Author Topic: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!  (Read 13755 times)

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Offline Fred Smith

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #50 on: February 20, 2017, 12:25:50 PM »
Which they will probably do starting with the Genos.. doesnt cost much to implement these kinds of features they allready developed..  and it indeed would add something for everyone

Well, not everyone. It wouldn't do anything for those of us who never use the feature.

Fred
Fred Smith,
Saskatoon, SK
Sun Lakes, AZ
Tyros 4, Bose L1, Finale 2011
Check out my Registration Lessons
 

Online metcam

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #51 on: February 20, 2017, 12:32:35 PM »
Well, not everyone. It wouldn't do anything for those of us who never use the feature.

Fred

Which there is some futures  You use and we use never.

That why  Yamaha is GLOBE company not just for individuals or small groups.

Regards
Curent Instruments: Tyros5-61,,,PSR-A3000
Previus instruments:PSR9000,Tyros2,Tyros3,psr2000,psr2100,psr1500,psr530,psr OR700,DX7,DX11,V50,DX21.
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Offline daliboraleksov

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #52 on: February 20, 2017, 03:07:25 PM »
Hello Gary! It really is a feature that does not have much use, but in some songs can make life easier for the arranger. Listen to the introduction of this song. It is much easier to change the notes (flute) with the portamento triggered. Hug!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feBKqSnDoHg

I understand what you are saying, but I must say that I do not agree with you, sorry

I think that mono legato + (fingered) portamento OR basically having portamento GLIDE configurable is ESSENTIAL feature for ALL "balkan"-like music types.

Take a look at any of the videos from here:
https://www.youtube.com/user/juzisound/videos
or
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Eu2VRMlTdk

and you will see what I'm talking about.

For example I understand that you probably do not "understand" or "like" this type of music but trust me when I say that this feature is MANDATORY for everyone on BALKAN/ORIENTAL area.

for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U_qbepJ1LY
OR even better
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh1NqlJQcXQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyPLVvPX_z4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyidr9_KsEg

This is what I'm referring to, and until yamaha makes this happen on TYROS keyboards really small number of people in Balkan will play it. Maybe those who play "foreign" music...but for "our" national weddings etc... no go :(

ALSO, if you guys think that BALKAN is small market I must say you are sooooo wrong, but OK I understand that this is not useful for those who do not use it of course, but if they think World Wide why is this ignored in their THE BEST ARRANGERs and again is available in basically ALL yamaha workstations (non arranger keyboards)

Balkan
about 55 million people
Bulgaria, Macedonia, Serbia, Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia, Romania, Italia, Albania, Greece, Turkey, etc..
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 04:36:07 PM by daliboraleksov »
 

Offline Enildo

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #53 on: February 20, 2017, 03:42:40 PM »
I understand what you are saying, but I must say that I do not agree with you, sorry

I think that mono legato + (fingered) portamento OR basically having portamento GLIDE configurable is ESSENTIAL feature for ALL "balkan"-like music types.

Take a look at any of the videos from here:
https://www.youtube.com/user/juzisound/videos
or
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Eu2VRMlTdk

and you will see what I'm talking about.

For example I understand that you probably do not "understand" or "like" this type of music but trust me when I say that this feature is MANDATORY for everyone on BALKAN/ORIENTAL area.

for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U_qbepJ1LY
OR even better
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh1NqlJQcXQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyPLVvPX_z4

This is what I'm referring to, and until yamaha makes this happen on TYROS keyboards really small number of people in Balkan will play it. Maybe those who play "foreign" music...but for "our" national weddings etc... no go :(

ALSO, if you guys think that BALKAN is small market I must say you are sooooo wrong, but OK I understand that this is not useful for those who do not use it of course, but if they think World Wide why is this ignored in their THE BEST ARRANGERs and again is available in basically ALL yamaha workstations (non arranger keyboards)

Balkan
about 55 million people
Bulgaria, Macedonia, Serbia, Croatia, Slovenia, Bosnia, Romania, Italia, Albania, Greece, Turkey, etc..

I entirely agree Daliboraleksov. It's that in the region that I live in, the portamento is not so used. Indeed, for the examples you have shown (balkan music) is very important.
Thank you for opening my eyes.

Enildo
When word fail, Music speaks!
 

Offline daliboraleksov

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #54 on: February 20, 2017, 04:02:09 PM »
Sure no problem,

Also probably the most famous keyboard players in the world
ARE using mono legato (and/or glide portamento)

like for example:

Joe Zawinul
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WQfeplhzT4

Herbie Hancock
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIoCSkjz8aA

Jordan Rudess
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81FfFSMgc98

So just to be more clear

MONO LEGATO and glide (configurable) portamento

IS WELL USED since...well...forever... and in ALL kind of music not only Balkan but Jazz, Rock, Pop, Funk, Metal, Latino etc...you name it :)

Not having this feature in the best yamaha's arranger (tyros) is such a shame for Yamaha :(

But I hope someone from Yamaha will actually LISTEN and finally implement this!!!

