PSR Tutorial Forum
Genos (12 Boards) => Genos - General => Topic started by: bluali on February 10, 2018, 01:11:17 PM
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Finally I got my Genos and I did a very brief comparison with my Tyros5 Keyboard. I was surprised that the main Sounds are all the same on both keyboards. However I like the Genos design and light weight. Overall if you have Tyros5, don't rush! I could not find a big difference sound-wise. To me, Genos is like re-packaging of Tyros5 with different look and feel. I recorded my comparison with an iphone camera and shared it on YouTube ( https://youtu.be/4U8S28tz3Mg (https://youtu.be/4U8S28tz3Mg) ). I apologize for my poor English speaking. I hope the video helps.
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Added in 4/12/2018:
Genos is the best Yamaha arranger so far and Tyros5 is also very close to Genos. Obviously those who have had keyboards such as Korg, PSR series or even TY3/4, they can be very impressed by Genos (and Tyros5). As a mater of fact in main sounds such as Piano and Guitar and Violin, etc, there is not a huge differences between Genos and Tyros5. What I meant in my post to show that if you have Tyros5 do not rush for buying Genos! you still have a great keyboard! However, the arranger applications is not all about the sounds, I see Genos is more advanced and better than TY5 in other aspects such as weight , design, ease of use in live performances, better effects,etc .
I am so glad that Yamaha usually listens to people and noticed that the "Search" feature that I had mentioned in my YouTube Video was added recently to Genos and it is so helpful.(Thank you Yamaha! :)) )
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Your English is as good as the locals here. Where to do you live in Maryland?
Gary 8)
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Nice keyboards there Bluali,
I like the Youtube auto translator's English.
Genos is either Gena's or Genus.
And Tyrus is Titus,Tires or even a Tiger! :D
Nice function though,it helps a lot.
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Your English is as good as the locals here. Where to do you live in Maryland?
Gary 8)
Thanks Gary, I live in North Bethesda .
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Only about 99% disagree with you. Lloyd (owner of a Genos)
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Not a good set up to demonstrating voices. My Genos pianos are much better that they were on Tyros 5 and I think a lot would agree.
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May I suggest creating a midi file of a piano passage that demonstrates all the qualities of playing, higher octave lower octave, sustain, rapid play notes, big chordal passages.
Then set up all keyboards to record to a DAW, setting gain structure and levels to 0db
Then you can record the same passage, then first with headphones, determine your findings,
Then have this playback through your performance speaker, and without moving, listen to them all in the same location, then I think you will actually have a more unbiased and realistic opinion.
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Hi Bluali,
I agree with you 100% but I can understand commercial and lobbyist attitudes :) :)
Over here the Genos doesn't sell at all well which is not so good for the manufacturer and dealers.
It is good for all those who bought a Genos and love it. I am interested to hear some music which
shows the one step ahead of the Tyros.
Cheers
Udo
PS. That reminds me of a great song:
Tyros was my first love ......and it might be my last ;) ;) ;)
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I’ve had the Tyros 4 as well as the keyboards you see in my signature. I’m trying out the Genos... have a good 15 hours plus on it.
The sounds of the styles/voices on the Genos are every bit as good as anything I’ve owned. Truth is, to me, I think they are better than anything I’ve owned.
Love the screen, layout and controls of Genos. There’s not much to dislike on the Genos.
That said, you can listen/read about the Genos, but until you spend some time with it, it’s hard to understand why many owners like it so much.
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i had a chance to try out the Genos a few weeks back at my local dealer and have since decided not to buy it
i really thought the sound was going to be better well far superior to the tyros 5
but like the video above points out the sounds are pretty much the same for the most part
all be it rehashed styles called new styles
im gutted i really wanted to buy the Genos
i will hold on to my tyros 5 and see what comes down the line maybe a Genos 2
i will probably not buy another arranger now though i cant see a Genos 2 being released for a couple of years
i expect the Genos price to come down a fair bit quite quickly over the next few months
i have heard from a good source that sales are not as good as they thought they would be at this point
all the best ash1
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I've sold over 60 in 3 months, much better seller so far than the Tyros 5. The main reason sales are not as good for a lot of stores, it that there is an allocation system, so stores are having a hard time getting Genos in. I am constantly waiting for shipments to send out to customers, when the Tyros 5 was released, there was no problem in getting them in, never a backorder of more than a week or so
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If you like the Tyros 5 then by all means keep it. Different strokes for different folks as they say. The main thing is to enjoy what you play. The musician does make a considerable difference in the grand scheme of things. A skilled musician can make just about any keyboard sound good. Another critical piece of the puzzle is the actual sound system you run the keyboard through. Buying a high-end keyboard is an expensive undertaking although if you run it through a cheap sound system don't blame the keyboard if it doesn't sound all that great. Cables are another piece of the puzzle too. Buy some excellent cables that are highly rated and you might be surprised the difference they can make. With pristine sound and authenticity being the real goal the Genos improves upon the process with 32 bit digital to analog converters which helps the Genos produce a cleaner more pristine sound. The REVO! drum kits are vastly superior to the Tyros 5 drum kits I might add also. Here is a recent video by Peter Baartmans that is an excellent illustration on just how good the Genos can sound in a live setting using a decent setup and a brilliant delivery by the man himself.
Peter Baartmans playing the Genos (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjrIFUMjhnY)
Mike
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I like what Audioworks wrote, I believe he is right on. I also have to go along with Guitpic1, the Genos is probably the best sound arranger I’ve owned. I can never be completely sold watching a You tube video which is the same reason I did not buy a Genos until I played it hands on.
I believe LLoyd E is on to something 99% of the folks who bought them think they are great. I write this not because I have to justify the dollars spent. I’ve got 2 other arrangers, 3 more if you count my CVP 307 in the mix. If I didn’t think the Genos was worth it, it would have been sold already.
