PSR Tutorial Forum

Genos (10 Boards) => Genos - General => Topic started by: Wil5560 on July 09, 2019, 01:52:48 PM

Title: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Wil5560 on July 09, 2019, 01:52:48 PM
Inspite of some critical notes / new wishes for the future / or older wishes that maybe remain to stay open, I would like to send a Big Thank You to Yamaha !
Developing and testing and offering an improved firmware is not that easy and for sure we have to see also the various fixes and improvements and new features that are being offered now in 1.4.

I am sure that Yamaha will continue to deliver improvements in the future to the Genos usergroup.

But for now let's communicate also: Thank you Yamaha

regards, Wil
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 09, 2019, 02:16:58 PM
Hi Wil
  What a nice gesture and I will join you in the Thank You. Yamaha always listens to suggestions and where ever possible will do there best to accommodate but as with all things some suggestions are just not possible.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lloyd E on July 12, 2019, 01:31:21 PM

Thanks Yamaha.   Lloyd
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 12, 2019, 05:53:43 PM
I'm not sure I'm getting this right.

One has paid a substantial amount of money for this keyboard, up to $6000 for some
I believe.
Yamaha is only doing what they should have done in the first place, before launching
this keyboard.

Why on earth should we be thanking them.

It's not like they've given us anything for free. They sell additional styles and voices
while other manufacturers do it for free, and update their keyboards more frequently .

Even the Montage is updated with more frequency.
What is wrong with us?

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ckobu on July 12, 2019, 07:55:33 PM
....
What is wrong with us?

Best Regards.
Abby.

Why do you speak in the plural?
I'm one of those who bought Genos in December 2017 and paid the highest price. As a musician, I've been living for 30 years. I've always had top models of keyboards and I'm never sorry to give money for the instrument. And I thank Yamaha for incorporating the latest technology into Genos and what the instrument sounds superbly.
It should be realistic and accept the fact that nothing in the world is ideal. Especially not a simple keyboard. We always have reasons for dissatisfaction and when we see the world from that angle we live in stress and we are not happy. I'm sorry for the people who think only in such a way. I always look for the nicer and better side of life and that is why I'm going to repeat it again:
thank you Yamaha for Genos.

best regards, ckobu
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Fred Smith on July 12, 2019, 11:46:51 PM
Why in earth should we be thanking them.


Because we’ll get better updates with thanks than complaints.

Cheers,
Fred
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 13, 2019, 12:41:47 AM
There service and help is second to none and believe me these technical guys are kept really busy helping many out when new products are produced and fall over backwards to help you understand new systems and how they work. Not all things are bugs. There is quite a bit of user error when faced with new technology at first.
Dose not cost anything to say Thank You. In my opinion it is not said enough now days.
 
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: tyrosman on July 13, 2019, 06:18:10 AM
id also say a very big thanks to Yamaha for the updates and for this fantastic Genos and can not wait on the next Arranger
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 13, 2019, 08:43:39 AM
I love to hear Genos owners are finally very happy with Yamaha's latest update ( 1.4 ) and are very thankful too.

Others might have a different opinion. Why not ? 🎺

Take care, Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ugawoga on July 13, 2019, 09:27:55 AM
Hi

You thank people for helping you , not businesses. we are paying for that product. Customer comes first.
They should be thanking us for purchasing the keyboard and should therefore support it 100% as reputation is the key.
The update is great.
I am looking forward to Genos 2 like Tyrosman. :)

ALL THE BEST
John :)

Ps We all should be discussing more about the hidden depths of the Genos!! :P This is my opinion only and not to offend.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 13, 2019, 10:51:08 AM
Hi

You thank people for helping you , not businesses. we are paying for that product. Customer comes first.
They should be thanking us for purchasing the keyboard

ALL THE BEST
John :)

Best opinion I've read so far on this thread.

Yamaha should indeed be thanking us, the customers, for buying their products.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 13, 2019, 12:13:14 PM
Well I for one will say thank you to Martin and his team of R&D for producing such a great new concept
of Genos. If we buy it or not and the price we pay is our choice but as I have said before Yamaha staff work very hard making sure we get the best from it. Always there to help you if you ask them.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: panos on July 13, 2019, 01:02:12 PM
Maybe they shouldn't bother producing and developing arranger keyboards in the first place.
They could still sell us something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsRugtuI4TI&t=23s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsRugtuI4TI&t=23s)
It has a nice music theme too by the way :)
They could just concentrate their effort on other products which don't require so much development. A grand piano is still a grand piano and you can sell it quite expensive.
Why bothering with a...Genos?  :P

Abby, people are paying to listen to your performance.
So they don't really have to say something llke "Thank you sir! We had a great evening!", right?
If for the last month not a single person told you that he liked your performance will you continue to perform because you still get paid?
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 13, 2019, 01:15:41 PM
Apparently in the UK Yamaha are helping and supporting their customers very well. I wonder how it will be after the Brexit.

Like many other European countries we depend on their headoffice in Germany. 👅

Not so easy to contact them. Too expensive to call them.

It takes 2-3 days before e-mail answers are coming in.😎
Software orders are confirmed immediately by them.😉

 Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: KeyboardByBiggs on July 13, 2019, 01:51:29 PM
Well I for one will say thank you to Martin and his team of R&D for producing such a great new concept
of Genos. If we buy it or not and the price we pay is our choice but as I have said before Yamaha staff work very hard making sure we get the best from it. Always there to help you if you ask them.

I don't see why thanks shouldn't flow both ways. Their team did a great job and we supported that with a purchase. Everybody wins. :)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 13, 2019, 02:10:54 PM

Abby, people are paying to listen to your performance.
So they don't really have to say something llke "Thank you sir! We had a great evening!", right?
If for the last month not a single person told you that he liked your performance will you continue to perform because you still get paid?

Hello Panos.

Yes I will actually, and they don't have to say thank you sir we had a nice evening.

I am paid to perform, not to be thanked. I know when I have done a good job and
when I haven't, and do not need an audience member to tell me so.

Mike (Mikf) said it best in another thread.

He said "Amateurs practice until they can get it right; pros practice until they can't get it wrong"

I jokingly compare it to parachuting out of an airplane, you make sure you never get it wrong.

I practice obsessively to make sure that I never get it wrong.
So even if an audience member says nothing, I'll still know when I have done a good job.
And that is good enough for me.

