Topic: Adding a Monitor to psr E425 for live performance

[Zundap]

Hi everyone. I play my E425 in the company of 2 singers ( one of which also plays a 12 string ). When the 2 lads are singing/playing I find it hard to hear my keyboard. I could boost the keyboard volume but then I overshadow the singers/guitar. Ideally I'd like a monitor facing toward me so I can hear myself play and at the same time hear what the other 2 lads are singing/playing. I get the sense the built in speakers of E425 are naturally pushing sound out to the audience so some small speaker/amp facing back at me is what might be a solution. Has anyone any ideas on this ? I'm a novice in the world of PA/Amps/monitors and therefore would welcome any suggestions. Thank you as Always. Kev

[Lefty]

Hi Kev,


I use In Ear Monitors (IEM).  They reduce stage volume by over 20db, and let me set the volume of my guitar and vocals myself for my IEM.  They aren't inexpensive, but protect your hearing, as well as allowing you to control what you hear.  Monitors add to stage volume, and affect other band members.  Unless you have a sound man, they also make it difficult for band member running the mixer.


Craig

[Zundap]

Thank you Craig. I hadn't thought of them. I will check them out.
Kev

[pjd]

Hi Kev --

Naturally, you have some idea about the amount of volume needed, size, weight, cost, etc. Plus, will you ever want the ability to send sound out to an audience. In that case, what size room?

When I need just a little sound to my own ears (in a semi-acoustic situation with the church PA), I use either a BOSE Soundlink Color II or a Yamaha Stagepas 100BTR. Both are battery-powered. Both are pretty clean at low to moderate volume. Neither one has enough output for a hall or big room.

The Soundlink is ultra small, light and inexpensive. I usually have it right next to me and it's just enough to hear myself above acoustic piano, guitar and drums. The church PA does the real work in the hall. Due to my playing position and acoustics, I don't get much sound from the hall itself, so I need a little more "me".

Hope these idea help -- pj

[Zundap]

Thanks PJ. As we are only beginners keeping cost within reason is a good point. A little more "me" is what I need just for the moment.The 2 lads were miked up last night. The 12 string was also through a Laney 80w. (Along with the Mike's.) Not ideal. I just relied on the E425 speakers. It wasn't a paid gig but one likes to be the best they can at all performances. Alas at times I couldn't hear myself over the 2 lads, hence the need of a monitor. I'll check your own and Craig's suggestions and as always Thank you for taking the time to send me some suggestions. Kev

[BogdanH]

hello Zundap,
My opinion based on how you described setup of your band.
Two other members are hooked onto 80w amp and you're having only 2x12W from keyboard, where loudspeakers are facing upwards (slightly toward you actually) and you still can't hear your keyboard. That's to be expected considering the power difference and speakers position. Now I can only imagine how much audience can hear your keyboard... I would say very little (if at all).
I can understand that the money is the issue (it always is). But if you plan to make live gigs, then you should definitely consider buying some PA speaker. In my opinion, some small monitor facing toward you is not a solution.

Bogdan

[Zundap]

Thank you Bogdan. Yeah, I think I was very much in the background; to say the least. When you say a PA; do you mean for the 2 Mike's + 1 acoustic (plugged into it) + keys all to go through that via mixer and then me to use a bigger monitor for myself?. Kev.

[mikf]

Actually Bogdan, the the audience probably hear plenty keyboard volume because he is playing through the band sound system. His problem is that he cannot hear himself so he wants a monitor. But actually in a band, a separate instrument monitor is not a great idea either, because you don’t want to just hear your keyboard - you want to  hear it in the mix.
So the real solution is a monitor or set of monitors tapped out of the main sound system. We all used floor mounted wedge monitors facing backwards for this in the past, but the in-ear monitors are the modern solution. Better for your hearing, can be individually adjusted, and very neat. Of course there is a cost, but wedge monitors with separate mixer were not cheap either.
The problem with every band though is that everyone wants to hear themself better, so they turn up the volume, then the next person does the same, and before you know it the audience is being blasted. That’s why many bands use a sound person out in the audience to keep it all balanced. Nowadays the whole band sound can be controlled wirelessly by someone walking round the room on an iPad app. Fantastic.
Mike

[BogdanH]

Actually Bogdan, the the audience probably hear plenty keyboard volume because he is playing through the band sound system.
...

Ah, I guess I've misunderstood Zundap... thank you for clarifying.

Bogdan

[Zundap]

Actually Mike & Bogdan you are both right. My com's are probably lacking. 
I was actually relying on my keys built in speakers.....bit daft really, in hind sight. Anyhow it's all a learning curve at this point. Mike's point of "all band members jacking up the volume to hear themselves is so true. As a teenager (drummer), I'd to compete with bass, keys and fender strat each with their own Marshal Stack.(1980). At times I was hitting the snare and literally couldn't hear the'report'. Mad days.
Bottom line is I gotta sort out decent PA for 2 x mike's, 1 acoustic plugged in and keys plugged in. And IEM's when cash permits. Thank you both for your support....its very encouraging.

[Lefty]

Actually Bogdan, the the audience probably hear plenty keyboard volume because he is playing through the band sound system. His problem is that he cannot hear himself so he wants a monitor. But actually in a band, a separate instrument monitor is not a great idea either, because you don’t want to just hear your keyboard - you want to  hear it in the mix.

Hi Mike,


Don't forget all the feedback problems when you have all those individually controlled monitors on stage with the microphones.  Feedback is pretty much gone when you use IEM's.


Our Trio's stage volume averaged in the high nineties when we used stage monitors.  Now, it's in the upper seventies to low eighties, depending on the venue.  The in ear monitors we use block much of the stage sound that gets to your ears, down about 24db.  So each band member really does control the volume their ears are subjected to night after night. Hearing damage is cumulative.  I guard my hearing carefully.


OK, I'm off the soapbox now.  Go back about your business.....
   Craig

[mikf]

Yes, feedback from monitors is another issue solved by IEMs.
Mike