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THANKYOU ! bluali
This really confirms my suspicions
There really is no difference between the Tryos 5 and the Genos
regarding sound quality.
I listened with my EYES-SHUT .
90% of Music is usually listened to ON-LINE , via sources like Youtube , & Social Media.
I dont believe the Hype, but i do believe my Ears .
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i had a chance to try out the Genos a few weeks back at my local dealer and have since decided not to buy it
i really thought the sound was going to be better well far superior to the tyros 5
but like the video above points out the sounds are pretty much the same for the most part
Totally Agree !
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You have to play it for yourself and here it live to appreciate the quality of sound. Even my old Tyros 5 registrations sound miles better in Genos.
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I've had my Genos since mid-November. I still have my Tyros 5. I haven't been very aggressive trying to sell it. Was hoping to find a local buyer. It is currently listed on eBay. I play my Genos several times a week. I've had a few interested people over to hear Tyros 5. I hid the Genos (really!!) and hooked up Tyros 5 in its place playing thru the same stereo system I have had for years. The first time I did this I immediately noticed how lackluster the Tyros 5 sounded compared to Genos. I certainly never felt that way before when I only had the Tyros 5. After these demonstrations and these nice folks left I hooked up the Genos and played. I loved my Tyros 5 the entire 3 years I owned it. Now my ears have been delighted by the way Genos sounds. For me, sound quality and voice realism are why I upgrade. Not so much the other new features. I can only dream as to what will follow Genos !! -charley
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You have to play it for yourself and here it live to appreciate the quality of sound. Even my old Tyros 5 registrations sound miles better in Genos.
Agree. I had both the Tyros 5 and Genos side by side and sold the Tyros 5 a week later. All in all, the Genos was a much improved design.
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Agree. I had both the Tyros 5 and Genos side by side and sold the Tyros 5 a week later. All in all, the Genos was a much improved design.
Same here. Sold Tyros5.
GENOS is much much better in all ways.
Very happy with GENOS.
Regards
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Hi friends,
now that we have heard a lot of pros and cons, lets compete with some
great music done with the wonderful options we have.
A great Sunday to all of you, Genos and Tyros lovers :) :)
Udo
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Genos is far better all Round
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All I can say is when I sat and played my T5 Registrations on the Genos I was really impressed, then I played with the new OTS on the Genos and was so impressed I emailed my dealer and told him I didn't need to play his shop one when it arrived to decide if I wanted one or not because I had played one at the Yamaha Weekend and was blown away by it so I wanted the first one he had in stock.
Bill
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I think it’s worth pointing out that some people don’t have very good hearing and are not therefore going to benefit from the greatly improved sound and also if you wear hearing aids they are not any good for music only speech, unless you pay a lot for them.
Graham
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If you use your headphones upside down everything sounds much better :) :)
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I think it’s worth pointing out that some people don’t have very good hearing and are not therefore going to benefit from the greatly improved sound and also if you wear hearing aids they are not any good for music only speech, unless you pay a lot for them.
Graham
My hearing has gone to seed but I can still tell the difference thanks to what I perceive as a big increase in dynamic range.
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The Tyros 5 is boxy sounding compared to the Genos
That is being highly critical
The Genos is much sharper sounding than the Tyros
I reply to Udo about headphones .-------- I could not fathom out when panning a sound on my headphones, the sound came out the opposite side. left would be right and right woul be left.
I sat down thinking ,what is up with these flaming headphones and after a cup of tea I realised you can turn them around on your head.
One of my blond moments ::)
All the Best
John :)
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If you use your headphones upside down everything sounds much better :) :)
I'm gonna have to try that. Kinda the chin strap effect!😁
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That must be the Donald Trump method!!! ;D
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I sat down thinking ,what is up with these flaming headphones and after a cup of tea I realised you can turn them around on your head.
One of my blond moments ::)
LOL For a moment I thought they might be metric! :)
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Hi
Anyone saying the Genos is not the Instrument they thought It was are deluded.
I have the Genos and DXR8's In the home and when you set everyhing up things sound flat and you get a little bewildered.
It is only when you sit down and think about your moves the bigger picture unfolds.
I have made six registrations now and practicing as much as I can.
I am going to take my time over these six registrations and get them to sound as professional as I can for my own satisfaction.
A lot of people compare the Genos with other keyboards and moan, but they have not looked at the real deal here.
I set my sounds up and things were not as I would like them. Some muddy and some toppy etc.
Since I have been experimenting with the eq for each section and all the other little enhancements on my monitors the sounds are very much quality and alive when playing through my DXR8's.
You can get the drums sounding absolutely fantastic and the styles plus your Instruments.
The Tyros 5 is not a patch on the Genos even if there are a few bugs which I hear will be sorted out on the 25th of this month.
Well, since I have been having a fiddle I have not looked back.
A bit of loving care with the Genos and It is a Genius
Big tip** do not bother with the Genos speakers at £300. Get those DXR8's for a £1000 and never look back. Once tuned In they blow your mind for quality.
Change the Genos three times and the DXR 8's will pay for themselves and last a lifetime.
Well mine anyway at 67. I will have to get some flying lessons In or I'm going down!! ;D
I can also keep my spirits up with a slug of red eye!!
All the Best
John
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I think it's a bit of an exaggeration for anyone to say that Tyros 5 is lacklustre compared to a Genos, and I reckon those who say Genos is twice as good as T5 are talking utter nonsense! Far more credible to me is the assessment of those who say that Genos is marginally better in some respects, and openly admit that T5 is still quite a decent piece of kit. Sometimes I will get a bad day, and whatever I try to do on my T5/76 doesn’t sound right at all. I will then sit and watch a few of Peter Baartman’s video demos of T5, and will immediately be reassured that I own one of the best keyboards there is… and that any temporary misgivings are just down to my inability to get the best out of it!