This might sound like overconfidence, but it's the end result of having done nothing else
but practising playing since I was a kid.

I put in up to 4 hours a day every day in the months when I don't gig so much.
2 hours in the morning and 2 hours at night before going to sleep.
I find that learning anything just before going to sleep helps better in memorizing
what you've learned.

Even now I still practice on the one day each week that I'm free from performing,

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ugawoga on July 13, 2019, 04:59:41 PM
Hi
I would think that you would thank a peformer as he is a human being , but the Genos is an inanimate object. You cannot see the humans behind it, as Yamaha is a collective and someone is getting rich out of it. Also you have shelled a lot of money and it is not cheap.

Tricky both sides of the fence situation.
Who is right and who is wrong "Everybody"!! :P :P :) ;D
We have to be thankful for having a life to appreciate the wonders inside it.
On the other hand it does not cost you anything to say thanks.
Did you thank the Lord when you purchased your first Bontempi   ????? or the Taxman   ;D ;D ;D

All the Best
John :)

Personally I would thank Yamaha and a performer, but not the Taxman ::)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: mikf on July 13, 2019, 05:18:39 PM
I don’t think they thanked ‘ Genos’. They thanked Yamaha, or rather the team at Yamaha who are definitely human. That’s what most businesses and corporations are at the end of the day, teams of real and ordinary people doing their best.
I sold and delivered products and services to people for which they frequently paid millions, sometimes tens of millions. But that didn’t stop them expressing thanks for a job well done. People like to be paid, but they also liked to be recognized for what they do, and thankfully many people, businesses and corporations do just that. It makes everybody feel what they do matters.
Mike
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 13, 2019, 06:34:26 PM
Being a former developer, you don't always get a lot of thanks. As the old engineer's joke goes, "Just as I managed to get the system working, they took it away from me and gave me something else to fix."

When I managed teams, I always went out of my way to thank team members. Sometimes they thought I was crazy, but it pays to build up emotional capital with your team members.

Finally, I have met quite a few folks in Yamaha USA marketing and have met a few Yamaha engineers, too. Yes, they are regular people and I'm sure that they could use a little encouragement every now and again. Lord knows, they get enough gripes.  :)

All the best -- pj
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ugawoga on July 13, 2019, 07:41:25 PM
Being a former developer, you don't always get a lot of thanks. As the old engineer's joke goes, "Just as I managed to get the system working, they took it away from me and gave me something else to fix."

When I managed teams, I always went out of my way to thank team members. Sometimes they thought I was crazy, but it pays to build up emotional capital with your team members.

Finally, I have met quite a few folks in Yamaha USA marketing and have met a few Yamaha engineers, too. Yes, they are regular people and I'm sure that they could use a little encouragement every now and again. Lord knows, they get enough gripes.  :)

All the best -- pj


The trouble is  if you give your all they always want more. >:(

All we need for Utopia is Sex drink and rock & roll!!!  and prime fillet steak  :P :P :P :P :P ;D
All the best
John
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: elad770 on July 14, 2019, 03:20:21 AM
Hello to everyone, I have been viewing this forum for years and this is the very first time I want to respond. It is regrettable which comments are posted! I have had the Yamaha Tyros 1 and 5. In the past in 1979-2014 I had Wersi organs Helios, Spectra, Abacus OAS, Scala OAS. now I have the Genos together with a Hammond SK1 73 & Nord Electro 73. The Genos is primarily a music instrument, what is important is the quality of sounds & styles, the operation of the instrument and possibilities. The Genos has succeeded very well and I say Thank you Yamaha! If Yamaha follows this forum, I hope to ignore some of the negative criticism, and to improve the legitimate reports in the future.

You are a member for years and never posted? I prefer to read "negative" comments than to read posts that don't exist!

In regards to your post: Non of the comments in this thread are negative, NON! People have different outlook and views. for example I haven't updated my Genos yet because i'm affraid it will mess up something, I'm both thankgull to Yamaha and critisize of  Yamaha in the same breath. Not a contridiction. I trully idetify with those who purchased this premium product for 6K 7K
and 100% precent agree with the notion that they fixed somethings that should have been done since day one. Korg released an update for the pa4x that dramatically upgraded their instrument with new features - Ill will be more thankful for that. These comments are not regretable. These comments are essential to make things better. If we wouldn't complain and demand better , companies will not work hard to provide you anything better and you'll get stuck in 1979  ;)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Al Ram on July 14, 2019, 04:24:35 AM
I am just curious . . .

I see people thanking Yamaha and others saying no need to thank Yamaha . . .  . . .

Does anyone know (or think) that people at Yamaha read this post anyway . . .  ?

Thanks
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Fred Smith on July 14, 2019, 05:07:14 AM
I am just curious . . .

I see people thanking Yamaha and others saying no need to thank Yamaha . . .  . . .

Does anyone know (or think) that people at Yamaha read this post anyway . . .  ?

Thanks

Yes, I think they read the posts here.

Cheers,
Fred
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 14, 2019, 12:18:11 PM
I guess this thread will soon run it's course and fade away like many other threads
before it.

But before it does I want to ask again.
Why are we thanking a corporation for selling us a product?

And while we are at it, why not throw in our thanks to those that make our speakers,
amplifiers, cables, microphones, keyboard stands, toasters refrigerators, and all the
other home appliances that make our daily lives easier.

I understand that there may be a few voices here whose livelihood may or may
not depend on constantly singing Yamaha's praise no matter what.

But what about the rest of us?  Do we really need to join the chorus?
Am I the only one who sees the anomaly of this?

Have we taken leave of our senses? Don't we have anything better to do than display
this ritual subservience to a corporation?

Some of the people singing praises now are the same people who 2 weeks ago
were saying that the new update 1.4 was unsatisfactory, especially after having
been made to wait so long and then getting all the hype that raised people's
expectations sky high.

That update, when it finally came, of course deflated many people's expectations here.

I can understand thanking a friend or family member for helping one through a crisis
or illness, but a corporation?

My cousin, 6 months younger than me, had a major stroke 3 weeks ago in Hamburg,
Germany.

Naturally he and his family sent flowers and profusely thanked the quick reaction
of the ambulance crew, and especially the excellent doctor for saving his life.