The reason why I'm personally exasperated on Yamaha is because I have played more than 30 different keyboards in my life
(starting from Ensoniq, Yamaha DX/SY99, Korg T3, Roland g600/800/1000, Korg pa80/pa1/.../pa4, Tyros1/2/3/4/5 etc...) and I really admire Yamaha's SOUND engine it is probably the best and so damn good produced.
Drums, Guitars, etc...everything SOUNDS so damn good and then again it does not have mono legato and glide portamento.
So I had to bring another keyboard whole my life OR just buy a "KORG" which I personally do not like (ONLY because of its sound engine and ROM sound)

I even tried (since I'm am a software engineer too) to use MIDI and somehow intercept all MIDI messages and override them to somehow implement mono legato, but I failed since I never had so much time to work on MIDI etc... too bad :(

Another Yamaha's issue is their "editing" features.... but this is not a current topic...this deserves a separate thread :)

Anyway, I'm so sorry if I bother you guys with so many details but this is the only reasonable FORUM that I could find where I can actually say something :) Thank you for that ;)
« Last Edit: February 20, 2017, 04:27:16 PM by daliboraleksov »
 

Offline voodoo

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #55 on: February 22, 2017, 05:09:32 AM »
My best bet is that the feature will be integrated in some of the new sounds, which will sound awesome, and you will probably use those... so from this kind of features even you would benefit indirectly...

This is my bet, also. The super articulation voices have kind of mono legato already.
Yamaha PSR-S970 (sold)
Yamaha Genos (ordered)
Nord Electro 5D
 

Offline Brnjeuska74

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #56 on: April 04, 2017, 05:16:48 PM »
Some folks just get it what is missing here regarding the PORTAMENTO MONO/LEGATO on Tyros..... wav format !!!!!

Offline daliboraleksov

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #57 on: April 06, 2017, 02:38:24 PM »
I understand your pain....

Once they implement configurable glide portamento and mono legato I really EXPECT that this is going to be available for all samples including ROM and RAM...so yes, this feature MUST be available for all sounds: factory and custom/user WAVE samples.

I don't really care about the yamaha's articulation algorithms
I don't really care about their implementation of string quartet and those kind of things

But not having the configurable glide portamento and mono legato in yamaha's best arrangers???
Don't know what to say anymore really!!! Thank you
 

Online metcam

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #58 on: April 06, 2017, 03:41:21 PM »
"Brnjeuska" and "Dalibor Aleksov"

I am with you my friends.I am pretty sure Yamaha will have on Next Tyros/Genos etc.

As this moment the only Yamaha aranger which have Portamento-MONO/LEGATO for internal and external samples is PSR-A3000 and working very,very good.
Curent Instruments: Tyros5-61,,,PSR-A3000
Previus instruments:PSR9000,Tyros2,Tyros3,psr2000,psr2100,psr1500,psr530,psr OR700,DX7,DX11,V50,DX21.
KORG:pa800,KORG PA-900,Triton Extreme,Triton rack,.KORG X3,Roland G600.Roland D20.........
 

Offline Styles2psr

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #59 on: April 07, 2017, 01:24:13 AM »

It's about time to wake up Yamaha!!!!!!!!!

We really need a proper portamento/mono legato in our Yamaha arrangers, why is it so hard to make that?
The built-in feature it's a piece of crap, and also very limited.

As some of you mention, the Mono/legato feature is not only used in Balkan and Middle East Music, but in EDM Music as well.

It is very frustrating when you working with EDM styles and you're trying to create a great drop lead melody in a Intro with portamento effect,
but you can't because in Style Mode the Mono feature/button doesn't work. >:(
Instead i have to use the pitchbend to get similar effect.


Here is 2 short demos i've done, showing 1 bad portamento, and 1 proper Portamento/glide.
See attached Mp3 files.


Mono 1:
It sounds exactly like Yamahas crappy built-in feature.


Mono 2:
A perfect Portamento/legato/glide, this is what we need in our arrangers.


Perhaps in 2025 Yamaha will feature a proper portamento function. ::)


Regards, Jan.

Online metcam

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #60 on: August 03, 2017, 12:29:21 PM »



Perhaps in 2025 Yamaha will feature a proper portamento function. ::)




Perhaps in Genos  :)  :)  :)
Curent Instruments: Tyros5-61,,,PSR-A3000
Previus instruments:PSR9000,Tyros2,Tyros3,psr2000,psr2100,psr1500,psr530,psr OR700,DX7,DX11,V50,DX21.
KORG:pa800,KORG PA-900,Triton Extreme,Triton rack,.KORG X3,Roland G600.Roland D20.........
 

Online ugawoga

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #61 on: August 05, 2017, 05:00:53 PM »
Tyros 5 Portamento Is good as It gets
I can get it to sweep Like Elp and Camel
Even Chicory Tip  Son of a father

No problem

What about PFM and Celebration  and Nutbush City Limits!!!!    SWEEPY SWEEPY on the Tyros

Does not emulate Portamento In DAWS  as the zeros and ones are slightly out,so you get plain a note unless you can read and program Cal in Sonar Platinum.