During Tyros 4's reign as Yamaha's flagship keyboard, I happened to get into a very interesting discussion with a very knowledgeable person in the field of electronic keyboard instruments. He predicted that the Tyros line would soon come to an end to make way for a completely new design, and a new name. Well, we all knew that that would happen one day soon anyway, but he went further by saying that most of Tyros' innards, including many of its styles (revamped, of course) and other features, would probably be transplanted into the new machine. The main reason for that, he said, was down to the fact that top end keyboards have already reached such a high level of excellence that any major (or ground-breaking) improvements in sound quality from one model to the next is extremely difficult to achieve. Another interesting thing he said was that it's natural that folk who trade up to a newer model will want to reassure themselves that they did the right thing. In fact, they will so much want their latest purchase to be the best yet, that they will gradually convince themselves that they can actually hear vast improvements when, in reality, such imagined improvements hardly exist at all! And whatever improvements that do exist are often the result of tweaked effects and other settings. Like I said, that conversation took place way back in the days of T4. Oh, and I didn't tell you what the chap did (and still does) for a living did I? Well, he happens to be one of Yamaha's main dealers… but he obviously can't be named here.
Kind regards,
Will
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i am one of those people who thought the Genos sounded better
but when i got the chance to try the Genos a few weeks back i could hear no difference
the sounds were just the same as the Tyros 5
all the best ash1
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:D There are a couple of users which exaggerating about sound of Genos, telling us its sound is "miles over Tyros 5" ;D ;D
No way... It is better, indeed, improved, compared to Tyros 5, but not so "miles over" :D
I think your Bose system does not cover all frequencies and for that the sound of Tyros 5 seems the same as Genos. It is not, I tell you ;) !
Regards,
Vali
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No problems friends ,
we can talk and talk...........
I have my own thoughts ::) ::) ::)
The sales figures will tell how good the Genos is !!
A nice day to all of you
Udo
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The sales figures will tell how good the Genos is !!
No, it won't tell anything about how good the Genos is, but how many they manage sell. ;)
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The sales figures will tell how good the Genos is !!
Hi Udo, It’s obviously good to see that Genos is doing so well. But I think the totally new design has something to do with it as well. Granted, not entirely but it has obviously helped boost sales.
By the time Tyros 5 appeared, it even looked more or less identical to the previous models… all four of them! By that time, some people may have started to yawn, and feel a bit bored with the ‘same old, same old’ look. Enter the Genos… a whole new design, different colour, touch screen, the lot! The punters immediately came out of their semi-hibernation… “now this IS different, it looks totally different, it’s the very latest, it’s unbelievably expensive… so it just HAS to be the best ever”!
I’m sure that if Yamaha had put all of the Genos inside the old casing of the Tyros range, and called it Tyros 6, the sales figures wouldn’t be even close to what they are now! ;)
Regards,
Will
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Hi Gunnar,
Hi Will,
I agree with you !! But sales figures means for at least 4 years !!
I’ve talked to music friends over here who say : apart from the touch screen
nothing new and compared with Tyros is looks cheap which is probably
a matter of taste.
Don’t underestimate a power of the neighbour to neighbour talk and they don’t
want to sell that thing only for 12 month ???
As Will said , a new product causes often a so called Snob Appeal effect but that doesn’t mean anything.
I’ve prepared a Tyros – Genos challenge based on some instrumental songs.
With the Tyros Audio recording and the Genos Audio recording everybody could
hear if there is a difference or not.
I dropped that idea cause I do not want any further going harsh “discussion” about that subject.
In the first place and after all that talk about the brilliance of the Genos I wanted
to buy one. After I’ve seen , played and heard it I decided against it.
Nevertheless, congratulations to all the new Genos owners !! :) :) :)
Enjoy your new toy and send us some nice, convincing songs !! :) :) :)
A nice and sunny day (as it is over here) to all of you
Udo
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I must admit that I was a little disappointed when I saw Genos was black as having had the Tyros 1,2,3,4,and5 had gotten used to the silver colour and thought of the old keyboards I had had in black that showed up all the marks and went shinny on the parts you used a lot. Having a touch screen which I did not really want and realising it was fixed I approached with caution. Once I heard it, all the above did not matter
I was sold on what I was hearing and just OTS being used to demonstrate.
On getting it home the first thing I did was load in one of my favorite Tyros 5 registrations and just could not believe my ears. The sound was so much clearer and the bass from the style was vastly improved and much nicer to the ear. Don't get me wrong as I had loved my Tyros 5 and still think it is a great keyboard but there is a big difference between the two. OK there is a new learning curve with touch screen but once used to it you realise that in a lot of cases it is quicker to use and set up. For those who used the MF the playlist is a vast improvement over that and is very versatile in allowing you to set up your own Set Lists with everything you want to use saved along with it.
Having the 76 note keyboard it is so much better when setting up split points for the Left and right three parts. More space to do this now.
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:D ..I think your Bose system does not cover all frequencies and for that the sound of Tyros 5 seems the same as Genos. It is not, I tell you ;)
FYI I have combined the QSC K12.2 Speaker with the Bose L1/B2 (model2) to cover all range of audio frequencies!
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Hi Gunnar,
Hi Will,
I agree with you !! But sales figures means for at least 4 years !!
I’ve talked to music friends over here who say : apart from the touch screen
nothing new and compared with Tyros is looks cheap which is probably
a matter of taste.....
Coming the route via several brands during the years when I did jump to the T4, the one and only Yamaha model I have owned till now.