That kind of thank you i can understand.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 14, 2019, 01:21:39 PM
I would not compare house hold appliances  unless you can go out and make a living playing a Toaster.
  How do we know who people thank. If you purchase Speakers and you get very good service and advice from the people that sold them to you do you not thank them. I have worked with people all my life and was taught Manners and respect and to appreciate and thank as a young child. Now at 83 I still live by that rule. Surely saying thank you to people you have good service from is not a dirty word.
  Some of the rubbish that has been written about Genos dose not bear thinking about. It is a great keyboard and most who do all the complaining have never posted any music so we can hear what they produce with it. At least most of the people I know do sit down and play it. Some choose to multi track and the results are truly amazing and if you did not know better you would swear you were listening to a full blown Orchestra. So I for one am thankful to have such an instrument.


.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 14, 2019, 01:33:49 PM
Hi Abby :

You are absolutely right it is not usual to thank manufacturers for their ( commercial ) products.
 
If consumers are pleased or not pleased with the quality, the functions, the looks, the price etc., they normally give the product a number.
From : 0 to 10 and explain why they go for that number.

It might be interesting to see which number the Genos deserves and why ( short description ).

If all present Genos owners here are ready to give their number ( + short description ), we might better understand why people are happy or unhappy with their Genos.

Abby, I am looking forward to seeing your " result ".😀

Best wishes, Babette

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 14, 2019, 01:49:40 PM
I have worked with people all my life and was taught Manners and respect and to appreciate and thank as a young child.

.


I believe that all the people posting here have also been taught manners and respect by
their parents.
If not then that would be a big dereliction of duty on the part of any parent.

Aside from semantics that have conveniently left out the other points I was making,
I think that I've tried to present my case quite clearly above, and will not repeat it other
than say that I can understand someone thanking a doctor ( in reference to what I
mentioned in my post above) for saving his life after a major stroke.

Corporations that we have paid a fortune to?  Not so much.

There are people here who really had to struggle to find the money to buy this product,
or any other product for that matter.

Why should they also say "thank you for taking my last penny"

Rereading my post above may offer a better understanding of the point I was trying to
make.


Best Regards.
Abby.

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Fred Smith on July 14, 2019, 02:26:07 PM

I believe that all the people posting here have also been taught manners and respect by
their parents.
If not then that would be a big dereliction of duty on the part of any parent.

Aside from the semantics I think that I've tried to present my point quite clearly above,
and will not repeat it other than say that I understand someone thanking a doctor
for saving his life after a major stroke.

Corporations that we have paid a fortune to?  Not so much.

There are people here who really had to struggle to find the money to buy this product,
or any other product for that matter.

Why should they also say "thank you for taking my last penny"

Abby,

The point we can agree on is we both want better products from corporations. Where we disagree is how to get them.

You've told us the way to better products is to complain (vociferously). I disagree, because constant complaining eventually falls on deaf ears.

In fact, the reason for thanks is not altruistic, but mercenary: we get better products that way.

I got what I wanted from the 1.4 update. How did you do?

Cheers,
Fred
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 14, 2019, 02:35:47 PM

You've told us the way to better products is to complain (vociferously). I disagree, because constant complaining eventually falls on deaf ears.


Cheers,
Fred

I believe that must be Elad or Vali who said that, not me.
And if I did write something regarding complaining, I doubt that I would have
used the words "complain or vociferously "
Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 14, 2019, 02:41:45 PM
Hi Abby --

I'm not thanking Yamaha the corporate entity, but I am thanking the engineers, tech writers, testers, and every other person who put their personal effort into making this product and its update. Having worked in technical development, I know that there are people who put their heart and soul into a product, sometimes to the detriment of their personal lives.

This isn't too different than the time that I thanked (and tipped) the talented pianist who provided the background for my niece's wedding rehearsal party. Hired? Yes, but I wanted him to know that his playing was appreciated at a personal level. Had a great conversation with the chap, too.

Hope this better explains where I'm coming from -- pj
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 14, 2019, 02:50:38 PM
Hello PJ.

I get your point, especially with you being someone who has worked in the industry
and knows the nitty gritty of what it takes to be in an engineering department.

Sadly some others do not approach this subject from the same position as yours.
I sometimes get upset when people throw logic out of the window.

I always highly appreciate your input.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Dromeus on July 14, 2019, 03:05:08 PM
sometimes to the detriment of their personal lives.

Excuse me for being OT, Paul, but I met some colleagues acting like this and - in the long run - affecting seriously their health and/or family relations. They don't need thanks, but help, preferably professional. Just my 2 ct.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 14, 2019, 03:14:17 PM
GENOS

12 POINTS, right ?

 ;)
Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 14, 2019, 05:16:32 PM
Yes for me I will agree with that.

I must add that I don't see any mention of corporations being thanked. I for one am expressing my thanks to all that help us when it is needed and do it in a very kind way at Yamaha. They are people like we are. A little appreciation dose not cost anything.
  Don't forget that when most people retire now days they have a little money to spare and want to take up music again or have a new hobby. What better than a Genos.
 
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 14, 2019, 05:52:09 PM

I must add that I don't see any mention of corporations being thanked.

I respectfully disagree.

Yamaha IS a corporation, and the title of this thread IS "Thank you Yamaha."
And the conversation here does suggest that we should thank that corporation for
whatever crumbs that have been thrown our way.

Why do we have to prostrate ourselves before a corporation and say thank you?
It is not normal.

We owe them nothing. It is we, the customers who have reached deep into our pockets
who deserve to be thanked, by the Yamaha Corporation.

It has been said that Yamaha read this forum regularly.
It would be very kind of them and appropriate if they were to post a big thank you to all
of us here who buy their products.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soundphase on July 14, 2019, 07:19:38 PM
Thank you Yamaha  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXnt_URhDYc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRuDLuWYAQQ
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: KeyboardByBiggs on July 15, 2019, 08:03:41 AM
Thank you Yamaha  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXnt_URhDYc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRuDLuWYAQQ

Man, you gotta' love Aki! I've followed her for some time.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 15, 2019, 11:34:10 AM
Hi Abby,
  Why is it you only quote the part of my posts that suit you to have a go at and not the whole concept.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 15, 2019, 12:17:56 PM
Like most people here, I quote the parts of a post that I conclude are either inaccurate,
or are debatable.

For example, from the extensive argument that I wrote 5 or 6 posts above, the response
you wrote mentioned primarily my suggestion that we should maybe also thank those who
make our speakers, toasters, other household appliances etc.

