Author Topic: Vce files  (Read 3231 times)

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Offline djp

Vce files
« on: November 24, 2020, 01:14:40 PM »
I have a large amount of vce files for my genos that load but dont work is there a tool to adapt voices . This is also true of some non locked Yem packs you try to extract them and nothing is this something im doing wrong
 

Offline overover

Re: Vce files
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2020, 01:28:07 PM »
Hi djp,

.vce files are just so called "Voice Set" files (also known as "User Voice" files). Such a (very small) file is created if you copy or save a Preset Voice or an installed Expansion Voice using within the Voice Selection display of the keyboard.

The "Voice" files in the individual subfolders of the Expansion folder are also such .vce files, and you can also create .vce files of Voices of Expansion Packs using the "Style Extractor" or the "YEM-CE" (YEM Content Explorer) program.

BUT: .vce files that are made from Expansion Pack Voices will only work if the corresponding Expansion Pack is INSTALLED properly. And .vce files that are made from Preset Voices will only work if the original Voice is present on the keyboard used.


P.S.
Voice Set files (User Voice files) can have different file extensions (depending on the Voice type of the original Voice):

.vce = Regular
.liv = Live!
.clv = Cool!
.swv = Sweet!
.nlv = S.Art! (e.g. on Tyros5)
.sar = S.Art!
.sa2 = S.Art2!

.mgv = MegaVoice
.org = Organ Flutes

.drm = Drums
.ldr = Live!Drums
.sfx = SFX
.lsf = Live!SFX


Best regards,
Chris
« Last Edit: November 24, 2020, 01:36:50 PM by overover »
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 

Offline DerekA

Re: Vce files
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2020, 03:23:24 PM »
A vce file contains the *name* of a sample waveform, and a bunch of instructions on how to shape that waveform into a nice sound.

The named waveform must be present in either the present wave memory chip, or the expansion wave memory chip.

If it isn't - the vce doesn't do anything.

[OK it might store something like a UUID for the wave. But the idea's the same.]

Offline overover

Re: Vce files
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2020, 04:37:19 PM »
A vce file contains the *name* of a sample waveform, and a bunch of instructions on how to shape that waveform into a nice sound.

The named waveform must be present in either the present wave memory chip, or the expansion wave memory chip.

If it isn't - the vce doesn't do anything.

[OK it might store something like a UUID for the wave. But the idea's the same.]

Hi Derek,

in my opinion this is not entirely correct: ;)

A .vce file is basically a MIDI file. It contains the Voice Address (Bank Select MSB + LSB + Program Change) of the underlying Voice. So it refers to a certain (Preset or Expansion) VOICE, not to a certain Sample / Waveform. (A Voice can contain up to 8 "Elements" (sometimes also called "Layers"), and each "Element" of a Voice can use many different Samples.)


Best regards,
Chris
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 

Offline EileenL

Re: Vce files
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2020, 10:38:56 PM »
All these type of voices just contain the effects you have used to tweak a voice which you link to the voices on your keyboard. If these voices are removed then these files are of no use to you as they do not contain the sound.

Offline fantomx2019

Re: Vce files
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2021, 05:37:37 PM »
All these type of voices just contain the effects you have used to tweak a voice which you link to the voices on your keyboard. If these voices are removed then these files are of no use to you as they do not contain the sound.

Sorry to disagree...
But the vce could be a fantastic way to make other voice presets.
Like, having a preset made from another yamaha keyboard, let's say a PSR 900, and those tweeks to be used with other elements , from Genos let's say, and make a new preset, that sounds different as waveform but with the same envelope, LFO, settings .

Anyway, it is not posibble, even from the same keyboard to load a .vce file in a pack, wich is pity.
Not to mention that the inside keyboard editor is a joke.

My worst frustration, is the Audio Phrazer wich has a lot of bugs, and not a single update after the first release.
Such a great potential wasted.
The Audio Styles could made those Genos, PSR X series a lot better.
Could made them the best.
But having those error on detecting the right tempo, is making the audio style phrazer useless.
After using 4 type of daws, all detecting and exporting the same lenght of a wave, and all giving errors on Audio Phrazer editor, convince me that the problem is in Audio Phrazer, not the wav file.