I have to say, when handle it, I feel that Genos are a kind of 'light weight & cheep plastic fantastic' built. That feeling don't make me think it justifies the hight price level at all.
But in my eyes it looks good, touchscreen and updated OS is nice stuff, and it do in fact sound a bit better than T4 right out of the box. Also it is very good to play, keys feel good and fit my taste.
Some new features that probably never will be used by common home users, and if I may say so, bottom line is that Genos is a 'New Tyros in disguise'. ;)
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Coming the route via several brands during the years when I did jump to the T4, the one and only Yamaha model I have owned till now.
I have to say, when handle it, I feel that Genos are a kind of 'light weight & cheep plastic fantastic' built. That feeling don't make me think it justifies the hight price level at all.
But in my eyes it looks good, touchscreen and updated OS is nice stuff, and it do in fact sound a bit better than T4 right out of the box. Also it is very good to play, keys feel good and fit my taste.
Some new features that probably never will be used by common home users, and if I may say so, bottom line is that Genos is a 'New Tyros in disguise'. ;)
One of the big reasons I bought the Genos is because of the "light weight". A Tyros is tough to cart around. The Genos, even with 76 keys, is so much easier.
Fred
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One of the big reasons I bought the Genos is because of the "light weight". A Tyros is tough to cart around. The Genos, even with 76 keys, is so much easier.
Fred
Yes, and I don't think it's made of cheap plastic either. It feels like some type of plastic resin hybrid material. Very lightweight and yet strong. Nicely done, IMHO.
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Don't get me wrong as I had loved my Tyros 5 and still think it is a great keyboard but there is a big difference between the two.
Hello Eileen,
I think it must be quite a while since I last responded directly to any of your posts… hope you are keeping well!
Well, I salute you for your honesty! Coming from you, that remark alone is worth a million posts on the matter as there are several Genos owners who seem intent on putting the T5 down by basically claiming that Genos is twice better – which, of course, is a technological impossibility!! What I am prepared to accept from reading the myriad of posts here though (until I get to try a Genos for myself) is that the overall sound may indeed be clearer and (as you just put it) “…nicer to the ear”. After all, it comes from Yamaha and follows 5 levels of Tyros so it just has to be a decent keyboard… but not ahead of T5 by the unrealistic amount that some seem to claim! You also mention your initial reservations concerning the black finish. I understand exactly how you must have felt as all my previous black keyboards showed up every bit of dust and turned shiny around some of the most frequently used buttons… but no such problems with any of the Tyroses though.
By the way, you also mention the advantage of having 76 keys (and I agree), but I always thought your Tyros 5 was the 76 note version… perhaps I got it wrong? Anyhow, glad to see that you are getting to grips with the new learning curve, and that you are enjoying your Genos!
Best regards,
Will
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........and I reckon those who say Genos is twice as good as T5 are talking utter nonsense! Far more credible to me is the assessment of those who say that Genos is marginally better in some respects, and openly admit that T5 is still quite a decent piece of kit.
.............but he went further by saying that most of Tyros' innards, including many of its styles (revamped, of course) and other features, would probably be transplanted into the new machine. The main reason for that, he said, was down to the fact that top end keyboards have already reached such a high level of excellence that any major .....improvements in sound quality from one model to the next is extremely difficult to achieve.
Another interesting thing he said was that it's natural that folk who trade up to a newer model will want to reassure themselves that they did the right thing. In fact, they will so much want their latest purchase to be the best yet, that they will gradually convince themselves that they can actually hear vast improvements when, in reality, such imagined improvements hardly exist at all! And whatever improvements that do exist are often the result of tweaked effects and other settings. Like I said, that conversation took place way back in the days of T4. Oh, and I didn't tell you what the chap did (and still does) for a living did I? Well, he happens to be one of Yamaha's main dealers… but he obviously can't be named here.
Kind regards,
Will
Dear Will, thanks for an excellent post, a post I have actually been yearning for. What you say reminds me of HI-FI magazine tests of super - expensive cables that claim to be unidirectional, e.g. one must make the connection correctly out to in. And invariably some people write in that they can hear the difference ;D. I happen to have both my "old" Tyros 5/6 and the new Genos standing in my recording studio both hooked up to the same output system simultaniously. The only apparent difference are the drums. And I am glad Genos got rid of the non transferable audio drums which can only be copied to the user drive which is a dwarf. They are nice drums, but only 1 in 50 of my friends was able to say when the style was using the acoustic drums, maybe because I never like some younger people turn up the drums to 90 dB. If there otherwise is any difference sound-wise it is of a magnitude that has no importance whatsoever when you are playing in a place where people are for instance just dancing without even saying a word. If someone dares open his mouth any difference is illusionary. What really makes me sad is that all the bugs the Genos has - my Tyros had plenty of them and it took a long row of updates to finally get rid of them - are not mentioned by so many posters. If this were a political forum I would suspect they are trolls, but as this is not a political forum it must just be that they have a so far gathered a very limited knowledge (My Genos finally arrived yesterday, it is fantastic) or have a very strong reason to praise the new YAMAHA child. Mine has so many bugs that the boss of the YAMAHA department of the importer has been kind enough to make an appointment to come and go through all the problems I have listed. He must be aware of there being bugs. Otherwise he would not spend his time with me, just send another Genos. I went to 2 gigs with the Genos instead of the Tyros as I firmly believe you can only really test an instrument in a live situation just like you need to drive a car in heavy traffic to see whether it is better than the previous model. (Range Rover claimed I would due to a much lower cabin noise level be far happier with the new model and took me for a ride. I was sneaky enough to have a very precise noise meter with me. The new model was actually 2 dB louder than my old Range Rover) The Genos froze several times, it did revert to default on many programmed settings, just to name a few things. YAMAHA Scandinavia has confirmed that registration banks can not be transferred from Tyros to Genos at this time, which seems logical as the addresses the buttons must call up are not equivalent. Nevertheless some people on forums claim all you have to do is put a USB stick into your Tyros, copy the registration banks and put the USB stick into your Genos, Either they know something YAMAHA does not know or make false claims. What makes me a little weary is that these things are posted by people who are Genos vendors.
