Author Topic: Yamaha's support for the Genos  (Read 4109 times)

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Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #50 on: January 05, 2018, 04:44:29 PM »
Peter,

I think in-depth editing would require computer-based software.  And since there is third-party software (free and commercial) could be that there is no incentive for Yamaha to produce any of its own.

Joe H

OMG, Yamaha is now following the Microsoft business model....we're all doomed........... :o!!
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #51 on: January 05, 2018, 04:54:17 PM »


Joe,

I'm not talking about in-dept editing. I'm talking about features that are are there and promoted by Yamaha in several demo's but never explained any further than a simple "it's there and it works":)  Now with Yem ... Incredibly complex if you want to use the voice creator and not even a single chapter handing a neat example. Not even a 10 line guide for dummies :)

Don't get me wrong, I understand that such info is valuable and needs a market. But why build it in if you don't have at least a starters guide? It will only raises eyebrows to say the least when people are checking all buttons or options in the menu ;) I know for one that mine raised wondering how I could use those to bide some time using them to my advantage. I ended up biding time wondering how in the world I could get them to work :D

regards,

Peter
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #52 on: January 05, 2018, 05:26:59 PM »
Besides,

that 3rd party computer based software and I name a few that I came across: Mixmaster, Style Magic, YRM and Josoft software (sorry if I forgot a few) How many of these people trying to help by providing the 3rd party software that can overcome some of the difficulties trying to enhance our keyboard's tougher to understand features were give a carrot so to speak?  Mostly these people are doing that in their free time. To my knowledge they never had any help with for example some data updates to assure they can continue filling a few gaps?

I don't see  a younger generation yet with a follow up (uh, could be me ofc 8) ). Not trying to be disrespectful but these people are trying to keep up by updating after each new model are having quite a hard time doing so. The least Yamaha imo could do is to be a little more helpful to these people. That is if they think they are serving a purpose.

I've read a topic lately where Yamaha support told someone to post his ideas here since they were legally obliged to refuse sending any customer's ideas/suggestions to their TD? I think I do understand why. But telling the customer they had people reading up on posts on this forum? That gives me reason to think they do find this forum useful. In that case and if true i'd say quid pro quo or perhaps more to the point: Help another to help yourself :)

regards,
Peter
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 05:39:20 PM by XeeniX »
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #53 on: January 05, 2018, 06:24:07 PM »
... I've read a topic lately where Yamaha support told someone to post his ideas here since they were legally obliged to refuse sending any customer's ideas/suggestions to their TD? I think I do understand why. But telling the customer they had people reading up on posts on this forum? That gives me reason to think they do find this forum useful. In that case and if true i'd say quid pro quo or perhaps more to the point: Help another to help yourself :)

regards,
Peter

Peter,

I'm the person Yamaha Support told they could no longer accept ideas for upgrades because of "legal issues", and I should post on this forum... even provided me a link to this forum. And told me that marketing managers monitor this forum.

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #54 on: January 05, 2018, 06:37:41 PM »
Joe,

Please accept my apologies, now that you mention it I remember it was you. Silly me was more focused on the Yamaha reply than on the poster. Not my intention but it seems I couldn't help it :) Still, it leaves a certain feeling that they replied the way they did dont you think?

kind regards,
Peter
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #55 on: January 05, 2018, 06:40:00 PM »
Peter,

With all the crazy talk lately... You are forgiven!

 :)

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #56 on: January 05, 2018, 07:58:34 PM »
Peter, first and foremost, I learned to use both the style creator and voice creator when I purchased my PSR-2000 many, many years ago. All of that information was in the user manual. I sat down at the keyboard with that manual at my side and created my first style, which, BTW, was absolutely horrible. I eventually got better at it, but it took months of practice with that feature to get something acceptable. The same holds true with the voice creator, and I have shared several of those voices on this site.

For step by step, I have written several step by step instructions and posted them on this forum. I did one for registrations that has been downloaded many, many times. Fred did a video about the same subject sometime later. I learned those things from the user manuals - not from any other source.

The pioneers on this forum have posted hundreds upon hundreds of instructions showing members how to do things. Keep in mind, though, we learned all this by gleaning through the manuals.

Not only did I do this with several Yamaha Arranger Keyboards that I owned, but I also did it with some I didn't own so I could provide assistance to those on the forum that had those keyboards and were not able to find solutions to their problems. I also poured through the pages of user manuals for the Korg M1, Roland G-800, and a few lesser known boards that I owned. As a working musician, who made his entire income from performing on stage every day of the week, I needed to know how to do these things in order to get the most out of my keyboards, thereby providing my audiences with the best entertainment I could possibly provide. To me, this was one of the most important aspects of being an entertainer/musician/singer. All that information made me one of the most successful entertainers in my area for more than 3 decades. And, the locals around my part of the world frequently called me "The Professor" because I was able to solve their arranger keyboard problems often with just a short telephone call. I thought that moniker was very flattering. :)

Over the years, I have always strived to provide as much detail as possible when answering questions about a particular problem that a person may have encountered. Most of the time, I no longer have to crack open the user manual to make sure the information I provide is correct, but there are times that I still must do exactly that. As I pointed out earlier, some folks seemed to a bit put off that I would provide them chapter and verse, including the page numbers in the owner's manual. Most, were just happy to have their problem solved.

