to Yamaha techies / support about it, and got a reply where they said it was impossible to do such change (or imrovement as I would call it).
Well, Roland and Korg has this feature, (also Ketron if I remember it correctly), and it has been a part of their OS and models as long as I can remember.
I'm not 'professional' trained, nor any good at play a new key on the fly or in a hurry. If I've learned to play a song in certain key, it's a kind of glued into my brain and fingers. It takes time to 'reorganise'. Sometimes there is a need to change key and all that sudden the transpose button can be helpful
But, in opposite to Korg and Roland, the display show the chord for the actual pressed keys, not the sound coming out of the speakers.
It's not the worst problen in the world, but it would be a lot more convient (at least for me) if the display show the sounding / outgoing chord if / when transpose button is activated. 🎹🎵
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Happiness? Genos owners get a new, much improved model with everything from the wish list. Us SX 61-note players get a new model that includes, basically, the sound and features of the present Genos.
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At the end of 2017 the Genos (1) has been launched.
The Genos (1) is almost 4 years on the market now.
Time for an upgrade ?
The SX700 and SX900 serie came 2 years later ( 2019 ) and the SX600 has been added recently.
I wonder when new Yamaha and Korg high end arranger keyboards will be introduced.
At the end of this year, next year ( 2022 ) or later ?
Will the Genos successor be called Genos2 ?
Regards, JH
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Hi
When is this new Genos coming?? :)
It must be on the drawing board by now.
All the Best
John :)
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HI everybody!
"GENOS2 " probably will be lunched 2 years from now so probably 2021.
Please write here any your wish and idea,sugestions.
As we know Yamaha read this forum and They already inplement a lot of wishes and ideas in past.
BEST REGARDS and Thank you YAMAHA.
I wish more spacious pace for text up and down on screen. Too easy to miss as it is now.
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I do not expect a new Genos nor a new SX serie before 2024 ... IF Yamaha have still the intention to continue the production of NEW high end Arranger Keyboards.
Wished I am wrong though ... 8)
Take care, JH
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Hi
I emailed Yamaha UK and asked then if there is a Genos 3 on the drawing board and all i got back was The Genos at the moment is the Flagship.
Same answer as a politician i'm afraid.
Even the Customer Service is treated like a mushroom.
Looks like nothing for a long while to come 8) ::) :P :-[ :-X :-\ :'( ;D
All the Best
John
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Genos is having a very, very happy marketing life.
Lack of delivery for missing raw materials (chip....), everyone looking for Genos around the world, competition not making "pressure" with new high end products.
Also as a consequence of it, Genos is being considered more and more no.1 arranger and became something like a benchmark.
In this situation I would be very surprised if Yamaha would stop this primacy by introducing in the market a new flagship.
I guess, of course, that they are working in designing a next generation arranger, but i would be a suicide to present it in a short time. I guess.....
Genos is an excellent instrument, still very strong on the market, and could be further strengthened with a new version of software (think about the many, many suggestions given by members on this Forum...... Even a small part of them would represent a robust OS update).
IMHO....
Ciao
Angelo
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Hi
How long will a Genos last as computers seem to go bonk after about 6 to 7 years.
There is no spinning hard disk in the keyboard so it should last quite a few years
What do the electronic experts think of the life of a Genos.
Also would Yamaha repair a Genos indefinitately if things were to go upside down or not support it after a while like Microsoft do with windows systems.
All just a thought. I think the Genos is a great instrument and hard to beat.
All the best
john :)
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I fully agree the Genos is the best arranger keyboard on the market for the time being and probably for the next 2 years.
Price increased by 10% ?
Lead time : approx. 6 months ?
Some dealers might have some stock yet ? I do not think so.
Question : Will Yamaha continue the production of new high end arranger keyboards AFTER the Genos ?
Wait and see.
JH
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Hi John,
Most Yamaha keyboards seem to go on forever.
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If it’s only home use, with decent care and some luck these keyboards last much more than 6 of 7 years. And in any case there will always be something even better which comes along to replace them. And for what they are, the cost is not high, so it’s not unreasonable to upgrade to something new somewhere in the 5 - 8 year range. That would probably put the cost of staying pretty current only about $600/year. Not a lot to spend nowadays on a major hobby or pastime.
Mike
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Also would Yamaha repair a Genos indefinitately...........