Kaarlo von Freymann Helsinki Finland
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As I have mentioned before Tyros 5 registrations work fine in Genos. The thing to remember is that if you have used third party styles unless you copy them by first creating a back up of your Tyros 5 hard drive to computer and then copy these files onto the root directory of a USB stick the registrations will not find the links. This USB stick must be first one put into the keyboard and read USB1. Most of us put this stick into the underneath USB port. You will also need to put your extra playlist from Yamaha onto this stick for them to work properly.
Have you updated your OS to 1.10.
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Nevertheless some people on forums claim all you have to do is put a USB stick into your Tyros, copy the registration banks and put the USB stick into your Genos, Either they know something YAMAHA does not know or make false claims. What makes me a little weary is that these things are posted by people who are Genos vendors.
That's all I had to do. Had my Genos working with all my Tyros registrations within 15 minutes of turning on the Genos.
You're better off asking for help rather than saying that people who have actually done something don't know what they are talking about. You don't make very many friends that way.
To add to what Eileen said, you need to upgrade to OS version 1.10 before you do anything.
Fred
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Dear Will, thanks for an excellent post, a post I have actually been yearning for. What you say reminds me of HI-FI magazine tests of super - expensive cables that claim to be unidirectional, e.g. one must make the connection correctly out to in. And invariably some people write in that they can hear the difference ;D. I happen to have both my "old" Tyros 5/6 and the new Genos standing in my recording studio both hooked up to the same output system simultaniously. The only apparent difference are the drums. And I am glad Genos got rid of the non transferable audio drums which can only be copied to the user drive which is a dwarf. They are nice drums, but only 1 in 50 of my friends was able to say when the style was using the acoustic drums, maybe because I never like some younger people turn up the drums to 90 dB. If there otherwise is any difference sound-wise it is of a magnitude that has no importance whatsoever when you are playing in a place where people are for instance just dancing without even saying a word. If someone dares open his mouth any difference is illusionary. What really makes me sad is that all the bugs the Genos has - my Tyros had plenty of them and it took a long row of updates to finally get rid of them - are not mentioned by so many posters. If this were a political forum I would suspect they are trolls, but as this is not a political forum it must just be that they have a so far gathered a very limited knowledge (My Genos finally arrived yesterday, it is fantastic) or have a very strong reason to praise the new YAMAHA child. Mine has so many bugs that the boss of the YAMAHA department of the importer has been kind enough to make an appointment to come and go through all the problems I have listed. He must be aware of there being bugs. Otherwise he would not spend his time with me, just send another Genos. I went to 2 gigs with the Genos instead of the Tyros as I firmly believe you can only really test an instrument in a live situation just like you need to drive a car in heavy traffic to see whether it is better than the previous model. (Range Rover claimed I would due to a much lower cabin noise level be far happier with the new model and took me for a ride. I was sneaky enough to have a very precise noise meter with me. The new model was actually 2 dB louder than my old Range Rover) The Genos froze several times, it did revert to default on many programmed settings, just to name a few things. YAMAHA Scandinavia has confirmed that registration banks can not be transferred from Tyros to Genos at this time, which seems logical as the addresses the buttons must call up are not equivalent. Nevertheless some people on forums claim all you have to do is put a USB stick into your Tyros, copy the registration banks and put the USB stick into your Genos, Either they know something YAMAHA does not know or make false claims. What makes me a little weary is that these things are posted by people who are Genos vendors.
Kaarlo von Freymann Helsinki Finland
Sorry but you are incorrect. My Tyros 5 registrations (almost 700 of them) all work just fine on Genos. I play them every day and I'm using one of my two Genos keyboards in a live band. Haven't had any lockups.
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Sorry but you are incorrect. My Tyros 5 registrations (almost 700 of them) all work just fine on Genos. I play them every day and I'm using one of my two Genos keyboards in a live band. Haven't had any lockups.
Sorry, but you are incorrect, too :) I don't know what are you saved in your registrations on Tyros 5, but I have had some issues with my Tyros5 registrations loaded in Genos, as some of Delay DSP has Feedback parameter over the maximum value accepted, or other issues, like Distortion DSP on guitar as on Tyros 5 I had Chorus DSP, etc...
Regards,
Vali
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Well one expects to have to do some resetting of Tyros 5 registration banks anyway so no big deal. I have not had any problem with mine as yet.
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It has always been the case that styles, registrations etc are largely transferrable between arranger models in the PSR /Tyros range, but sometimes need tweaking. That is why people devised conversion software, and even after using the conversion they may still not be exact. This is because there are differences in styles and voices, and all the registration can do is pick the nearest thing. For example, even if Yamaha have not made big change to a voice, they might have tweaked some parameters between models, and his applies also to voices used in the style. So when people say they can transfer they don't necessarily mean they are exactly the same in every case, or that they worked without a little tweaking here and there, because they really cannot be. I wouldn't call this a bug.
Mike
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Sorry, but you are incorrect, too :) I don't know what are you saved in your registrations on Tyros 5, but I have had some issues with my Tyros5 registrations loaded in Genos, as some of Delay DSP has Feedback parameter over the maximum value accepted, or other issues, like Distortion DSP on guitar as on Tyros 5 I had Chorus DSP, etc...