Keep in mind there are usually two manuals that come with every keyboard, the user manual and the reference manual. Both are kinda intertwined, especially when the problems encountered are a bit complex. Now, if you cannot find it in the manuals, then you have two options - ask the question here, or beat your head against the wall trying to figure it out on your own. I have the lumps to prove how many times I have used option #2. ;)

Good Luck,

Gary 8)
 
Love Those Yammies...
 

Offline frankmusik

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #57 on: January 05, 2018, 08:20:22 PM »
Nice to read all the different thoughts and request.
Almost everybody has other needs...

I think for genos there will more support videos stuff manuals ... than for every other keyboard ever...
And because of using in more professional use a lot of freaks will find cool things :-)

In german almost 3 hours Video are ready
https://www.keyboard-akademie.de/produkt/genos-das-grosse-training/

The first book from manni pichler and roman sterzik
https://www.facebook.com/keysexperts/

Nothing from yamaha !---but freelancer working also for yamaha...

The problem is no international yamaha freelancer thought of earning money with things like books, videos, Regs, styles ....
All of the Germans do! Heidrun Dolde, manni pichler, Dennis regender, Thoralf Abgarjan, roman sterzik....

Greetings from Germany
Frank .... never forget the premiere of tyros one ... dr.jeromin started :"tyros will change the Keyboard market" and now in Berlin with genos it goes on... not the instrument for everyone but a lot!
Genos and Tyros Support in Germany - Europe with more than
160 keyboardscouts helping in D-AT-CH-NL at home!
 

Offline Joe H

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #58 on: January 05, 2018, 09:56:52 PM »
I sincerely hope that the programmers on this forum are not offended by the discussion of wanting more support from Yamaha. Without all the free software they have created and offered we would have NOTHING... no tools at all without their unselfish labors.  The "added value" of having these free tools cannot be measured in $$$.

Every time I used one of these tools I am so grateful that they are available. Without them I would be so frustrated because I would not be able to express my creativity and accomplish the things I want to do.  I most likely would have sold my arranger and went for a synth years ago. But the arranger has so much potential for creating original music.

With all this talk about Yamaha... I just wanted to say THANK YOU to the programmers who are part of this forum.  Where would we be without your contributions?

 :)    :)    :)    :)    :)

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 
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Offline Jørgen

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #59 on: January 05, 2018, 11:21:07 PM »
Hi Joe

Not at all offended. On the contrary. And thanks for the nice words to me and other leisure programmers. We can also use more help from Yamaha.
For our programs, we need to use a lot of data. Something can be cut and paste from the pdf data lists. But in many cases we need data that is not public at all.
So, with the help of volunteers, we make sample files. And from these, extract the data we need. Maybe you should even write a program for this extraction too ...
For more than 18 years, I have spent over 1,000 hours each and every year developing and maintaining my programs. Some years even well over 1,000 hours.
So some more help from Yamaha is desirable. Both to those who play the keyboard and to us, who need more data than there are in the manuals today.

Regards
Jørgen
The Unofficial YAMAHA Keyboard Resource Site at http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha
- since 1999
 

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #60 on: January 06, 2018, 12:25:27 AM »
Failing a Yamaha supported forum, how about providing some workshops and video tutorials that would cover in detail some of the more complex and powerful arranger features. All we get from Yamaha are demonstrations, most of which aren't even presented in English. Pretty disappointing once you see what Yamaha offers to their synth owners. Scratching my head over this.

this will not happen, 3rd parties are covering this now for a fee.
 

Offline Wim NL

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #61 on: January 06, 2018, 12:53:41 AM »
@Jørgen

Thanks for all your support.
I have sorted out now all Multi Pads from Genos intern styles.
see http://www.psrtutorial.com/forum/index.php/topic,42259.0.html
Best Regards,
Wim
 

Offline panos

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #62 on: January 06, 2018, 04:01:29 AM »
Quote
If you tell us you guess, so you didn't even search in manual for some info. This is not a good approach.
Didn't have to cause I don't own a Genos.Psr is satisfying my needs.