Dear John,
besides Genos I own a Clavinova CVP 309 Polished Ebony, from 2005 (16 years now...). In February 2021 one key lost the velocity feature and I called the Yamaha Service in Roma, where I live. In a few days the technician came to my home and replaced ALL the contacts for the keyboard, and the felters (these parts were at the Yamaha lab in Roma, no need to order). Clavinova is back to new!
This example gives an idea of the excellent support Yamaha provides for many years. Microsoft operates in a totally different area of merchandises, where a new model of computer is produced many times per year.
I wouldn't worry for this matter :D
Ciao
Angelo
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Hi John,
Most Yamaha keyboards seem to go on forever.
Hi Eileen
That is comforting to know
Anyway back soon with the the music as all going faster now.
The mixing is getting better.
It was weird getting used to flat response when recording but using reference tracks has got me on the right track.
In Cubase i switch back and forward so i do not lose the hearing of flat and not flat
Just recently i had a dizzy spell with a waxed up ear, but the Otex sorted that out . Put me back a couple of weeks
The sound from the Genos is great, so i have now learnt that not to much to change when finishing a mix.
I do find that a few sounds have unwanted artifacts in them and they are easily eq'd out on the computer.
All in all it is a hard machine to beat. On the other hand VST is more precise and superior with a lot of sounds, which i am experimenting with now.Saxes so far are better on the Genos though. So swings a roundabouts
Still the Genos goes well alongside VST.
All the Best
John
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Hi John,
Never used a VST in my life and never wanted to. Always bought an instrument because I just wanted to sit and play it and convey my thought and feelings of the moment. Played for lots of various occasions over the years where they wanted and were paying for Live Music. My keyboard travelled many miles and always looked as good as new when I sold them. Not once did they ever let me down.
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There is quite a bit of variation in the musical interests on this forum. The growth of features on these TOTL arrangers to what I think of as music production has seen more posts in recent times relating to recording, associated software and sound manipulation. As a musician I have dealt with poor sound quality a lot over the years, but it’s now so good even on quite modest equipment, that I personally can’t get too fired up about chasing what I hear are quite small, almost indiscernible differences in sound. But if high quality sound production is their interest it’s certainly much more available and cost effective today than it was in the past.
Mike
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My oldest Yamaha is 31 years old. Still going strong. In future keyboards I want more contrast on the screen. I like to just sit and play. The Genos is probably overkill for my simple needs, but I love it!
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Bought my first CLP300 in 1985(?) when I moved to HK (so it's got the 220v UK plug, but luckily switchable voltage) and it still works.
Then my PSR60, followed by my Roland E20 (yup, still arranger) in '88. Bought my 2nd Clavinova in 2006.
Now, I haven't even plugged in my DX7 (1983 mk 1... was so bummed when they released the stereo version, but I'd already blown my budget on the CLP and PSR) in a decade (it was in storage) so I'll have to go check to see if that still works; but if it does, then everything still works!
Yeah, my 1st Yamahas are nearly 40 years old
Oh, and I actually had (well my dad did) had a Hammond B3 with twin rotary speakers (Not sure what model... they weren't "box shaped" like most Leslies).
Mark
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First Yamaha will have to correct the many errors that Genos has......
- LCD dimmer
-files with long names not recognized/not read
-Copy files to ssd from usb we need to change the file type, this shouldn't happen
-the mfd10 pedalboard does not have the possibility of configuring it on all Tyros it worked on the Genos they did not include it
-both players should access any type of file as in other keyboards
- etc etc etc
It's very sad that we have a Genos and there are many things that don't work right I sent it to yamaha from the beginning 3 years ago and they never answered or fixed it.
I have a Korg PA4x and it's the one I use the most, much more functional, much more practical.
I am considering selling my Genos
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First Yamaha will have to correct the many errors that Genos has......
- LCD dimmer
-files with long names not recognized/not read
-Copy files to ssd from usb we need to change the file type, this shouldn't happen
-the mfd10 pedalboard does not have the possibility of configuring it on all Tyros it worked on the Genos they did not include it
-both players should access any type of file as in other keyboards
- etc etc etc
It's very sad that we have a Genos and there are many things that don't work right I sent it to yamaha from the beginning 3 years ago and they never answered or fixed it.
I have a Korg PA4x and it's the one I use the most, much more functional, much more practical.
I am considering selling my Genos
Hey!
I completly agree.