That suggestion was of course a bit tongue in cheek.

The important points I was trying to make, were conveniently left out, thus reducing
the context of my argument.

Quoting that post in it's entirety would have been more helpful and would have presented
a clearer picture of what I was trying to say.

Other than that, sometimes it's just because of a lack of time, so one quickly responds
to a part they find inaccurate then run off to do something else.

Best Regards.
Abby.

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 15, 2019, 01:06:34 PM
Like in politics we have to accept people might have different opinions.
Sometimes these differences cannot be solved ... but we have to respect them and move on, I guess.

Keep smiling !😁

Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 15, 2019, 01:37:57 PM
Hello Babette.

Hear, Hear.

Best Regards.
Abby.


The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress.

It is better to debate a question without settling it than to settle a question
without debating it.

Joseph Joubert.
French Writer 1754 - 1824.

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 15, 2019, 06:25:06 PM
I sometimes get upset when people throw logic out of the window.

Hi Abby -- I get your point, too. Logically, I don't know what it means to thank a corporate entity?  :) Does one use a legal document?  :)

Quote
Excuse me for being OT, Paul, but I met some colleagues acting like this and - in the long run - affecting seriously their health and/or family relations. They don't need thanks, but help, preferably professional. Just my 2 ct.

Hi Michael -- I was one of those people and my health suffered. The details are unimportant, but getting wheel out of the office on a stretcher changed my long-term perspective.  ;) USA tech culture can be rather intense. Dan Lyons' book "Lab Rats" sums it up pretty well.

All the best to everyone -- pj
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soundphase on July 16, 2019, 06:40:49 AM
Hi Abby -- I get your point, too. Logically, I don't know what it means to thank a corporate entity?  :) Does one use a legal document?  :)
I think naive praises and continuous attacks are boring for a lot of Psr tutorial members.

Yamaha’s resources are not extensive, programming such real-time operating system is difficult, and Yamaha’s strategy is clear. For me, if they really wanted their flagship includes awaited high-level features, they would have added them when they reprogrammed the OS for the Genos.
Even without these features, a lot of Genos are sold, the number of youtube videos is huge, and most of us are happy with the Genos. A successful strategy.

For 45 years I have looked at electones and arrangers, each time a new major engine is launched, it’s for me a real source of pleasure as it can be when I listen to professional players like Abby. Even if they are both paid for this, it’s not a problem for me to thank them for the pleasure they provide.

Soundphase
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 17, 2019, 05:07:42 PM
This is off topic but I miss the EQ and Compressor controls of the Tyros 3 which probably were
also the same for the T4 and T5.

They were simpler and actually easier to obtain a good sound.

Especially the Compressor.
I think that it's the thing that bothers me the most from the 2 things that I mentioned above.

I've always considered myself savvy about the Compressor and had tuned it to
 perfection on my T3.

The T3 compressor added a beautiful richness to the overall sound quality and I find
it quite difficult to obtain that richness on the Genos.

Try as I may, I don't hear any audible difference in sound with the Genos compressor,
apart from the rasing or lowering of the general style volume and the strangling of RH
voices. In my opinion it doesn't do much really.

Most times it feels like riding a wild untamable horse when playing on the Genos.

As far as the EQ is concerned, I've been struggling with the settings since February this
year and continue to do so, in search of 1 satisfactory setting that I like and can keep.
I am so far still unsuccessful.

I've tried all the settings suggested here, from Lee, EQ Gold, Norman Fernandez etc.
Lee's settings were the closest to the sound I'm looking for, but I've also been struggling with
them to remove the mid range harshness.

I find that I spend a significant amount of time on these two things during my gigs,
aside from the myriad other things that I have to do with the keyboard with every
song.

I wish that for once someone here will offer a frank and honest opinion about these 2
things, especially the Compressor.

Any suggestions anyone?
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 17, 2019, 06:12:27 PM
Hi Abby :

Did you contact Yamaha and have you explained them
your problems and how they must be solved ?

If not, it might be very useful to contact them directly.

I am sure they are happy to help you out.

Good luck !
Babette


Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 18, 2019, 03:06:29 PM
Most people I know that gig using other mixers and speakers nearly always run there keyboard EQ's on flat They then adjust on the separate mixer when they run there sound checks at the venue. This seems to be the preferred method by many.
  They also use a different set up when playing at home with just the keyboard. I used to do the same.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 18, 2019, 07:26:32 PM
Thanks for the responses Eileen and Babette.
Yes, I do keep my mixer on flat or unity as they sometimes call it.

It is actually the compressor that bothers me the most though.
Tyroses gave one more settings possibilities for fine tuning it.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: panos on July 18, 2019, 08:33:11 PM
Abby the compressor is for balancing the dynamics between the sounds.
Let's say that in a band the bass player and the drum player both are playing louder than it should be then the compressor just "cut's" the high volumes.
On a pc I would prefer a normalize function than a compressor but anyway...

In style parts, right and left hand voices etc, we choose while we save the style and the OTS or the registration each one off them how loud it will play.
I don't see why a compressor should change our settings presuming that we don't exaggerate with the sound volumes and we can trust our ears.
We play the song,we test all voices to see that they sound good and then we save the settings.We can even record our playing and sit comfortably and relaxed and listen to it, to see how it sounds.

I also never liked mid range frequencies much on any EQ setting(even if it is my car's audio system) so I always keep them slightly lower.
Especially for my keyboard where there is no singer but just organs.
And always preferred the "V" shape equalizer or kind of an "M" shape.
I can see people using other kinds of EQ settngs.
OK it's a matter of taste probably?
Not mine for sure.
I prefer instead of altering the high EQ or the Bass EQ too much, to add effects like EQ high and EQ low, brightness and harmonic content to all sounds,
That means to each style part and to all right & left hand voices individually and not relying that I will change the master EQ and suddenly everything will sound e.g "brighter".
To my opinion no.
There will be several annoying and disturbing sounds with the new settings.

The problem of the sound with the different venues or if it sounds good on other systems,or on Youtube etc. it's another matter.
First we must make sure that the sounds from our keyboard itself are coming out as we want them to be.

Hope you will find the sound that you like soon.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 18, 2019, 08:37:24 PM
Hello Abby :

I have the impression ( maybe I am wrong ? ) the Genos is not your favourite arranger keyboard.😒

You explained here why you were " forced " to buy a Genos.