Regards,
Vali
Ok, fair point😁. Guess I've been fortunate and haven't noticed any irregularities so far but that doesn't mean there aren't any. I suspect most of the translation errors between Tyros 5 and Genos will get fixed and if they don't you'll be there to let them know! 😲😁
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No it is not a BUG. I think that word has been to freely used without exploring the keyboard and how it works.
Yes there are a few glitches which will be fixed as time goes on. These certainly do not stop you enjoying this keyboard and doing a little tweaking to suit individual tastes. That is all part of the fun.
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The only problem I found with a couple of my Registrations from my Tyros 5 was a wrong drum set was chosen and it gave either a strange noise instead of a drum set sound or there was a loud thud instead of a base drum (I think) a friend also experienced this. However the majority of my Registrations worked with either very little alteration or no alteration, I would say over 98% of them were fine, so if you found a lot of problems Kaarlo von Freymann, I can only think you have either not updated the OS or there is something wrong with just your Genos, as nearly everyone else, like me, have had only minor problems with their Registrations off their Tyros 5.
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It has always been the case that styles, registrations etc are largely transferrable between arranger models in the PSR /Tyros range, but sometimes need tweaking. That is why people devised conversion software, and even after using the conversion they may still not be exact. This is because there are differences in styles and voices, and all the registration can do is pick the nearest thing. For example, even if Yamaha have not made big change to a voice, they might have tweaked some parameters between models, and his applies also to voices used in the style. So when people say they can transfer they don't necessarily mean they are exactly the same in every case, or that they worked without a little tweaking here and there, because they really cannot be. I wouldn't call this a bug.
Mike
Mike, in my oppinion, Tyros 5 registrations are not fully compatible with Genos. There are issues Yamaha must solve them. Or at least make them convertable from YEM.
A file which is not loaded due system incompatibilities is understandable, but a file which load and some parameters are not loaded correctly, IMO represent a bug. ;) Which, definitelly, has to be informed to Yamaha and solved ;)
Do Not bypass any issue, provide those aspects to Yamaha. They don't know till we inform them ;)
Regards,
Vali
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The only problem I found with a couple of my Registrations from my Tyros 5 was a wrong drum set was chosen and it gave either a strange noise instead of a drum set sound or there was a loud thud instead of a base drum (I think) a friend also experienced this. However the majority of my Registrations worked with either very little alteration or no alteration, I would say over 98% of them were fine, so if you found a lot of problems Kaarlo von Freymann, I can only think you have either not updated the OS or there is something wrong with just your Genos, as nearly everyone else, like me, have had only minor problems with their Registrations off their Tyros 5.
Thank you all VERY MUCH for dealing with my issues. Naturally I do sincerely appreciate any help very much. Looking for help is the reason why I, and I think all others go to forums. (I am on quite a few that do not deal with music as I am not making my living by playing but by designing military drones) BTW I do have 1.10 installed.
In case it is a problem that dozens of style I have on the TYROS 5/6 and work well there are neither a TYROS style nor originally even a YAMAHA style but for example converted from Technics, (Some Technics 6000 styles are very good) then that might explain part of my problems.
In case I have other problems no one else has like for instance
- the pitch bender range and fade in fade out not staying where they were set e.g. resetting to something else after power
being cycled,
- only my Genos sometimes freezes like my PCs do every once in a while and must be switched off and on again
then Bud 2's conclusion that "there is something wrong with just my Genos" seems pretty conclusive. As a fact no-one else has reported these problems on this forum. Will copy these posts and hand them to the Yamaha Importer's representative to-morrow, and post anything interesting that turns up.
Kaarlo von Freymann Helsinki Finland
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I think it’s worth pointing out that some people don’t have very good hearing and are not therefore going to benefit from the greatly improved sound and also if you wear hearing aids they are not any good for music only speech, unless you pay a lot for them.
Graham
Dear Graham,
How right you are, my sister has that problem. Even her 6.000 $ hearing aid is reasonably good only for speech, no hearing aid works well for music. That's why we should all use noise canceling in ear monitoring on gigs in order to keep the level low to save our hearing. I am 83 and all my EQ settings are still the same as they were 10 years ago, but different from what they were 20 years ago. More trebble. But to be honest I cannot appreciate the "huge difference" in sound quality people claim there is between Tyros and Genos. But "huge" has different meanings, Mr. Trump has taught us that.
Kaarlo
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Thank you all VERY MUCH for dealing with my issues. Naturally I do sincerely appreciate any help very much. Looking for help is the reason why I, and I think all others go to forums. (I am on quite a few that do not deal with music as I am not making my living by playing but by designing military drones) BTW I do have 1.10 installed.
In case it is a problem that dozens of style I have on the TYROS 5/6 and work well there are neither a TYROS style nor originally even a YAMAHA style but for example converted from Technics, (Some Technics 6000 styles are very good) then that might explain part of my problems.
In case I have other problems no one else has like for instance
- the pitch bender range and fade in fade out not staying where they were set e.g. resetting to something else after power
being cycled,
- only my Genos sometimes freezes like my PCs do every once in a while and must be switched off and on again
The bugs you have identified are a long way from your statement "YAMAHA Scandinavia has confirmed that registration banks can not be transferred from Tyros to Genos at this time"
When you make statements like that, you are going to get the responses you did. Had you identified these bugs in your initial post, you would have saved us all a lot of time.
Fred
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The bugs you have identified are a long way from your statement "YAMAHA Scandinavia has confirmed that registration banks can not be transferred from Tyros to Genos at this time"
When you make statements like that, you are going to get the responses you did. Had you identified these bugs in your initial post, you would have saved us all a lot of time.
Fred
Sorry Fred,
as a fact the reason why many Tyros owners in Germany and some here in Finland were not able to convert reg.banks has been sorted out. (Eileen helped) A Tyros site in Germany years ago recommended making 4 partitions on the HD, which helped structuring the content and actually worked well for us through all the Tyros models. Now with Genos that became a problem for those who did that. As an example: every style on partition 1, every midi file on partition 2.