"Where's my Genos"??? :P
 

Offline Marcus

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #62 on: August 08, 2017, 09:45:24 PM »
It's about time to wake up Yamaha!!!!!!!!!

We really need a proper portamento/mono legato in our Yamaha arrangers, why is it so hard to make that?
The built-in feature it's a piece of crap, and also very limited.

As some of you mention, the Mono/legato feature is not only used in Balkan and Middle East Music, but in EDM Music as well.

It is very frustrating when you working with EDM styles and you're trying to create a great drop lead melody in a Intro with portamento effect,
but you can't because in Style Mode the Mono feature/button doesn't work. >:(
Instead i have to use the pitchbend to get similar effect.


Here is 2 short demos i've done, showing 1 bad portamento, and 1 proper Portamento/glide.
See attached Mp3 files.


Mono 1:
It sounds exactly like Yamahas crappy built-in feature.


Mono 2:
A perfect Portamento/legato/glide, this is what we need in our arrangers.


Perhaps in 2025 Yamaha will feature a proper portamento function. ::)


Regards, Jan.
Hi Jan
Interesting thread about this portamento issue. I listened to your Mono 1 and Mono 2 mp3s. You definitely don't want to achieve this effect by manually using the pitch bend wheel, but you can get the approximate portamento/mono effect from your Mono 2 example by adjusting a chosen Tyros 5 voice in Voice Set and saving the edits as a user voice. While in Voice Set on the "common" tab, setting to mono with a portamento time set around 20-25 gives you the approximate portamento effect your example had. Also while in Voice Set your can also tweak the EG attack time in the "sound" tab. Any registration can now link to this user voice save with the portamento/mono effect and playable on the keyboard. I am not familiar with many voices or instruments that use this effect, but anyone can customize any Tyros 5 voice that allows this effect and save the edited voice.

I tried creating a new style in Style Creator adding the chosen edited custom voice (with the portamento/mono setting) to one of the style channels. You are correct, Style Creator ignored the mono feature and the portamento effect was not present in the style channel recording. You do make a valid point, that Yamaha could address in future keyboards and within Style Creator. The issue may already been resolved in the upcoming Genos, but we will have to wait and see.

I also went through my expansion voices and some of my own voices I made in Voice Creator and most, if not all had the mono/portamento option open in Voice Set, where one can easily make the mount of effect you want and save the user voice. I found the effect to be just as smooth as your Mono 2 example. As expected, I found none of my SA2 expansion voices allowed the mono/portamento changes in Voice Set, but practically every other expansion voice, including most SA voices allowed the editing. So maybe satisfactory results could be made to most voices presently on the Tyros 5, but as you say, not in Style mode.

I also tried my edited voice (with portamento/mono) in Multipad Creator. Same issue as Style Creator; the mono/portamento effect disappears. So perhaps if Yamaha corrects this issue to allow this effect in Style mode, with also correct the issue in Multipad mode.

Hope my 2 cents helps,
Marcus

Gear: Triangle
 

Offline Joe H

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #63 on: August 08, 2017, 11:36:06 PM »
Marcus,

The Portamento effect is implemented via the Voice Set file... which is not loaded when used in a style Part.  The .vce file is only used for R1, R2, R3 and Left.

I believe Portamento is supported in Multi Pads, but you have to Insert the messages manually.  I would have to look to see if the same applies to style Parts, since I haven't actually tried it in one of my own styles (up to this point anyway).

Joe H
Music is the Universal Language!

My Article: Using Multi Pads for EDM. Download Regs, Styles & MPs:  http://psrtutorial.com/music/articles/dancemusic.html
 

Offline SeaGtGruff

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #64 on: August 09, 2017, 12:41:09 PM »
I've come across style files that do contain Portamento Control messages. From what I've been able to gather from researching this message on the web, I believe it's used to trigger the Portamento effect regardless of whether the channel is set to Mono or Poly mode-- and apparently regardless of whether the Portamento On/Off control is turned on-- but I can't be certain about that because there seem to be so few "hard facts" written about it on the web, and so far I haven't been able to get it to work on my PSR-E models (even though Yamaha says they do respond to Portamento Control messages).

The Portamento Control message is a bit like a Note On message, in that the data is a Note value. The message would be placed just before some Note On message to effect a glide from the Note specified by the Portamento Control to the Note specified by the Note On message. IIRC, one reference said that Portamento Time is assumed to be 0 when Portamento Control is used, but that seems to make no sense. IIRC, another reference said that the rate of the glide is determined by the Portamento Time setting, which makes more sense.
Michael Rideout
YPT-400, PSR-E433, PSR-E443
 

Online soundphase

Re: PORTAMENTOO!!!!!!
« Reply #65 on: September 05, 2017, 10:31:00 AM »
A very good way to get very good portamento (Jordan Rudess's demo) on our Tyros/Genos :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P14JcRyJCEI