Yamaha could well start copying everything from the Tyros 5 to start with,
but they have not done so, apparently.
Very sad that nothing happens to correct all errors
after such a long time has passed.
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I don't agree...
Yes, Genos has some missing things, but sorry to say for you bandaclick... Korg will NEVER sounds like Yamaha!!!
Yes, it does not have all the functions of Korg, but they will implement some of them, in time.
First of all, there are a lot of Yamaha keyboard players which only are "sit and play" keyboard players.. they open their keyboards and only play with the styles and voices they have in their keyboards (or they buy from Yamaha's music soft site). There are a lot of these users that they don't need some functions and don't care if Genos will have or not some professional functions. They will not use them because they don't know how and why those functions are needed in the keyboard :)))
Now... to copy from Tyros 5?! What?
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Most of us are very happy and satisfied with our Genos. If you do not like it, sell it to someone that have the sense to appreciate it!
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I have to agree Toryl,
I buy a keyboard to sit and play it and it has everything needed to do that. I don't want to manufacture music as I can buy a CD for this.
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@ Toril
Who is 'most of us'? Most of the Genos users here at PSR, or worldwide?
To me, your statement sounds somewhat condescending. Users usually have different needs, so pointing out personal views and needs should be perfectly OK without being asked to sell and buy another.
@ Eileen.
Yamaha has used big words and launched Genos as a real WORKSTATION..
Quote:
"Welcome to the new world of Digital Workstations. Genos is the new benchmark in Digital Workstation sound, design and user experience. Whether you are in a recording studio or on stage, Genos will inspire and intensify your musical creation and performance."
https://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/musical_instruments/keyboards/arranger_workstations/genos/index.html (https://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/musical_instruments/keyboards/arranger_workstations/genos/index.html)
Looks like it's not aimed for only the 'sit down and play' users?
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GJ - of course if you spend several thousand on a product it’s disappointing to then find out it has some annoying shortcomings. But I think Toril’s point saying ‘most of us’ is also correct because I bet 90% of Genos owners (and I do mean all not just this forum members) neither noticed or care much about the items on his list. That doesn’t mean they are not important to him, but I doubt those items were the driving force that made him choose Genos in the first place. And of course everyone else might have their own quite different list of annoying shortcomings. Mine is that none of these high end end Yamaha keyboards have a final mix on the recording function. You have to use external software for that. But he, like most of us, probably weighed up the sound and overall functionality against alternatives. Even if he had known about these annoying shortcomings at the time, would they really have trumped his overall reasons for choosing Genos? Hmmm??
But of course it is his choice, so if it does spoil his enjoyment of Genos that much, then it’s a free market, choose an alternative that meets more of his his objectives. But no product is ever all things to all men!
Mike
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First Yamaha will have to correct the many errors that Genos has......
- LCD dimmer
-files with long names not recognized/not read
-Copy files to ssd from usb we need to change the file type, this shouldn't happen
-the mfd10 pedalboard does not have the possibility of configuring it on all Tyros it worked on the Genos they did not include it
-both players should access any type of file as in other keyboards
- etc etc etc
It's very sad that we have a Genos and there are many things that don't work right I sent it to yamaha from the beginning 3 years ago and they never answered or fixed it.
I have a Korg PA4x and it's the one I use the most, much more functional, much more practical.
I am considering selling my Genos
Well, maybe I was a bit harsh, but I reacted to the last sentence here. The poster says that the Korg is much mor practical, and that he considers selling the Genos. This is a Yamaha forum. I am a bit tired of Genos bashers! No keyboard ever has got so much bashing. Here I go again...
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Here again I have to agree with you Toril. Even when people are asking for extra's they still trash the keyboard for not having them or being full of bugs and it does get tiresome as I thought this forum was to help people with problems not run the keyboards down.
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I want to complain about the Genos. But then i must be able to buy one.
I,ve to wait to the end of september :'(
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Well, maybe I was a bit harsh, but I reacted to the last sentence here. The poster says that the Korg is much mor practical, and that he considers selling the Genos. This is a Yamaha forum. I am a bit tired of Genos bashers! No keyboard ever has got so much bashing. Here I go again...
Hi Toril, FWIW, not bashing either, they both have good things (The Korg has the nicest feeling keys, and the all metal construction is nicer, and I like that the multipads show you on screen which ones are currently active, and all the styles sound good out of the box because of really good drum samples... even better than T5, but not Genos). Korg also had touchscreens first, and the current PA1000's have HDMI output for video. No converter needed.