Perhaps you like the Tyros much more, am I right or wrong ?

It is up to you ( nobody else ! ) to make the right decision, I guess.

Good luck !
Babette


 
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soryt on July 18, 2019, 09:13:21 PM
the compressor on the Genos is the worst ever , youre right it isnt real effective .

Maybe Yamaha wil come with a real update next time  8)

Soryt  ::)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 18, 2019, 09:52:31 PM
Even though it may not have been a first choice I don't think anyone would want to go back to a Tyros from Genos after having it for a while.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 19, 2019, 07:09:26 PM
It is actually the compressor that bothers me the most though.

Hi Abby --

This is the sort of question/issue that I like to deep dive, but unfortunately, I'm short on time and my gear is packed up to move.

In Genos, Yamaha changed the master compressor to a parallel compressor. This is the same parallel compression algorithm as Montage/MODX. My ultimate take on parallel compression is that it is used mainly for final mastering. By itself, it's not much of an "effect" like a classical compressor as used in Tyros 3 or elsewhere.

Many people expect the Genos master compressor to really pump the music like a classical compressor. They may walk away disappointed. Parallel compression is subtle, not a hammer.

Wikipedia has a decent article about parallel compression:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_compression

So, I'm left wondering about a possible work-around. Maybe assign a classical compression algorithm to the variation effect and use the variation effect in System mode to apply classical compression to all parts. This might achieve the same effect as the T3 master compressor.

Wish I could be more help, but I'm not sure when I'll be able to investigate this. Shucks, I don't know where I will be living 3 weeks from now.  :)

All the best -- pj

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 20, 2019, 01:49:23 PM
Earlier, Abby said...
Quote
I find that learning anything just before going to sleep helps better in memorizing what you've learned.
That has been proven medically. Good for you, Abby! You discovered this on your own - it's true - it does work.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 20, 2019, 04:39:25 PM
Earlier, Abby said... That has been proven medically. Good for you, Abby! You discovered this on your own - it's true - it does work.

Yes Lee, it works for me.

A few years ago I realized that I remember complex harmonies better
when practising at night before going to bed. Especially lyrics and vocals.

So I normally practice a couple of hours during the day, let the music soak in,
then do another 2 hours at night.

I then immediately switch off and head straight to bed. No TV or reading, just
straight to sleep.

What do you think about PJs explanation concerning the
Genos compressor ?

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 21, 2019, 05:18:59 PM
Hi Abby --

This is the sort of question/issue that I like to deep dive, but unfortunately, I'm short on time and my gear is packed up to move.

In Genos, Yamaha changed the master compressor to a parallel compressor. This is the same parallel compression algorithm as Montage/MODX. My ultimate take on parallel compression is that it is used mainly for final mastering. By itself, it's not much of an "effect" like a classical compressor as used in Tyros 3 or elsewhere.

Many people expect the Genos master compressor to really pump the music like a classical compressor. They may walk away disappointed. Parallel compression is subtle, not a hammer.

Wikipedia has a decent article about parallel compression:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_compression

So, I'm left wondering about a possible work-around. Maybe assign a classical compression algorithm to the variation effect and use the variation effect in System mode to apply classical compression to all parts. This might achieve the same effect as the T3 master compressor.

Wish I could be more help, but I'm not sure when I'll be able to investigate this. Shucks, I don't know where I will be living 3 weeks from now.  :)

All the best -- pj

Hello PJ.

Thank you very much for your explanation.

It has made things more clear, and has confirmed what I have been thinking
all this time.

I've always thought that the Tyros series had a better compressor worthy of being called
a compressor, and that actually gave you good and useful compression.

I use the Genos live in front of an audience 6 nights a week and can testify to the fact
that the compressor is pretty useless.

It may be good for other uses and users, but you don't want uncontrollable sound when
playing in front of an audience.

The Tyros compressor actually made a big difference, made the sound richer,
and held all the ACMP parts together very nicely.

This compressor does nothing of the sort.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 21, 2019, 05:39:11 PM
Hi Abby :

Why not inform Yamaha directly ?📌

Best regards, Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: emmaco on July 21, 2019, 06:10:09 PM
the compressor on the Genos is the worst ever , youre right it isnt real effective .

Genos's effects are from the rivage mixer series... more than 3500 $ each (the cheapest...).
Are you sure to use them properly ?... compressors are complicated to use...
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 22, 2019, 01:39:06 AM
Hello Emmaco.

It's not about it's origins. What matters to the user is whether it works or it doesn't.
The explanation that PJ provided is more useful and makes more sense.

Pray show us the right way of using this compressor.

I for one am quite familiar with a compressor and have also assisted a sound engineer
for a year in a recording studio in Belgium, where I worked as a session musician.

This particular compressor does not provide one with many fine tuning options.

Best Regards.
Abby.

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 22, 2019, 07:47:36 AM
Strange ... nobody else is really complaining about the quality of this Genos compressor, am I right ?👂

Different use and/or application maybe ? 🎈

Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 22, 2019, 08:05:18 AM
Hi Abby :

Very interesting to hear you have been working in a Belgian pro recording studio in the past.👋

In which recording studio('s) were you active there ?
A long time ago ?

Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: KeyboardByBiggs on July 22, 2019, 08:37:01 AM
This particular compressor does not provide one with many fine tuning options.

As stated previously the Genos "compressor" is providing a particular style, or implementation, of compression. This technique is known in recording studio lingo as "New York Compression." It's a perfectly valid technique but does not provide the same outcome as straight, or standard compression (for lack of a better term).

Standard compressors (especially mix buss, or finalizing ones) offer an effect often described as "gluing" a track together making it more cohesive, tight, and/or dynamic. I believe this is what you were hearing on your Tyros Abby based on how you describe it.

If this is the effect you desire I'd highly recommend the simple add on of a quality compressor between the Genos and your PA. Even a top-of-the-line, single rack space, studio-style model only weighs a couple of pounds and is not large at all. The end result may be more than worth it, especially if it really lights things up for you.

For what it's worth, I've been playing analog and digital keyboards my whole life and running a recording studio for over 20 years. I've never had so much of challenge trying to make things sound right as I have with the Genos. I don't think it's bad, just different.

I've had to try a LOT of different tweaks and settings and many different speaker setups to finally get the sound out of it I was looking for. Probably not something the average home player would ever trifle with or even notice necessarily, but when you're looking for a high-performance sound you're used to getting on stage, it's kind of critical, a no-compromise situation.