It is not possible to transfer the regs. if you have this setup. You can get around that by copying all styles and registrations to the user drive on Tyros, but for most users that is not possible due to the fact that the user drive on Tyros is too small to accept all the styles many (me included) had on HD partition 1. So ironically both those who on German sites claimed they could not do the trick and those here and on German sites who said they were able to do it were telling the truth. Yamaha Scandinavia, who did confirm to the Finnish importer that there was a problem probably had this information from Germany. So now we who have the problem know what the reason for the problem is and that it will not be solved with the next upgrade. As to the many other problems the manager of the importer's keyboard department was kind enough to spend 3 hours with me and is sorting out what are known bugs ans which are just present on my Genos.
Kind regards
Kaarlo
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Here is a recent video by Peter Baartmans that is an excellent illustration on just how good the Genos can sound in a live setting using a decent setup and a brilliant delivery by the man himself.
Peter Baartmans playing the Genos (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjrIFUMjhnY)
Mike
Hello Mike.
Keep in mind that Peter Baartmanns is supported by an entire
organisation that makes sure that he sounds as good as possible.
I have read many praises of Peter Baartmanns, and I'm sure
that some are indeed well deserved.
I personally am not very impressed by the man, and know
quite a few struggling musicians who can run rings around him.
Please note that Blueali used the same sound equipment
for both keyboards in the demo.
The Genos may sound better in some cases, but it is not the huge leap
for mankind that some may insist it is.
That is my understanding of what Blueali is trying to say.
Best Regards.
Pianoman.
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I have from the beginning a lot of problems with my T5 registrations , i made them new on the Genos ( os 1.10) all my files are on the User drive . after update 1.20
there are now a lot of registrations ( made on Genos) that dont work anymore .
When i select the registration you can see the right style in Register bank info ( see picture) , but i doesnt play the selected style ?
I wrote several times to Yamaha , they answer that the complexity of the machine can give some problems and they hope there comes a solution ?
I have after update 1.20 more problems than before , and a lot of "hick-ups" (switching between registration about 30 seconds, or freezzing up while editing .
Because the fine sound of the Genos , i want to keep it . But after struggling fore 4 months , my patience is almost gone .
Soryt 8)
[attachment deleted by admin]
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I think the video is kind of misleading..
Due to bad sound quallity, it wants to make people believe the Tyros 5 sounds better and more authentic.
I compared these 3 keyboards for 2 whole days...
And when you take the main piano sound, the Genos and Pa4x are quite. Alot above the T5
When you add dsp, Genos definately can archieve the best sound.
When you compare the new sounds of the Genos, to the sounds that are also in the T5, You can also hear a difference, many of the newer sounds are more dynamic. And when you start using dsp, you can aleviate the sound of the Genos even more..
What often happens after playing an instrument for years, is that your ears get used to the sound, and the sound you used for so long will have become your prefference.
Also many of the older sounds still use exactly the same samples, and are identical in both instruments, but as said, the Genos dsp can lift the sound more then the T5 dsp. Just because of the simple,fact that the Genos has more dsp power. Keep in mind that dsp often gives the best natural results when you use it in small subtle amounts..
That to say, is that you can make the Genos sound exactly like the T5, but you can not make the T5 sound like the Genos.
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....... What often happens after playing an instrument for years, is that your ears get used to the sound, and the sound you used for so long will have become your prefference. .. ..
....... That to say, is that you can make the Genos sound exactly like the T5, but you can not make the T5 sound like the Genos.
You're right, but also our hearing going through changes during the years, it's just like the rest of the body, it goes 'downhillh'.. ::)
Very few, if any, have the same frequency specter during the lifetime.
If the goal is to make Genos sound like or be a T5 or T4 'twin', it's probably a better solution to keep what you have.
Myself, so far I don't regret a single second that I bought Genos, simply love it more for each day I sit down to play it. ;D 8)
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Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest.
From " The Boxer " by Simon And Garfunkel.
Best Regards.
Pianoman.
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I have met and listened to Baartmans in Orlando Florida at a workshop for the Clavinova CVP-709 the man has got plenty of talent. Part of what his job is "selling the sizzle, not the steak," as the adage reads.
Sizzle not the steak? "This sales phrase was coined by Elmer Wheeler in the mid-1920s. It urged salespeople to focus on the experience around a product being sold rather than simply on the object itself. It means appealing to the senses and emotions of the buyer with the assumption that this is what motivates most people to purchase."
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I have read many praises of Peter Baartmanns, and I'm sure
that some are indeed well deserved.
Best Regards.
Pianoman.
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I agree 100 % with Eileen, my Genos sounds AMAZING, I still have the T5, is waiting for the next owner, and to repeat, even the registrations from my T5 sound better in the Genos.
I am not sure if the people that cant hear the difference, did they selected the NEW CFX Concert piano.....sounds totally different, and the Ensambles are amazing too....,etc....the new Styles, and some of the old ones have been re-touched/fine tuned, the new S.A.2 Voices, etc.
Way to many differences....if you really know how to use the Tyros 5. Having said that:
I know that Genos may NOT be for everyone....like not everybody drives only Jaguar, Toyota, VW, etc....that is why we have other choices.
My 2 cents.
Manuel
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I have from the beginning a lot of problems with my T5 registrations , i made them new on the Genos ( os 1.10) all my files are on the User drive . after update 1.20
there are now a lot of registrations ( made on Genos) that dont work anymore .
When i select the registration you can see the right style in Register bank info ( see picture) , but i doesnt play the selected style ?
I wrote several times to Yamaha , they answer that the complexity of the machine can give some problems and they hope there comes a solution ?