FWIW though, comparing the sounds: Both have great drum sounds, but the older Yamaha samples from when they switched over the PSR3000 were a bit flat, *all* of the Korg drums sound good, Strings: synth strings Korg has a slight edge, but Yamaha acoustic strings sound *much* more realistic. Guitars: Korg finally copied the Super Articulated guitars with their fret noises and body taps (Yamaha has had that since Tyros 2 in 2006, Korg didn't implement until 2015 with PA4x), and their nylon guitars do sound a bit more natural now. But Yamaha's steel guitars have the edge. Distortion guitars, both are good (Yamahas sound more real due to being sample based, but Korg's have the ability to do pinched harmonic squeals, something I've been wanting on a Yamaha since they introduced Super Articulation). Korg also copied the S.Art 2 phrasing of saxophones (which Yamaha has had since 2008, tyros 3, Jazz sax, etc) but it doesn't behave as intuitively; when I hit the phrase button on the Korg PA, it doesn't automatically switch to monophonic phrasing... I'll actually get the gliss as well as the note I'm playing *at the same time*. Yamaha's is definitely better. Yamaha's acoustic bass sounds are the best, but the 'punch' electric basses are better on Korg (you can *feel* the thump in your chest). Korg also has the edge on synths and Hammonds, especially pad synths. Both pianos are good. For horns, Yamaha has the edge.
However, saying "Much more functional" is questionable. A few of the reasons for Yamaha's popularity:
1) Ease of use (you can simply look up new styles on a USB stick on a Yamaha... on the Korg? You have to individually copy and paste each style from your usb to install it, can't access externally from the USB stick.) And yes, there is a mass copy function, but it doesn't fill out all the memory slots (the Korg uses a fixed array with User 1, 2, 3, then Favourites 1-12? I think, as individual folders). If you use a mass copy, it only fills out as many as the source directory (so if the source only had 5 styles, it'll only copy those 5 styles into the Korg user folder then erase the rest, wherin you have to individually install each style individually).
Yes you have to *install* styles!
2) Sample library: Yamaha's format was easy enough that anyone can make samples using wav files, and so there are many, many sources, as well as Yamaha themselves have many, many packs. Korg's sample packs are limited in scope (Indian, Oriental, that's about it, and they're really pricey. $250-$400 USD depending on your model), and it's difficult to program for so there are many sample producers out there, and the 3rd party ones available are pricey (and almost all exclusively dedicated to Persian/Oriental sample packs) as well. Additionally, when you install samples to the instrument, there is a fixed number of sample slots... so it almost doesn't matter how much sample ram space the Korg instrument has, the number of samples limits the number of importable sounds. You can put *bigger* samples in, but not more. Yamahas allow for many, many smaller samples or fewer larger samples, depending on what you want. But no Chinese, no Indonesian, no Italian, Celtic, Country music, etc, sample packs.
3) No registrations on Korg. So my demos with switching arrangements on the fly simply aren't possible there.
Mark
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Thanks Mark. Very interesting!
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GENOS PROBLEMS AND SOLUTIONS :
1) OVERALL SOUND : Sound is warm but not Bright. Brighter sound needed like Tyros5.
2) KEYBOARD LENGTH IS NOT CONVENIENT ; 61 Note keyboard is preferred.
3) NO INDIAN VOICES & NO INDIAN DRUM KIT : All indian voices available in Yamaha MONTAGE & MODX keyboards and Indian Drum kit to be included in Genos replacement keyboard.
4) NO SEAMLESS SOUND SWITCHING (CUTTING OF VOICES ) : Voices are cutting off when Registrations are changed, Seamless Sound Switching (SSS) is highly needed like Montage keyboard.
5) ORGAN & CHOIR SECTION TO BE IMPROVED : Hauptwerk Pipe Organ Voices and Wurlitzer Electro Static Reed Organ and Farfisa,COMBO Organ voices needed.
6) REGISTRATIONS SAVING PROBLEM :
(A) During live performance, When Registrations are saved from one bank to another, pop up message asking to save or not, this is not convenient during live performance. Registrations need to be saved immediately like earlier PSR-740 keyboard without any pop up message. Two options needed for saving Registrations 1) Direct Registrations saving one bank to another without pop up message 2) Registrations saving with pop up message.