So, to Abby and others digging for that certain something, that sound you're looking for out of your Genos, you're not alone...and it's in there, you just have to find it. :)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 22, 2019, 12:19:13 PM
Hi Abby :

Very interesting to hear you have been working in a Belgian pro recording studio in the past.👋

In which recording studio('s) were you active there ?
A long time ago ?

Babette

Hello Babette.

I assisted in a studio called Studio Piramide outside Brussels, around 1988-89.
I was a session musician and often called upon to fill in songs that were deemed
weak and lacking body, to fatten them up a bit.

I would often go hang out there even when not needed, just to see what the
sound people were doing and how they were doing it.

I would typically add some piano arrangements or a Saxophone solo between lyrics etc.
It was interesting creative work and I should maybe have stuck with it.

Other parts I used to do on an Atari 1040, using Steinberg sequencer software
to run a Yamaha DX7 and an Akai 1000 I think it was called.

It was interesting work and I should maybe have stuck with it, but my wife needed
sunshine, Sangria and the sea, so we moved to Ibiza in 1992.

Best Regards.
Abby
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 22, 2019, 01:46:23 PM
With all this compressor talk, it makes me wonder if my settings are the reason I can't get a consistent bass sound out of my Genos the way I could with my T5. I use a modified version of the EQ GOLD settings, but my bass is either weak or too much.

Note: I am in the process of exploring the amplifier I use to drive my homemade subwoofer. Currently, I'm using a Behringer iNuke6000, which is a flat PA amp with high and low pass filters. I'm thinking of trying out a Gallien-Kruger bass guitar amp, which I suspect will have a far better bass contour. Therefore, the Genos compressor may not be the source of my issues. Sorry to have drifted the "Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha" topic.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Wouter1972 on July 22, 2019, 01:54:15 PM
Without polluting the topic too much I would like to express my thanks for having a Tyros 5 and for Yamaha making the product in the first place ;) ;D

Wouter
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 22, 2019, 03:01:00 PM
With all this compressor talk, it makes me wonder if my settings are the reason I can't get a consistent bass sound out of my Genos the way I could with my T5. I use a modified version of the EQ GOLD settings, but my bass is either weak or too much..


About after an hour of playing last night my Subwoofer stopped midway through a song.
I first thought that I had blown it, so I was forced to excuse myself and stop for about 15
minutes before restarting it.

It worked after that, but the bass drum and other bass notes kept increasing and
decreasing in volume after that.

I don't know if you still remember Lee that I blew the woofer of my JBL mains when I
was using the EQ Gold settings and then touched the compressor volume, which jumped to
maximum,  about 2 months ago.

That was before update 1.40 when the volumes would jump when you touch a knob.

I had to buy a new 15 inch woofer that costed me 225 Euros.
Luckily a friend who is an occasional performer had an identical unit that I could
borrow till mine was fixed..

After apologising for being off topic I started the compressor subject in the hope that
someone has better knowledge about the workings of this particular type of compressor,
and would offer some of their settings.

The presets unfortunately are not very effective.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 22, 2019, 03:07:25 PM
Hi Abby :

Great feedback about the Pyramide Studio in Beersel/Brussels which is still alive.
A new owner now though. See their website.
 
THANK YOU !👍

In the past they made 2 masters for me. It was in 1984.
Great studio ... and ... at very reasonable prices. I remember well.🐯

Back to the Genos compressor.

Now we have read more people are not so pleased with the quality of the Genos compressor, they say.

It looks like Yamaha have to create a new update to fix it.😧
( If possible ? ).

BTW, a friend wants to sell her T5/76 XL.
If you might be intersted let me know and you can contact her directly.
I know it is in mint condition. Only home use.
She is no longer interested in making music.
I know her father bought it brand new.

Best regards, Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 22, 2019, 03:25:45 PM
Hello Babette.

Thanks for the suggestion but I can't afford to buy another keyboard now, so
soon after buying the Genos.

I'm the sole provider for my family and have been so since 1990.
My son is studying in Norway and that is costing me an arm and a leg.

I also have to travel to my country this November and that will take away
the other arm and leg.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 22, 2019, 03:54:27 PM
No problem, Abby.
Indeed, it was just a suggestion.🐰

Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 22, 2019, 09:28:28 PM
Abby, I do remember you mentioning your blown JBL woofer. Those woofers are extremely robust and underrated. Something terrible in the settings must have got out of hand to cause such an overload.

I just hope I can achieve a more even bass line in my syles. I've never really liked the mega voice bass sounds. They are either too soft or too punchy, regardless of how realistic everyone thinks they sound. For gigging, we need steady bass velocity. We can't have them jumping all over the map. The toms and kick drums are really overbearing on the Genos, as well. I have to route them from Sub 1-->a channel on my mixer where I can control them. Otherwise, they pound the daylights out of you.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 22, 2019, 10:21:36 PM
Hi Lee :

This Genos compressor issue seems to become a problem for giggers.

I wonder if Yamaha are informed yet and how they can and/or will be able to solve it.

Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ckobu on July 22, 2019, 10:49:19 PM
Babette,

I'm gigger, every weekend I'm at the show. I cannot see or hear any problems in Compressor. Before I used Tyros4, now I play on Genos. At the performance of Genos there is much more beautiful and fuller sound than Tyros4.
It's a big mistake for musicians to buy expensive and high quality keyboard, while simultaneously using the middle-class loadspeaker and mixer. He simply cannot reproduce the sound of modern arrangements. Then it seems to be a problem in the keyboard. The problem lies in something else, not Compresor or EQ Genos.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 22, 2019, 11:22:54 PM
I agree that the Genos has a stellar sound. The only problem I have is with inconsistent bass volume. It seems I must edit each registration to get just the right amount of bass - something I never had to do with the T5. Something changed.