But, returning to the subject, a lot of new presets could be made if ether the internal voice editor could be advanced, copying the settings in YEM, or, importing in YEM presets like .vce or .liv , .sa2 , etc.
None of the presets or even user voice , have more the ADSR , CutOff/REsonance showed in the internal editor.
You can't see the LFO, the Elements, nothing important.
Wich is a waste of potential.
 

Offline mikf

Re: Vce files
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2021, 07:47:50 PM »
Fantomx - You are correct, all that may be possible... but the vast majority of arranger buyers are not too interested in that kind of stuff, so it is  likely is very low priority for Yamaha. They have many other keyboards in their range which might be more aimed at this level of sound control.
 

Offline overover

Re: Vce files
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2021, 09:46:46 PM »
... the vce could be a fantastic way to make other voice presets[.
Like, having a preset made from another yamaha keyboard, let's say a PSR 900, and those tweeks to be used with other elements , from Genos let's say, and make a new preset, that sounds different as waveform but with the same envelope, LFO, settings. ...

Hi fantomx2019,

as already mentioned in another "VCE file" thread, unfortunately it is not possible to import vce files into the YEM or to apply the Voice Settings of vce files to Expansion Voices directly in the YEM.

But on the keyboard it is already possible to apply the Voice Settings of a currently loaded Voice (no matter whether loaded directly or via a User Voice file) to another Voice:

- Load the Voice from which you want to take over the Voice Settings (e.g. in Right1 Part).

- On Genos, call up "Voice Setting > Voice Set Filter".

- Remove the desired checkmarks (e.g. Voice, Effect and EQ) for the correct Part.

- When you load another Voice in that Part, the Voice Settings of the first Voice (depending on which checkmarks you removed in the previous step) are retained.

- If necessary, you can now edit the Voice further, and if you like it, you can save it in the Voice Setting as a new User Voice file.

- Then you should check all the boxes again in the Voice Set Filter so that further Voices can be loaded normally again (with their "correct" Voice Set).


Another method is using the "MixMaster" PC (Windows) program:
>>> https://psrtutorial.com/MB/mixMaster.html

- Start MixMaster and load a User Voice file (e.g. .vce).

- Click on the "List View" symbol.

- On Genos you can find out the Voice Address (MSB-LSB-PRG) of the target Voice (to which you want to apply the Voice Set of the vce file currently loaded in MixMaster).

- Change Bank Select MSB, LSB and Program Change of the vce file to the desired new values.

- NOTE: Yamaha Program numbers (PRG) are counted "001 - 128" while MIDI Program Change numbers (PC) are counted "0 - 127". To get the correct MIDI Program Change number (for entering in MixMaster), you have to calculate "Yamaha Program number minus 1".

- Save the vce file using a new or changed filename to prevent the source file from overwriting.


Please see also the attached pictures.


Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Chris
« Last Edit: April 30, 2021, 10:01:03 PM by overover »
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 
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Offline Luluc

Re: Vce files
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2021, 05:10:27 PM »
Sometimes, VCE files are labelled with a number.

Examples : Accordion 494 - Accordion 549 S7 - Accordion 621 - Accordion 508 - ...

What does that stand for ?
Luluc
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Yamaha Genos - Focusrite Scarlett 8i6 - Behringer FCB1010 - AKG K92
 

Offline overover

Re: Vce files
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2021, 05:52:21 PM »
Sometimes, VCE files are labelled with a number.

Examples : Accordion 494 - Accordion 549 S7 - Accordion 621 - Accordion 508 - ...

What does that stand for ?

Hi Luluc,

do you mean filenames like "accordion.S456.vce" or accordion.T678.vce"?

These code (.S or .T, followed by a 3-digit number) is the so-called "icon ID" which defines the icon displayed on the keyboard.

Otherwise I don't know what the numbers in filenames of accordion Voices you specified could mean.


Best regards,
Chris
« Last Edit: May 02, 2021, 05:53:59 PM by overover »
Everyone always said: "This is not possible!" - Then someone came and ... just did it!
 

Offline Luluc

Re: Vce files
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2021, 03:54:03 PM »
The full name of the voices in question are : Accordion 494.vce or Accordion 549 S7.vce. It could be also Analogbas 494.vce, not only accordion.

Most of HenniVoices2015 are labelled this way.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2021, 01:31:02 PM by Luluc »
Luluc
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Yamaha Genos - Focusrite Scarlett 8i6 - Behringer FCB1010 - AKG K92