(B) Last used Registrations voices to resume automatically, when the keyboard is turned off and on.
(C) Registrations buttons to be increased to 16 . Assignable buttons also to work like Registrations buttons.
7) MICROPHONE SECTION :
(A) Dual Microphone inputs needed.
(B) Master Reverb,Chorus effects to be applied for Microphone sound when Microphone output is routed through Sub Outputs.
(C) Feedback destroyer function needed.
(D) Vocal Harmony button to be always off on default.
8 ) ASSIGNABLE FOOT PEDAL FUNCTION : Foot pedal to control Song Volume and DEMO volume.
9) STYLE (ACCOMPANIMENT) VOLUME :
(A) Sub-Woofer Output : A new Separate sub woofer output needed for Accompaniment(Style) voice.
(B) Accompaniment (style) volume need to be controlled with pedal also.
(C) Accompaniment (Style) output to be assigned to sub outputs without any missing of Master Reverb and Chorus effects.
10) STYLE (Accompaniment ) Volume changes MIDI Message :
Accompaniment (Style) should generate MIDI messages, so that Accompaniment (Style) volume can be controlled by using external MIDI volume pedal.
11) AFTER TOUCH EFFECT WITH PEDAL : After Touch effect to be applied via Pedals,since some players don't like to shake the key or applying pressure on keyboard.
12) INDIVIDUAL UPPER OCTAVE BUTTONS :
Individual upper octave buttons needed for R1,R2 and R3.
13) NEW TRILL TONE/ TREMOLO EFFECT BUTTON AND LAST NOTE HOLD BUTTON : New Trill button needed for adding Trill tone effect to Dulcimer, Mandolin,Santoor, Banjo, Rabab etc voices and a new "Hold Button " needed to hold last played note like left hold button.
14) MULTIPADS : Multipads buttons (1-4) to be off when pressing on each button again.
15) REGISTRATIONS & FREEZE BUTTON : Registration button &Freeze button to hold Master Reverb, Chorus, Master Equalizer and Compressor settings.
16) TEMPO SPEED CONTROL ON DISPLAY :
Style tempo speed control to be controlled on Display with digital slider with touch response.
17) AUDIO RECORDING :
(A) Extra separate track recording for Microphone needed.
(B) Separate manual volume slider to control Line In (Audio In) volume.
18) WI-FI SHARING OF AUDIO RECORDINGS :
Audio songs recorded to be shared through Mobile phone through Wi-Fi.
19) PDF FILES DISPLAY :
PDF song sheets to be displayed on the Display.
20) 8 PIN MINI DIN CONNECTOR PROBLEM : 8 Pin Mini Din Connector pins are getting damaged, replace 8 Pin Mini Din Connector with normal instrument cables for external speaker system.
Sunny.
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My list...
For any arranger workstation to be classed or marketed as suitable for use by a composer, songwriter or producer working in a home studio or composer production suite with a DAW - here are what I consider the MINIMUM requirements for a hardware arranger to be usable SEAMLESSLY and thus workflow wise, productively...... WITH A DAW....
Firstly I will state the two areas content-wise which need to be seamlessly accessible or shareable by the DAW user:
A ) MIDI ( song and style data, along with program change messages )
B) Internal sounds used by the hardware by the MIDI above.
So how to support A ) seamlessly ?
1 ) Allow the arranger MIDI data area used for internal sounds, as well as on any external memory sticks - to be accessed directly by allowing user data to be presented to the DAW computer as en external drive over USB.
2 ) failing 1 ) provide some kind of app on Mac/pc that via some proprietary means lets a user on a computer access data on the arranger AS IF IT WERE A HARD DRIVE....
having to continually swop USB thumb drives between arranger and computer is simply not good enough for the purposes being discussed here.
So how to support B ) seamlessly ?
1 ) The arranger needs to support outputting digital audio over USB for at least 16 stereo channels.
The top workstations a( NAUTILUS, MONTAGE, FANTOM ) do this already. It requires that the Arranger has onboard a suitable chip for example from XMOS -
https://www.xmos.ai/usb-multichannel-audio/.