I don't use second rate sound gear as can be seen in my signature line. I do believe though, that my subwoofer amplifier may be the wrong one for reproducing bass. That is an ongoing issue for me. I am going to try out a Gallien-Kruger bass head for my subwoofer and see if that solves my bass problem. I'm optimistic that it should work because, despite my skill and history of building loudspeakers, I don't think Yamaha got it wrong when they designed the bass output in the Genos, mega voice bass notwithstanding.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ckobu on July 22, 2019, 11:48:25 PM
Good and good low-frequency sound (Kick and bass guitar) can only be achieved on a good and linear PA system. Adding the Bas Woofer that does not fit and is not well matched with the satellites always spoils the sound image. Usually, we have more harm than good. I do not say that is the case with you, but you have to think about it.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 23, 2019, 12:01:12 AM
Agreed 100 percent, ckobu. I designed and built my own subwoofer. It measures quite flat. I tried it out in the fall of 2018 with a Gallien-Kruger micro head and Epiphone bass guitar. It sounded amazing, so proper bass reproduction is possible with my sub. My two Bose L1 Compacts roll off fairly steep at 65 Hz. I have the low pass filter set in the Behringer amp at 70 Hz. The blend should work well. At this point, I would say about 60% of my registrations sound good. The rest are either way too boomy or the bass is thin.

We seem to be drifting way off-topic here. I'll report my findings in a new topic after trying out a dedicated bass amp. Apologies to the OP :). Thanks for everyone's patience. This is why, at the end of the day, we are one huge family on this forum. With respect,

Lee
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 23, 2019, 06:57:31 AM
I would like to thank both gentlemen for their comments.👍

It seems there is nothing wrong with the Genos compressor but it could be a PA problem instead, right ?

I also understand the total sound quality of the Genos has been improved compared to the Tyros, right ?

Best regards, Babette

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: reya on July 23, 2019, 11:00:00 AM
Hi Babette,

My personal opinion is that the Revo drums are a big improvement, but the voices are still a bit thin and cold (digital) as on Tyros. But that is just me.
Has anyone tried using an accordeon voice on Genos  and then have someone playing a real accoustic (non digital) accordeon in the same room..... Be prepared to be blown away by the difference ...

But Babette, in another post you wrote ...

quote
'Based on the Genos comments, complaints and observations of members, I was confused.
Up to now I have still question marks.

As of tomorrow I will do my own research together with my dealer.
I will no longer bother you and/or other members.
I will go my own way.
I will take all the time I need to make a final decision.
If I am not convinced I will not sell my TY5/76.

For your information : I am playing Yamaha arrangers since 2001 and I have always been a dedicated follower of Yami's.
Amen.

Take care,

Babette'
end of quote

I wonder Babette, have you been to the dealer in the meantime and done the research of your own??
What are your findings ?

Thanks

Rudy
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 23, 2019, 11:33:15 AM
Hi Rudy :

No Genos for the time being.
Maybe in the near future, who knows.
I like the Genos very much but I love my T5/76.

Best regards, Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: EileenL on July 23, 2019, 12:49:07 PM
It probably would be best if you went and tried Genos for yourself Babette and then you would know what people are talking about and would not need to ask so many questions. Genos as it is
dose the job it is supposed to and very well to. Compared to the amount sold only a very few are asking for it to do more.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 23, 2019, 04:53:01 PM
Babette,

I'm gigger, every weekend I'm at the show. I cannot see or hear any problems in Compressor. Before I used Tyros4, now I play on Genos.



I too am a performer ( I'm not fond of the word gigger) and perform 6 nights a week in
4 hotels.
I do six months of intensive performances for a total of 180, followed by a less intensive
program of 3 to 4 performances  a week that brings it all to a total of about 260 per year.

I have to be on top of my game at all times without exception, and it is not easy to do
that with a keyboard that can't be brought under control.

One bad performance and you're out on the street, as it is really a dog eat dog
competitive environment that I live in over here.

I understand the determination of some of us to be loyal to an inanimate object no matter
what is said or done,  but my first post regarding this subject on page 1 was very simple.

I asked for suggestions from anyone who has managed to get the compressor settings
work in a satisfactory way.

Of course there are no problems with the compressor, nobody said that there are any.
And one cannot hear any problems either because the compressor doesn't seem to be
doing anything at all anyway, other than raising or lowering the general volume.

Apart from the usual "Genos is a different animal " and  "Compressor good, Genos good "
responses, there have not been any suggestions so far, which is what I have originally
asked for.

So I will ask again.

Any Suggestions  Anyone On Compressor Settings For Genos?

Best Regards.
Abby.

Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: beykock on July 23, 2019, 06:23:47 PM
Hi Abby :

I believe nobody here is able to answer your question.😧

It looks to be a very complex issue that only might be answered by Yamaha if the Genos manual cannot help you out.😱

PJ explained why the compressor of the Genos is different  and 2 other performers ( giggers ) say it might be a PA problem but it is definitely not a Genos compressor issue, they say.

IMHO right now there is only one solution : try to find the best sound by ear. A sound check.
I see no other alternative for the time being.

Bye for now, Babette
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 23, 2019, 06:46:19 PM
Hi Abby,

Compressor settings are dependant on the PA, are they not? Although, I suppose one could argue that either the PA reproduces a full sound spectrum or it doesn't.

Please let us know where you find the Genos to be weak, and I'll play with some settings. Thanks....Lee
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soundphase on July 23, 2019, 07:13:03 PM


I too am a performer ( I'm not fond of the word gigger) and perform 6 nights a week in
4 hotels.
I do six months of intensive performances for a total of 180, followed by a less intensive
program of 3 to 4 performances  a week that brings it all to a total of about 260 per year.

I have to be on top of my game at all times without exception, and it is not easy to do
that with a keyboard that can't be brought under control.

One bad performance and you're out on the street, as it is really a dog eat dog
competitive environment that I live in over here.

I understand the determination of some of us to be loyal to an inanimate object no matter
what is said or done,  but my first post regarding this subject on page 1 was very simple.

I asked for suggestions from anyone who has managed to get the compressor settings
work in a satisfactory way.

Of course there are no problems with the compressor, nobody said that there are any.
And one cannot hear any problems either because the compressor doesn't seem to be
doing anything at all anyway, other than raising or lowering the general volume.

Apart from the usual "Genos is a different animal " and  "Compressor good, Genos good "
responses, there have not been any suggestions so far, which is what I have originally
asked for.

So I will ask again.

Any Suggestions  Anyone On Compressor Settings For Genos?

Best Regards.
Abby.