All I am saying is that I don't see videos on youtube of people playing songs using all the new features that Genos has and have demostrated from professional piano players.
And i wonder why is that happening?
Is the keyboard "friendly" for the users to use all those new features like arpeggios etc. while playing live or is it difficult so they just use the Main buttons to play the Rocky and Game of thrones themes? (which are superb styles).
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #63 on: January 06, 2018, 05:35:34 AM »
Gary,
The information I seek is not in any of those two, nor the lesson chapters or even the faq page. Like you I read up on those manuals. Not to know then by heart but to get unstuck when stuck :) Before spamming the more knowledgeable people on this forum with questions before I even realize that I have them, I would like to find articles, tutorials, books (and paying for them if they are not free like the lesson chapter here) on more advanced things that are not in these two manuals, the data list (used that one for my drum re-mapping experiment lately ;) ) or for example the YEM manual. Its more advanced options are only mentioned in the YEM manual but not explained.

Frank,
Thanks for mentioning those names and links! I know Heidrun's continuos work on you tube and her website and even bought some of her work :) registrations and teh creation of those more advanced ones however are no longer a mystery. I couldn't recall the name of the German guy anymore that made a dvd about wave samplig. A bonus dvd I receibed buying the T4. It went along with the T4 sadly enough when I sold it. I will check those links and names out and will try to find out if they are what I am looking for or if these people sell the more advanced stuff that goes a little deeper than just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to options in YEM like voice creation.

kind regards,
Peter
« Last Edit: January 06, 2018, 05:37:30 AM by XeeniX »
 

Offline StuartR

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #64 on: January 06, 2018, 05:43:04 AM »
this will not happen, 3rd parties are covering this now for a fee.

Care to share any specific 3rd parties that are providing this service for Yamaha arrangers? I've got my checkbook ready!
 

Offline travlin-easy

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #65 on: January 06, 2018, 08:09:19 AM »
Stuart, just make that check out to the PSR-Tutorial.com. This is one of the best third party support teams available on the internet for Yamaha Arranger Keyboards.

Gary  8)
Love Those Yammies...
 
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Jean Abdou

  • Guest
Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #66 on: January 06, 2018, 12:49:13 PM »
Well I respectfully disagree with most of you have said.  I think the arranger keyboard is superior to Yamaha synths for creating music from scratch and/or arranging... it is easier to do because of the architecture.

As far as Phil goes... I have had a totally different experience with him and his "Power User" guides are rather simplistic to say the least.

Joe H

I am sorry but as far as I know, Yamaha arrangers do not have a fully fledged sequencer like the one in MOTIF series, so I can not give your statement a credit. The menus in the expansion manager is ~50-40% simpler than what you have in MOTIF series. I assume the same applies to the sequencers.

The existence of a sequencer is not crucial, and I prefer a tight integration with DAW far more as it is more versatile, user friendlier and faster to work with.

About Phil I am not saying he is a saint or an angle, but I learned how to operate my keyboard with his simple guides. We look at the problem from two different angles. I found it much easier to develop from simplicity to complexity.

Yamaha is slow in adding feature to its products. Most of the new additions you see in Genos have been available in Garageband and MainStage for years. I believe Yamaha can do much better by copying what Casio did!
 

Offline StuartR

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #67 on: January 06, 2018, 12:59:13 PM »
Stuart, just make that check out to the PSR-Tutorial.com. This is one of the best third party support teams available on the internet for Yamaha Arranger Keyboards.

Gary  8)

When I joined several years ago I became a supporting member by ordering the complete collection of styles and midi files on USB. All well and good. Now I'm ready to support some advanced video workshops for Genos.
 

Offline XeeniX

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #68 on: January 06, 2018, 01:21:38 PM »
Found the company that provided in-dept dvd tutorials.
www.keyboard-seminare.de

Thanks again Frank for mentioning those names and thanks Al Ram for bringing this website up in another thread. I'm not sure ofc but I think given time this company should be able to fill a gap for Genos owners and the Genos specific technology as well.

me one happy camper now and off to buy the ones that interest me.. The two dvd's for T4 I had before giving them away were absolutely worth their money (for me that is).

kind regards,
Peter
 

Offline Lee Batchelor

Re: Yamaha's support for the Genos
« Reply #69 on: January 06, 2018, 03:15:10 PM »
Quote
The existence of a sequencer is not crucial, and I prefer a tight integration with DAW far more as it is more versatile, user friendlier and faster to work with.

AGREED!!!!!!! I'm versed in DAW applications. To date though, I have yet to figure out how to get a DAW to play nice with ANY Tyros keyboard!!! Either I'm stupid or Yamaha makes it possible for only the top 1 percent of people to figure out how the hell to integrate their arranger keyboards with a DAW. I'm still in the dark. Yamaha needs to give us a user friendly DAW that works, so we can create our own tunes and styles for the Tyros/Genos. They don't seem to give a damn about anyone other than the genius level user, and yet, we all pay the same price for our keyboards  >:(.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2018, 03:17:48 PM by Lee Batchelor »
Current Gear: Genos, SoundCraft mixer, two Bose L1 Compacts, 15 inch sub designed and built by myself, Yamaha HS8 studio monitors, Cubase 8 Artist, Steinberg UR-44.