2 ) In order to have total-recall of patch choices when using instruments in an arranger piped over USB into a DAW project its not enough - and impractical - to always have to include PC+MSB+LSB midi data in ones MIDI tracks. So instead - two of the leading workstation brands - MONTAGE and KRONOS/NAUTILUS provide dedicated VST/AU plugins which when hosted in a DAW project, allow internal sounds and patches to be selected from the keyboard and piped into the DAW project.
But these plugins go further. Whenever the DAW project containing any of these plugins on one or more MIDI tracks is saved - a record of the actual patches used on the track gets saved into the plugin internal save-state. And whence the DAW project is reopened - say on a different day - the plugin sends the appropriate messages back to the connected keyboard in order that the same instruments that were used when the project was saved - get called up again.
Such "total recall" really is a time saver.
See here for how Yamaha and KORG themselves do this in MONTAGE and KRONOS. A top end workstation arranger purported to be usable as a composition, song or production tool in a home/professional studio or composing suite- needs to have this functionality too.
--- How montage supports DAWs
https://youtu.be/11ccxrU2QzY
"MONTAGE Connect is a convenient tool which lets you transfer data between your computer and the MONTAGE. Song data created on the MONTAGE can be transferred to your computer and the Performance data edited on the MONTAGE can be saved as a file (.X7B) on the computer. MONTAGE Connect, based on Steinberg’s VST3 technology, works as a VST3 plug-in with the Cubase series. The MONTAGE Connect also works as the same way as other VST instrument software, allowing you to save the edited settings of the MONTAGE, or use them for another project. MONTAGE Connect also works as an AU plug-in. For AU compatible DAW software, refer to the separate Release Notes. It can also be used as standalone software."
https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/montage_connect_mac.html
--- How KORG supports DAWs
https://www.korg.com/uk/news/2021/0916/
https://youtu.be/wS2L97iBiO8
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Do you have information about the new Genos 2 instrument?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9HIxjZ47oE
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Do you have information about the new Genos 2 instrument?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9HIxjZ47oE
It's a photoshop fake.
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It's a photoshop fake.
This Romanian site is notorious for faked click bait. ::)
Please, enough! There are already several hi-jacked threads about this rubbish.
-- pj
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.......
My wish is that Yamaha does what Apple did with Logic Pro. Make Yamaha arrangers, fit hand in glove with Cubase. AND GIVE GENOS owners a 'cross grade' price to upgrade to top of the Cubase line. .....
Yamaha had the temerity to claim or market the Genos as a "Workstation" and as something of use to not only one man band live performers ( of covers mostly ) but - SINGERS, SONGWRITERS and COMPOSERS or PRODUCERS - as I recall..
But as it is currently - with its bare bones CHORD LOOPER as it stands - and no direct USB AUDIO connection to a computer - its hard to see it as such.
But the CHORD LOOPER is the very feature that could act as a crossover thing that really begins to expand upon use cases. As a backing track player whose chord progressions come from in-the-moment improvisations or explorations.
The whole bridge between whats called "DAW-less" ie hardware only - and "in-the-box" ( ie everything done in a DAW ) needs to be explored.
Currently in the producer/composer world - even the most powerful arranger-backing track PLAYERS such as BAND IN A BOX - aren't used much and hardware arrangers considered a no no or a toy - but we all know that sonically they are much much better these days and in any case use the same underlying tech as the big boy proper workstations.
Things that could act as glue between say Cubase and Genos - would be if Cubase had built in arranger features of some sort - it does - like so many workstations - go half way- in that one can set up pattern players and arpeggiators to follow the Chord track - but just like the same sort of thing in workstations- it goes so far and no further.
Personally I think ( and have said so - with an outpouring of naysaying on the BIAB forum ) it would be a great thing if YAMAHA were to buy PG Music - or at least the rights to BIAB - and then use its core IP inside a future version of Cubase.
Commercially - this would if done right - open the way to much richer styles and content - for Yamaha. And the internal sounds for any Cubase arranger feature could use a modified HALION - one which - (at last ) would support switching sounds via PC LSB *and* MSB...
I like just using a hardware arranger totally without a computer- its very freeing - but if used as something to come up with musical ideas for composing or songwriting there just has to be a seamless path from that to a DAW.
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Please Yamaha...No more printet buttons on any keyboard.
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My wish: ability to change parameters (voices, volume, effects) of each track of ANY section of a style without effecting other section AND option to let the change applicable to all sections.
Example; increase volume of the Phr1, Phr2 for Intro2 without effecting Intro3 and the other 3 endings.