Not sure as I’m not in front of the Genos currently : It’s perhaps possible for you to assign the legacy Compressor effect present in the legacy folder as chorus effect on all the parts Rx,L, style, multipads. It would not be a perfect solution as you could no longer use ‘chorus section’ for chorus effect, but, if the Genos allows you to choose all kinds of effect for the chorus or the reverb effect sections, it could be a way for you to see if you can retrieve the sound you like.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Lee Batchelor on July 23, 2019, 07:23:20 PM
The T5 compressor settings are in the Genos? Where? I didn't know that :).
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: mikf on July 23, 2019, 07:25:31 PM
I imagine the vast majority of arranger users do not mess with compressors. In fact, the vast majority probably don’t mess much with sounds at all, happily accepting them as they come ‘out of the box’.
That doesn’t mean that what is being said about the compressor is wrong, just that it is not important to most.
I guess Abby often plays quite plays quite heavy party music in loud environments, and has different needs from the mainstream Genos user. I am sure there are others like him, but they are a tiny percentage of arranger players, so I think he may have problems getting input from others on this forum.
Mike
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 23, 2019, 10:42:05 PM
Hi folks --

At the risk of being repetitive, there isn't a single "Genos compressor." Please study the DSP FX routing diagram on page 124 of the Reference Manual. The Master Compressor is a single stage in a rather long chain of signal processing.

A compressor algorithm can be assigned to a DSP unit just like a reverb type, flanger, whatever. The "problem" with the Master Compressor is that the compressor effect type is fixed and is a parallel compression algorithm (as I mentioned before). The Genos does not allow one to change the effect type of the Master Compressor to a different algorithm, such as one the classic, legacy compressors supported by earlier Tyros models.

Again, as I mentioned earlier, a parallel compressor is most suitable for mastering a sound recording. It is subtle and is not a master blaster for EDM or whatever. Genos supports a larger number of assignable DSP units to Style parts. If one studies the Genos factory styles, they will notice widespread use of classical compression effect types on individual parts.

BTW, Abby, I know you grok this already due to your studio experience. I'm just trying to post background info to help other readers.

All the best -- pj
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: pjd on July 23, 2019, 10:50:28 PM
Not sure as I’m not in front of the Genos currently : It’s perhaps possible for you to assign the legacy Compressor effect present in the legacy folder as chorus effect on all the parts Rx,L, style, multipads. It would not be a perfect solution as you could no longer use ‘chorus section’ for chorus effect, but, if the Genos allows you to choose all kinds of effect for the chorus or the reverb effect sections, it could be a way for you to see if you can retrieve the sound you like.

Soundphase has the right approach. However, I would recommend assigning one of the legacy compression DSP effect types to the Variation effect block. The Variation block is system-wide when it is in System mode. Then it is system-wide just like the Chorus and Reverb blocks. Again, please check out the diagram on page 124 of the Reference Manual. By using the Variation block, you don't have to give up the Chorus (or Reverb) block.

Abby, I don't know how this would affect your current registrations and how much pain it will cause to implement. I'm sorry, but the movers took my Genos away today! Otherwise, I would be experimenting...

All the best -- pj
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Toril S on July 23, 2019, 11:41:44 PM
I had a good time reading this thread. So now I will say a BIG thanks to Yamaha, and an even bigger thanks to you guys and gals, you made my day :)
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soundphase on July 24, 2019, 05:14:45 AM
Soundphase has the right approach. However, I would recommend assigning one of the legacy compression DSP effect types to the Variation effect block. The Variation block is system-wide when it is in System mode. Then it is system-wide just like the Chorus and Reverb blocks. Again, please check out the diagram on page 124 of the Reference Manual. By using the Variation block, you don't have to give up the Chorus (or Reverb) block.

Abby, I don't know how this would affect your current registrations and how much pain it will cause to implement. I'm sorry, but the movers took my Genos away today! Otherwise, I would be experimenting...

All the best -- pj
Not sure. I think ‘variation’ can only be used on style parts. ‘reverb’ and ‘chorus’ are available for all parts including Rx,L parts.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: jwyvern on July 24, 2019, 09:36:35 AM
Not sure as I’m not in front of the Genos currently : It’s perhaps possible for you to assign the legacy Compressor effect present in the legacy folder as chorus effect on all the parts Rx,L, style, multipads. It would not be a perfect solution as you could no longer use ‘chorus section’ for chorus effect, but, if the Genos allows you to choose all kinds of effect for the chorus or the reverb effect sections, it could be a way for you to see if you can retrieve the sound you like.

It would be an interesting work around but Chorus can only access a limited range of effects and Compression is not one of those permitted effects. (Or, more accurately I can not find a way to access them including within Legacy.)

John
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: ckobu on July 24, 2019, 09:55:38 AM
.....................
Any Suggestions  Anyone On Compressor Settings For Genos?
...............

Unfortunately, I cannot help you much. My settings EQ and Comp are in the pictures but I doubt it will suit you. On my PA system it just works great (EQ on MIXER is flat) and I have nothing else to add. I'm sorry you're not happy, but as I said, maybe the cause of the problem should be sought somewhere else, not Genos. Maybe ... I'm just guessing.

@soundphase, @pjd 
The Variation effect can be set as an Insert (affects only one channel in the Style) or as a System (affects on all channels). Variation effect can be accurately adjusted in the Style Editor for each drum element.
Abby has mentioned somewhere in the forum that Rock'nRoll rhythms have no power as with Tyros 3. I've shown on the video that in a couple of moves we can adjust every rhythm to one's own taste. And of course, how to add the Compressor as a Variation Effect. Such a procedure will rarely result in some improvement and I do not do that either. This is just for video needs.

https://youtu.be/5gVKZ_AS3Vk (https://youtu.be/5gVKZ_AS3Vk)

ckobu
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: Pianoman on July 24, 2019, 10:48:25 AM
Thank you everyone for the prompt responses, much appreciated.
I will try the various suggestions advised here and report on results in a few days.

I have the Genos and all my gear in the car today, as I have to go and perform in a few
hours from now.

I have the day off tomorrow, and will dedicate it to trying out the various solutions
proposed here.

Great forum and great people.

Best Regards.
Abby.
Title: Re: Genos 1.4 - Thank you Yamaha
Post by: soundphase on July 24, 2019, 06:51:55 PM

@soundphase, @pjd 
The Variation effect can be set as an Insert (affects only one channel in the Style) or as a System (affects on all channels

ckobu
Very interesting for Abby with System choice and legacy compressor choice. Abby, you would certainly have to use one user effect slot to store the parameter effect values that suit the best with your own requirements in ordre to recall them easily for all your registrations and parts.