I have after update 1.20 more problems than before , and a lot of "hick-ups" (switching between registration about 30 seconds, or freezzing up while editing .
Because the fine sound of the Genos , i want to keep it . But after struggling fore 4 months , my patience is almost gone .
Soryt 8)
I am too told to keep my act together, just saw this posting you made. The photos of the bank information show EXACTLY the problems I have. I offered to send photos but Fred and Eileen, who say they have no problems whatsoever, but they said photos are of no help so now I have sent the corrupted files. I am looking forward to their comments.
Cheers
Kaarlo
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Where are the files. I have not seen them here.
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I guess I look at this a bit differently than most. When I upgrade to a new keyboard, which I did many, many times, I rarely transferred my registrations. The reason I didn't was the same reason I upgraded - I wanted new and better sounds - not the same sounds I was hearing with the older keyboard. I, like many, had lots of registrations, but in nearly every instance, the new keyboard had some vastly new and improved sounds and voices that made that same song sound so much better. Consequently, it usually took me from 3 to 4 months of working with the new keyboard to create the NEW registrations and Music Finder Directory. About the only reason I would transfer the registrations is so I could go back into each and every one of them and edit every aspect of it. For me, this has always been a non-issue.
Good luck, explore that NEW keyboard, be creative, and you will discover a whole, new world,
Gary 8)
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Well said Gary,
That is exactly how I see it and do it.
I am usually done setting everything up in 2 month or so, but keep tweaking it for several month as I get more and more familiar with a new KB
Eric
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I have loaded some of my Tyros 5 registrations into Genos and believe me they sound great. Also some of the Genos voices are picked up but sound much richer. I am well pleased.
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I totally agree Eileen, I took my Genos to our sons over Christmas and New year, I had not had chance to do many new Registrations before we went so the majority of the Registrations I used were the ones from my Tyros 5 and they definitely sounded so much better, even our son and his wife said the same. I just can't understand why so many people are saying they are not happy with the Genos. Yes things are slightly different and to get to things again are different but surely this is to be expected with a new keyboard. You just have to take your time and see how to do things.
Bill
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Yes Bill,
There are a lot of people that are more than happy with Genos and with using previous keyboard registrations. Trouble is I think a lot that complain do not even have Genos.
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Well if that's the case Eileen how can they make any real judgments, you surely need to have one for a while before you can make any true comparisons or comments. I must admit though I was very impressed when I heard it in the room where we could get our hands on it at the Yamaha Weekend, even before I sat down to have a good look and a quick play of a couple of tunes, despite only hearing it then through headphones.
As I have said on a thread I created, the only slight disappointment was the fact that when the sliders are set to drawbars there is quite a lot of movement before the numbers change on the screen, if they reacted almost immediately the range of movement of the sliders wouldn't be far off the length of the real thing.
Bill
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Yes Bill,
There are a lot of people that are more than happy with Genos and with using previous keyboard registrations. Trouble is I think a lot that complain do not even have Genos.
I am more than happy with Genos. All my registrations from Tyros5 working perfectly with NO problems. Most of my registrations are created from Custom voices/drums/styles/ pads/midi files and working perfectly.
Also because there is a loot of space in Genos RAM I loaded custom sets even from Tyros2 and Tyros3 and goes what?: EVERYTHING WORKING PERFECTLY.
SO........
Regards.
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Yes I think most of us have found that if we copied registrations correctly they are all working on Genos with no problem. Yamaha have come up trumps again with this one.
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As I have stated on other threads, registrations are very powerful, yet simple tools in your keyboard. They will only do exactly what you tell the to do - nothing more, nothing less. Anyone that is having registration problems should go to the lessons section of the forum and read the lessons that Fred and I posted several years ago. This will clear up any problems they may be encountering. Here's a link to the one I wrote many years ago. https://www.psrtutorial.com/lessons/playing/regist/10regGD.html
Registrations cannot be corrupted. However, files they are linked to, third-party style files and midi files, can be corrupted. But the registration itself cannot be corrupted.
Hope this helps,
Gary 8)
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Finally I got my Genos and I did a very brief comparison with my Tyros5 Keyboard. I was surprised that the main Sounds are all the same on both keyboards. However I like the Genos design and light weight. Overall if you have Tyros5, don't rush! I could not find a big difference sound-wise. To me, Genos is like re-packaging of Tyros5 with different look and feel. I recorded my comparison with an iphone camera and shared it on YouTube ( https://youtu.be/4U8S28tz3Mg (https://youtu.be/4U8S28tz3Mg) ). I apologize for my poor English speaking. I hope the video helps.
When you say Geno's was not the big progress for you, obviously nobody can disagree with you. In that case, it would be to overestimate your own experience ..
But many others certainly have opposite experiences.
Best Regards Ingar
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When you say Geno's was not the big progress for you, obviously nobody can disagree with you. In that case, it would be to overestimate your own experience ..
But many others certainly have opposite experiences.
Best Regards Ingar
I agree. Actually, in my opinion Genos is the best Yamaha arranger so far and Tyros5 is also very close to Genos. Obviously those who have had keyboards such as Korg, PSR series or even TY3/4, they can be very impressed by Genos (and Tyros5). As a mater of fact in main sounds such as Piano and Guitar and Violin, etc, there is not a huge differences between Genos and Tyros5. What I meant in my post to show that if you have Tyros 5 do not rush for buying Genos! you still have a great keyboard! However, the arranger applications is not all about the sounds, I see Genos is more advanced and better than TY5 in other aspects such as weight , design, ease of use in live performances, better effects,etc . I am so glad that Yamaha usually listens to people and noticed that the "Search" feature that I had mentioned in my YouTube Video was added recently to Genos and it is so helpful.(Thank you Yamaha! :))