On previous S and Tyros models, the example above with change volume of Phr1/2 for ALL sections. That's very undesirable.
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My wish: ability to change parameters (voices, volume, effects) of each track of ANY section of a style without effecting other section AND option to let the change applicable to all sections.
Example; increase volume of the Phr1, Phr2 for Intro2 without effecting Intro3 and the other 3 endings.
On previous S and Tyros models, the example above with change volume of Phr1/2 for ALL sections. That's very undesirable.
I believe that is possible by opening Style Creator and then selecting the Section or Part you wish to edit. This will allow you to edit just that Section or Part without affecting the other Parts or Sections.
Joe H
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I believe that is possible by opening Style Creator and then selecting the Section or Part you wish to edit. This will allow you to edit just that Section or Part without affecting the other Parts or Sections.
Joe H
You are very correct Joe!
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tyro2009,
Did you give it a try? It should work for you.
;)
Joe H
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Dear friends,
I have write an article of my personal and biggest wishes list for new generation of the Genos. I hope my option will be useful for you.
Here my article about new Genos2: https://psrstyles.com/our-blog/yamaha-keyboard-news/43-yamaha-genos-2-coming.html (https://psrstyles.com/our-blog/yamaha-keyboard-news/43-yamaha-genos-2-coming.html)
Thank you
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Hi @Vitalog2010: my compliments for the extensive report and your substantiation on relevant points. It broadly covers, partly or not, the wish already expressed by many current Yamaha Genos owners. I may have overlooked it in the detailed description, but did you also send this to Yamaha Company and did you happen to get a response (I honestly don't expect them to give any response, at the most they got it? ).
If at moment X there is ever a new keyboard (eg. Genos 2/3) from Yamaha, we will be able to see, looking back on the wishes of their customers, whether Yamaha is:
A. a company that listens to its customers or ...
B. is a headstrong company that cares for itself what their customers have to like. ;)
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Hey Ton :
I am convinced Yamaha are listening to their customers' needs
( why not ? ) and ... Yamaha will surprise the world with their Genos ' successor but ... they need more time ( 11/2023 ? ) than most people might expect, I guess.
IMHO their new arranger will beat the PA5X and Yamaha will maintain their #1 World Position.
I am hoping the new Yamaha arranger will be made in 2 versions :
61 and 76 keys - wishful thinking ?
Best Wishes, JH
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@Jeff_H; I accidentally dropped my crystal ball, so it's no use to me now ;D. So I have to wait and see what the future will bring us. ;)
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The Genos keyboard is excellent but it lacks Indian content and other important features. These are the suggestions for the upcoming Genos 2 replacement keyboard.
1) All these Indian voices which are available in Yamaha Montage & Modx keyboard are needed in Genos replacement keyboard.
1) Bansuri 1
2) Vib &Santoor
3) Harnonium 2
4) Tutti
5) Banjo 1
6) Voilin 1
7)Bass &Mandolin
8) Sweet Oboe
9) Vibraphine
10) Bass & Sitar
12) Human Choir
13) Nawa Sadaran
14) Electric Voilin
15) Old Flute
16) Bansuri 2
17) Sarangi
18) Flute 2
19) Shenhnai
20) Strings2
21) Surmandal
22)Flute &String
23)Santur Trill
24) Rabab
25) Oboe 1
26) Dulcimer XP
27) Mandolin Triller
28) Bollywood Piano
29) Indian Laed
30)Electric Guitar
31) Harmonium & Dargam
32) Indian kit
OTHER FEATURES REQUIRED :
2) 61 Note keyboard with world wide selection of voices.
3) Seamless Sound Switching (SSS) like Montage keyboard to avoid break up voices while changing registrations.
4) New Trill effect button or Trill effect SA2 buttons needed for for Santoor, Surmandal,Banjo, Mandolin &Dulcimer voices.
5) Trill effect to be assigned to Joystick or SA2 buttons for Santoor,Surmandal,Banjo, Mandolin &Dulcimer.
6) Organ voices in Genos keyboard are poor, Organ Voices need to be improved. Hauptwerk Pipe Organ voices, Combo Organs and Wurlitzer Electrostatic Reed Organs are needed.
7) Individual buttons for R1,R2,R3 for upper octave.
8) After Modulation effect to be assigned to pedal.
9) Crossfade Portamento with velocity and time related parameters feature like PSR A5000 keyboard.
