PSR Tutorial Forum
Genos (12 Boards) => Genos - General => Topic started by: Grayfox on March 18, 2018, 08:34:02 PM
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Please have a listen to this song. Around bar 13/14 when switching back to just flute and piano there is a little glitch which is really annoying me.
The only way I can get rid of it is to pause till the previous registration has died away, which spoils the flow. It could be edited out in the recording but doesn’t help me when playing live.
Has anyone else had this problem with Genos?
Graham
This https://soundcloud.com/user-583491683/the-rose-played-on-yamaha-genos
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Please have a listen to this song. Around bar 13/14 when switching back to just flute and piano there is a little glitch which is really annoying me.
The only way I can get rid of it is to pause till the previous registration has died away, which spoils the flow. It could be edited out in the recording but doesn’t help me when playing live.
Has anyone else had this problem with Genos?
Graham
This https://soundcloud.com/user-583491683/the-rose-played-on-yamaha-genos
Yes, it is known this fact and has been discussed.
That's about SSS - Smooth Sound Switching (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,43295.msg342069.html) ...
Regards,
Vali
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Please have a listen to this song. Around bar 13/14 when switching back to just flute and piano there is a little glitch which is really annoying me.
The only way I can get rid of it is to pause till the previous registration has died away, which spoils the flow. It could be edited out in the recording but doesn’t help me when playing live.
Has anyone else had this problem with Genos?
This has been a problem with Yamaha keyboards every since DSPs were introduced. In the future, if you want the problem truly fixed, look for a keyboard with a Seamless Sound Switching feature.
For a Genos, your options are:
1. Take your hands off the keyboard when switching sounds (yes, I know this isn't always practical).
2. Don't use DSPs with your voices.
3. If you're switching between single voices, then have one voice in Right1 and the next in Right2. It's when you switch in the same position (Right1, for example) with a different DSP that causes the problem. If you're switching from one voice to two (or two to one), again, use different Right positions.
Hope this helps,
Fred
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Thankyou, Fred and Vali for all your help. I understand it better now.
Regards
Graham
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Don't know what's so hard about putting this problem right. My Technics and Rolands did seamless sound switching 15 years ago.
I do love my Genos but this is a pain in the butt and always has been with Yamaha.
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For me, this has never been a problem - just something I quickly learned to avoid by merely lifting my fingers off the keys before selecting the next right hand voice. Not a big deal!
Gary 8)
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For me, this has never been a problem - just something I quickly learned to avoid by merely lifting my fingers off the keys before selecting the next right hand voice. Not a big deal!
Gary 8)
Hello Gary.
I don't understand. In a lot of music, a sound should continue to be heard, until the next notes.
It is not always possible to stop the right hand notes at the end of a bar, change the registration enough quickly for the next right hand notes on the next bar,... and, so, for the rendition to be correctly played.
As it consumes a lot of CPU power, I think the Montage wouldn't implement it, if it was so easy to avoid this "dirty" consequence.
Regards
Soundphase
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Quite often, on my Korg PA4X, I hold a note or two, change the sound and play the new sounds while still playing the original ones. It works great when using the Keysets (OTS), but when changing from the sound menu, the effects will sound different if the settings are different.
Doesn't work on my PSR S970, and that's too bad. I'm sure it could be remedied.
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Hello friends! I also have this problem on my S970. Even if I am careful to lift my hands off the keys, the glitch comes. I also get glitches in MIDI recordings sometimes, even if I don't hear anything wrong while playing. But when I play back the recording, there is the offending glitch. Grrr! Conclusion: The keyboard is not perfect. Neither am I! But, if it is possible to have seamless sound switch, why, oh why didn't Yamaha give it to us! These keyboards are really, really expensive, and many of us use them to earn a living! Another thing; I didn't have this problem so often on my old 2100.
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I agree that a sound should be heard until you hit the next note, however, I never found a need to have a piano sound continuing into the growl sax I just selected. And I surely wouldn't want my growl sax to roll into my strings, etc... So, for me, it's a non problem because I must lift my fingers off the keys in order to select another registration, or voice from my custom voice file. As soon as I lift that hand off the keys to press that button, the problem becomes non-existent. I guess it's all in how you play the keyboard and go through the features during a liver performance.
Good luck,
Gary 8)
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Hello friends! I also have this problem on my S970. Even if I am careful to lift my hands off the keys, the glitch comes. I also get glitches in MIDI recordings sometimes, even if I don't hear anything wrong while playing. But when I play back the recording, there is the offending glitch. Grrr! Conclusion: The keyboard is not perfect. Neither am I! But, if it is possible to have seamless sound switch, why, oh why didn't Yamaha give it to us! These keyboards are really, really expensive, and many of us use them to earn a living! Another thing; I didn't have this problem so often on my old 2100.
The reason you didn't have a problem on the 2100 is you didn't have DSPs.
While there is a solution, and it's been implemented on other keyboards, it involves doubling the number of midi channels. So one channel can finish a sound while another starts up a new sound. Or, they can halve the number of channels available for use, so instead of 32 channels being available, only 16 are, as the other 16 are needed to implement SSS.
While easy to say, doubling the number of channels is not easy to implement. And halving them is not well received by users.
Fred
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This problem can occur when using synth type sounds or those that have sustain on them. The volume they are set to also has a bearing on the problem. Care is needed when setting these to registrations. If you have a sustain voice set to right one at 127 and then a piano set to right one in the next registration at 70 volume then as you change over the loudest sustained voice in reg one to the piano, which now will be a lower volume. The loudest sustained voice will bleed over. This can be avoided if you set your registrations up to allow for this volume wise and always lift your finger of the note before changing.
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Guess it all comes down to practice😀
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Yes, it is known this fact and has been discussed.
That's about SSS - Smooth Sound Switching (https://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,43295.msg342069.html) ...
Regards,
Vali
If yamaha has the claimed overcapacity in the processing part...
It could be implemented for the 4 keyboard voices...
By adding 4 hidden channels, with their own dsp ...
The question remains...
Has Yamaha enough reason to develop this tech for the Genos(its allready in montage)
Or will we have to wait till Genos2
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This could possibly be solved with a software update - I guess you guys should contact Yamaha directly.
Gary
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I agree that a sound should be heard until you hit the next note, however, I never found a need to have a piano sound continuing into the growl sax I just selected. And I surely wouldn't want my growl sax to roll into my strings, etc... So, for me, it's a non problem because I must lift my fingers off the keys in order to select another registration, or voice from my custom voice file. As soon as I lift that hand off the keys to press that button, the problem becomes non-existent. I guess it's all in how you play the keyboard and go through the features during a liver performance.
Good luck,
Gary 8)
Gary, on the occasion when I do this, it is usually at the end of the song. I almost always use short ending and adlib over it. It adds to realism to play a few, for example, piano notes, hold them as they decay, and add a sax or organ riff as the ending runs out.
This certainly isn't an essential thing, but nice to have if needed.
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It's not a problem with Genos, it's a limitation of MIDI. I'm sure there is a way to eliminate the problem by adding a second MIDI Bus, thereby allowing the DSP to complete its algorithm or sustain. It shouldn't be too difficult to fix.
Joe H