10) Instant Registrations saving like PSR 740 keyboard without getting pop up message ( like save YES or No).
11) Registrations buttons to be increased to 10.
12) System Reverb effect to be applied for SUB outputs when Microphone output is assigned to SUB OUTPUTS.
13) Fast forward and creating play list for Audio Player.
14) Audio recorder Songs to be shared via Wi-Fi or bluetooth. to Mobile Phones.
15) Last played voices to be restored automatically when the keyboard switched on.
16) Note off Signature feature like Motif keyboard for custom samples.
17) Motorized Display needed.
18) Space to accommodate using external I-pad on the keyboard.
19) To accommodate using light weight Plastic Music Stand also.
20) Multipads to be off if pressed the same button again.
Sunny
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Hey Ton :
I am convinced Yamaha are listening to their customers' needs
( why not ? ) and ... Yamaha will surprise the world with their Genos ' successor but ... they need more time ( 11/2023 ? ) than most people might expect, I guess.
IMHO their new arranger will beat the PA5X and Yamaha will maintain their #1 World Position.
I am hoping the new Yamaha arranger will be made in 2 versions :
61 and 76 keys - wishful thinking ?
Best Wishes, JH
I don't agree they are listening Jeff.
I have been complaining about lack of seamless sound switching since Tyros 4.
My Technics KN7000 could manage it ok 20 years ago.
That and a really good Hammond and Leslie sound would make it just about perfect for me.
All the best mate.
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20) Multipads to be off if pressed the same button again.
I definitely agree with this one
Regards
Ron
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So do I!
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Hi Guys :
Until the year 2002 Yamaha sold the best professional midi sequence programme ever made for Yamaha arrangers ( Tyros2 included ) : XGWORKS - XGW - .
That same year ( 2002 ) the German Steinberg company ( Cubase e.g. ) was acquired by Yamaha.
Yamaha ended the sales of XGW immediately. Updates were no longer available and XGW disappeared completely from Yamaha''s software range. :'(
When the new Genos' successor will be in the market, I hope and pray a similar commercial sequence programme ( made by Yamaha or Steinberg } will be available for the new successor.
Nowadays many other Yamaha arranger owners are still using the old XGW ( like me ) but it is no longer usable for modern styles ( SFF2 format ).
Only SFF1.sty's are working in XGW.
We all know the problems if SFF2 styles are converted to SFF1 styles. :P
Wishful thinking ? I hope not and I am still hopeful ...
Best wishes, JH
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I have never used any additional programmes for any of my keyboards but have always been able to do what I wanted and been quite happy with it.
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Well said Eileen!
I'm a member of several forums, and there always seem to be those who basically dismantle their cars/keyboards/boats/houses... etc etc. instead of just enjoying them.. I never get it!
I saw that you have been unwell, and hope that you are feeling better.
Keith.
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Hi :
IMHO sequence progs, called DAWs, are very useful tools. :)
I am respecting those who have a different opinion but the advantages are very interesting for my home recording activities.
Best regards, JH
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I just record my songs to Midi then adjust them and then record them into the Audio sequencer. Produces fine quality recordings and most enjoy them.
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Until the year 2002 Yamaha sold the best professional midi sequence program ever made for Yamaha arrangers (Tyros2 included) : XGWORKS - XGW - .
That same year ( 2002 ) the German Steinberg company ( Cubase e.g. ) was acquired by Yamaha. Yamaha ended the sales of XGW immediately. Updates were no longer available and XGW disappeared completely from Yamaha's software range. :'(
Actually, Jeff does have a point. XGWorks was/is unique in that it directly supports XG features like voice editing, effects editing, and so forth. It also supports XF lyrics, if I recall correctly.
Cubase does none of that. Even though Cubase claims to support XF lyrics and chords, I have never been able to get it to do so correctly. You wind up micro-editing XF chords and lyrics at the most basic level (equivalent to manually editing System Exclusive messages). The only way to edit XG effects (AKA "DSP effects") is by hand-coding System Exclusive messages in hexadecimal.
Steinberg do not want to condescend to supporting things they did not invent -- XG and XF. Yeah, I think they are arrogant. >:(
Sorry to end up sounding so negative. Jeff's suggestion is a positive one although directly reviving XGWorks may not be the final answer.
-- pj
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I love Cubase and Wavelab :)